Hey Pennsylvania Railroad Fans, what locos would you like to see made/ or remade again?

"I'm seeing a lot of posts for models that have already been done extensively and are readily available in the second hand market.  Is this because of brand loyalty?  Not judging, just curious."

I had the same thought. A lot of guys aren't loco-nerds like some of us, and just may not keep up. For example, the box cab "Rats" have been offered by Lionel (I have the work train set), MTH and, I think, 3rd Rail.

There may be the "latest electronics modelers" adding to the totals, too. Not relevant for me, though.

Oh, before I go, let me mention the HC-1, again...

My checkbook is armed and dangerous...

Well, at least they should take care of it. Better than it rusting away like some of the steam engines out west. Saw on YouTube the steam engine graveyard, I think it is in Oregon and private property. I am guessing the person that shot the video must work or do something for whatever railroad owns that property. It would be interesting to see if they could get some of them out of there because there are sure to be some gems that would make great models(before they rust away).

Its a mystery to me why Lionel or MTH has not yet made an N2 yet.  Its not like its an odd ball engine.   With so many re-issues and so little new tooling you would think this would be a no-brainer.  It has been suggested many times (at least by me), and think it would be a popular engine.  I would buy one in a heartbeat, especially if it was a Visionline with steam effects (whistle, blowdown), swinging bell, and kinematic tender coupling.  

Rich

Oh yeah, and that goes for the Q1 also!  Awesome engine.

GG1 4877 posted:

I'm seeing a lot of posts for models that have already been done extensively and are readily available in the second hand market.  Is this because of brand loyalty?  Not judging, just curious.

Too add to my list if we are talking rolling stock:

F70FBr coaches

A rerun of GGD head end cars and maybe the D78 diner

Kohs did not produce the K5.  They did a K4 in 2007.  I've never seen one in person.  I'm sure it is outstanding, but at my price range the Sunset "High Iron" version is perfectly acceptable.

I guess the problem is that most PRR Steam and diesel has been done already ad nauseum, at least in 3 rail.  

Problem is that many are either incorrectly done (old MG) or lack modern details and "bells and whistles" .

Yep I'd love some accurate 21st century detail PRR steam  - G5's come to mind and short tank I1s.

And as long as PRR steam sells as poorly as the latest 3rd rail L1s Mikes they are just pipe dreams.

Rule292 posted:

I guess the problem is that most PRR Steam and diesel has been done already ad nauseum, at least in 3 rail.  

Problem is that many are either incorrectly done (old MG) or lack modern details and "bells and whistles" .

Yep I'd love some accurate 21st century detail PRR steam  - G5's come to mind and short tank I1s.

And as long as PRR steam sells as poorly as the latest 3rd rail L1s Mikes they are just pipe dreams.

I totally agree on the accuracy statement and the huge amount of 3 Rail PRR locomotives that are available. 

I also agree some more accurate models would be welcome.  The G5 would be great and an updated E6 would be wonderful as well.  I model commuter operations for PRR, so the freight locos don't interest me quite as much although I have a Sunset J1 for some reason (I guess to pull 100 P70's or something). 

Sadly, I don't see the interest in truly fine scale steam locomotives as much as I used to on this forum outside of the 2 rail world.  Not trying to start a flame war, but the L1s was a great example.  An exquisite model that didn't generate the numbers anyone had hoped for.  It seems the control system and the bells and whistles outweigh the fidelity of the model.  Just my opinion of course.  I still live in the world of, "If it isn't mostly correct, it doesn't matter what's under the hood."

GG1 4877 posted:

Sadly, I don't see the interest in truly fine scale steam locomotives as much as I used to on this forum outside of the 2 rail world.  Not trying to start a flame war, but the L1s was a great example.  An exquisite model that didn't generate the numbers anyone had hoped for.  It seems the control system and the bells and whistles outweigh the fidelity of the model.  Just my opinion of course.  I still live in the world of, "If it isn't mostly correct, it doesn't matter what's under the hood."

I'm a huge Pennsy fan and run nothing but PRR (mostly steam) on my layout.  I did not buy a new 3rd Rail L1s.  Here's why.

The problem with "truly fine scale" steam locomotives is that the siderods are very thin (fine scale) and with heavy layout use they will wear out, even when lubricated regularly.  I have some 3rd Rail 2-10-0 decapods that have developed worn and sloppy siderods after 12 years of use.  My Weaver L1s 2-8-2's and H10s 2-8-0's have much thicker siderods and have had no such problems.  I'm sure the 3rd Rail L1s is a great model, but the Weaver L1s is a good model that is also durable.  Plus they are readily available on the secondary market.

I haven't asked, but I'm pretty sure Scott doesn't have any extra siderod sets for a locomotive made in 1995.

"I model commuter operations for PRR, so the freight locos don't interest me quite as much although I have a Sunset J1 for some reason (I guess to pull 100 P70's or something). "

Well, the PRR J-1 is a truly handsome loco. I have a Lionel and a 3rd Rail version. Unfortunately I have not gotten around to fiddling with its suspension to allow it to go through O72 curves.

