Help! I can't slow em down

I think the time frame for 50z TMCC issues is around 2000-2004. This is way before Jon Z./Mike R started at Lionel.

Maybe it's a urban myth but I heard when Jon started

at Lionel he found a drawer full of letters from customers complaining about 50Hz problems!

There were 3 Lionel 50Hz issues.

1) The CW-80. Well known random/continuous whistle/bell sounds. Now fixed with QC50-OK marked model.

2)TrainSounds, again random/continuous whistle/bell sounds. I don't know if this was ever fixed but Lionel have started using Railsounds ready to run so I would expect this to be 50Hz compatible as Jon Z. is up to speed on 50Hz.

3) TMCC locos from certain time frame. Tend to shoot off uncontrolably.

I think Albracht from Germany has got around this by striping out the R2LC and replacing them with R4LC not sure on the details.

I attacked this from the other end by changing the power frequency.

I use a 60Hz Pure Sine Inverter. 

My set up is as follows.

230V 50Hz to 12V DC 1000W Power supply to 12V DC to 120V AC 60Hz 1500W Pure sine inverter. (I can only use 1000W of the inverters power as that is limited by the 12V power source.) 1500W units are available but there is a cost factor.

Thus I have the same quality (or better) than US mains power.

The real problem is that no one has explained to me what causes the TMCC 50Hz issue with certain locos. My guess is it is certain R2LC board versions. Maybe Jon could chime in and explain??.

So at least we could open up a TMCC loco and check it before trying it and it taking off at top speed for the horizon!

Kind Regards

Nick

Thanks Nick.  It sounds as though the 50Hz problem may be the one that Dave is suffering from.  I can confirm that Trainsounds is still a problem.  I bought a new locomotive earlier this year with Trainsounds, and on 50Hz power the bell and whistle sound continuously. I too can obviate this by running on 60Hz power through a pure-sine  inverter, but only up to about 120W per circuit as my 12v supplies are only 10A.  It's a real pain in the posterior though.

You know, I didn't notice the Odyssey right on the front page!   I wonder who proofread that manual!

Now I see why you thought it had Odyssey.

I agree, I think the 50hz is the problem.

I originally started with a couple of CW80's, they were terrible.

I also bought a Trainsounds tender for my Polar Express, did't work.

So, I guess it's only reasonable to experience a couple of dud TMCC locos.

When I get stock, I will replace both boards with new ERR replacements.

I hope Lionel stay on top of this issue from now on, they must remember that their customers are not just in America and Canada.

Hi Dave, Please let's us know how you get on. 

 We tried to capture a TMCC loco acting up on video at the Lionel Colletors Club UK show this year. Sods law it worked fine! This engine was from 2000. First time I had used Legacy on 50Hz. When I got home I got out my old TMCC set and tried the same loco on TMCC on 50Hz. Bingo it ran away. 

My only other thought is that here in the UK we use a ring main system in house wiring.

 This was brought in after WW2 as it saved on wire. I don't know if Aus uses rings or radial? I know the UK is pretty unique in using this system. 

Maybe this also causes a issue? Electromagnetic interferiance? 

Needs looking at by someone with more electrical knowledge than I.

Regards

Nick

Interesting comment Nick, I have a TMCC and Cab1. I'll try it out of interest.

Regarding ring mains, I am familiar with them, I rewired my brother inlaw's house in England many years ago. We don't wire that way here, I think it's a good system, but it would not have any EM effect over what a conventionally wired building would have.

I forgot to say to you earlier, I wouldn't go down the 60hz inverter path, I prefer to use stuff that is 50hz compatible and support those manufacturers. I prefer to lobby manufacturers to adopt the practice of offering compatible products to the world market.

Dave, I think that Lionel have woken up to the fact that there is intelligent train loving life outside of the USA now.  Most recent new products are 50Hz friendly, or carry a warning if they are not. Hopefully this will continue until all frequency-sensitive products have been replaced/upgraded to multi-frequency standards. Multi-voltage would be nice as well, but that's not so much of a problem as a decent toroidal transformer is quite easy to find. (I use the Tacima models. Very nice quality, silent, not too expensive and made in England. They even look good too!)

I'm hoping that Railsounds RTR will be 50Hz friendly, and that Trainsounds will start to disappear, as there are a few items I'd like to use from the 'RTR' ranges. With any luck I'll be able to order a new tender for my 0-8-0 and then be able to retire my inverter completely.

One thing that I do before buying any locomotive, is to study the Lionel manual as soon as it's available on-line. that way I can ensure that I only buy 50Hz compatible products. Thank you Lionel for posting those promptly with new releases.