Here is a list I would like to see:

T1, Q2, I1 (2-10-0), N1 (2-10-2), H10 (2-8-0), Atlantic, 2-8-2 with Belpaire firebox.  I am sure there is more.

PRR 2-10-2 N Class

K-5 Pacific

K-28 or K-29 Pacific

K-4 1737 as built in 1914

R-1 Electric

DD-2 Electric

I know it's not Pennsy but Baldwin Locomotive Works #60,000

Whoever does the the GP9, as suggested by Mr. Shirey, make the GP9b to go along with it.  Pennsy had a few of them in their roster.

Personally, an R1 would would suit me, or a late P5a

Bruce

The N2

Richard 

rex desilets posted:

"I model commuter operations for PRR, so the freight locos don't interest me quite as much although I have a Sunset J1 for some reason (I guess to pull 100 P70's or something). "

Well, the PRR J-1 is a truly handsome loco. I have a Lionel and a 3rd Rail version. Unfortunately I have not gotten around to fiddling with its suspension to allow it to go through O72 curves.

I agree.  What's not to like about this C&O design after the Pennsy Treatment?

Pennsy K5 it has not been done, and although they only made 2 real ones,  many many Pennsy fans want one.  Hey Scott Mann how about taking some reservations to see if its worth doing.  

Here is your first reservation, Franky-Ogee wants one

Franky-Ogee posted:

Pennsy K5 it has not been done, and although they only made 2 real ones,  many many Pennsy fans want one.  Hey Scott Mann how about taking some reservations to see if its worth doing.  

Here is your first reservation, Franky-Ogee wants one

It was offered a while back.  It would be nice to finally see it built.  Who would be up for the other 98 required to make this a go?  I'd probably be in for one since the chance of a K2 is next to nothing.

GG1 4877 count me in for a PRR K5 from Sunset. Sunsets last K5 offering was offered in poor timing. At that time, both MTH and Lionel just offered the reissue of the K4 Pacific again so no one is interested in a similar looking loco. However NOW is s perfect time since new models lately are far and few between. 

As for the L1, it s been a slow seller because of all the Williams and Weaver brass one out there at a fraction of the Sunset models price. It's unfair to judge sales of a never before o guage model Locomotive to the sales of one that has been done multiple times. The USRA/ PRR N2 would be a big hit not only for PRR fans but for the other roads that had a usra 2-10-2 as well!

The PRR Camelback ad well can be done in multiple road names : PRR, LIRR & Rdg! 

prrhorseshoecurve posted:

GG1 4877 count me in for a PRR K5 from Sunset. Sunsets last K5 offering was offered in poor timing.

97 to go!  Who else is in?

I'm a diesel era PRR and LV two rail guy, so this is definitely a minority opinion:

Here's my PRR "wish list". Mind you, given the state of manufacturing in the Pacific Rim countries today, this is all sheer fantasy...

Atlas: PRR GP-7's and GP-9's with TrainPhone equipment; (Radio antennas have now been done; the latest F7 run had them, so it shouldn't be a hassle)

          Alco S series switchers; with or without TrainPhone, but with the Atlas SW horizontal drive system

          And maybe, if the stars and planets align perfectly, a Baldwin switcher or road switcher.

OK, that was fun; back to the real world.

Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:

Engineer-Joe posted:

I had to look up what an I1 was. I had already seen it and didn't even know!

Very nice looking engine. Any idea if it is just a static display or if there are plans to try and restore it? Doesn't look like it is in too bad a shape from the outside.

http://www.trainweb.org/wnyrhs/4483Frame1Source1.htm

Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:

Engineer-Joe posted:

I had to look up what an I1 was. I had already seen it and didn't even know!

Very nice looking engine. Any idea if it is just a static display or if there are plans to try and restore it? Doesn't look like it is in too bad a shape from the outside.

http://www.trainweb.org/wnyrhs/4483Frame1Source1.htm

prrhorseshoecurve posted:

E1 Camelback

D16 4-4-0 "1223"

E2 4-4-2

I'm for all of the above; yes, the D16 was done by MG years and years ago, and that's the only time it was done and in small numbers, too.

I'd also like to see some of the F class 2-6-0 moguls - only the F3c has ever been done.

I'd also like to see the early H class like a narrow Belpair boiler simple H6 and even the very early H1

Just about any of these would succeed in prying open my wallet and/or checkbook, so I figure my budget is completely safe.

Steamer posted:

Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:

Engineer-Joe posted:

I had to look up what an I1 was. I had already seen it and didn't even know!

Very nice looking engine. Any idea if it is just a static display or if there are plans to try and restore it? Doesn't look like it is in too bad a shape from the outside.

http://www.trainweb.org/wnyrhs/4483Frame1Source1.htm

 

Beautiful. I had to see where it was, that is a haul to get to. May be a good idea to take a train up there.

The two things I would like to see produced is a scale version of the Metroliner and some 1960's era Intermodal equipment that Pennsylvania Railroad would have used.

I too find it interesting that so many want Pennsy engines that have already been built not by just one manufacturer, but by several manufacturers.  Many of these engines are available in the aftermarket and can be upgraded with command if desired.  If an engine you really want has the wrong command system, gut it and put in the system you want.  Here is a look at the Pennsy steam engines that have been made.  I'm sure I missed some.

MTH and 3rd Rail have produced I1, Q2, G5, and T1 Prototype (as built) engines.  Lionel and 3rd Rail have produced S2 and T1 Production engines.  All three have built A5, B6, E6, H10, L2, J1, K4, K4 Shrouded, L2, M1, HH1 (or Y3), and S1 engines (K-Line also did some of these like the A5, B6, K4 and L2).  3rd Rail has done unique runs of  H6a, Q1 (skirted and unskirted), N1, and T1 Prototype (unskirted).  MTH and Atlas did a B28.  Weaver did a C1, Lionel did a CC2, and MTH did a D16.  Plus I did not count all the Weaver and Williams brass ones of these same engines.

All the MTH and Lionel engines mentioned above will most likely be produced again (except the Lionel T1), so just wait a bit.  Weaver and Williams are gone, so their unique engines such as the K4 Streamlined are gone unless the new tooling owners do a re-issue (this would be great).  It would be nice if 3rd Rail would redo the H6, N1, and Q1, but I don't think they have ever done a second run of steam engines (may be wrong).

As mentioned above, it is unlikely in this economy that the big manufacturers will invest in new tooling unless they know they can sell enough of the engine to make a profit.  This means only an engine design used by more than one road so as to appeal to as many modelers as possible.  For us Pennsy steam fans, that is not good because most of the Pennsy steam engines not yet made were uniquely Pennsy.

From my perspective watching the market for Pennsy engines, I can see only one new engine being produced in the near future.  It is the N2.  This would be new tooling, but it is an USRA design that was used by a few other roads.  I'll add that the K5 is a long shot but it does have a following.

Now, if the economy greatly improves or lots of new blood enters the hobby, things may change. 

FECguy posted:

The two things I would like to see produced is a scale version of the Metroliner and some 1960's era Intermodal equipment that Pennsylvania Railroad would have used.

Hint on Metroliners....order scale Amfleet cars.  A little bird told me.

GG1 4877 posted:

Too add to my list if we are talking rolling stock:

F70FBr coaches

What is an F70 FBr?

A rerun of GGD head end cars and maybe the D78 diner

Agreed!

Originally posted by Cappilot:

Weaver did a C1, Lionel did a CC2, and MTH did a D16.

Correction on the MTH. MTH did two versions of a D? class ...

one without the Belpaire Firebox and...

and one With a Belpaire firebox. Both do NOT look like a D16 or a D16 sb:

The only scale PRR d class that I am aware of in 3 rail is the Expensive and hard to find SMR D6:

I1 was done by Thirdrail.  M1a/b is Weaver.

L1s Mikado was done by Weaver.  Thirdrail had done the Mikado recently.

A  Weaver C1 Pennsy

Smaller and probably a good runner on most layouts would be the H10, Weaver.

You can find most all picture in older issue.  In most cases, cost of electronics upgrade probably less than a new model.  All pictured were secondary market, electronics upgrades have been done. 

One more. Thirdrail, Pennsy E6.

prrhorseshoecurve posted:

Originally posted by Cappilot:

Weaver did a C1, Lionel did a CC2, and MTH did a D16.

Correction on the MTH. MTH did two versions of a D? class ...

one without the Belpaire Firebox and... and one With a Belpaire firebox. Both do NOT look like a D16 or a D16sb

Correct and why an actual D16 would be preferred!

And a PRR Yellow Kid passenger train!!!

prrhorseshoecurve posted:

GG1 4877 posted:

Too add to my list if we are talking rolling stock:

F70FBr coaches

What is an F70 FBr?

A rerun of GGD head end cars and maybe the D78 diner

Agreed!

I think he means a P70fbR (letters the way the Pennsy did it).  It was one of the many rebuilds of the P70 done from 1948 to 1951, and a fairly successful one at that due to new trucks and interior.  Some had the clerestory roof, some didn't.  All pictures of it I have seen had the original window arrangement.  This could be an easy car for GGD to do since I think only the trucks need to be changed to give it the look.

The head end cars I would like to see is the re-issue of Weaver's B60b baggage.  Who has this tooling?

How about a redo of 3rd Rail's small commuter coaches.  They sold out quickly when made in brass.  Were these P54's?

I don't remember.  I would get 3 if done again.  I rode in these as a kid here locally.

Norm

Roving Sign posted:

Another electric  - the B1

(photo sourced from "Trackside At The Big Apple")

 

A BEEPONE!

The head end cars I would like to see is the re-issue of Weaver's B60b baggage.  Who has this tooling?

Ron
TCA, TTOS, NCT, LCCA

I believe that would be Atlas O since it was a foreign made car.  Lionel is now issuing them in 2018!

I'd like to see Lionel make a legacy 44 Tonner in the PRR scheme. Although Williams made an excellent scale model of the PRR 44 tonner and I suppose I could upgrade it with TMCC. That is if it would fit inside.

I have 2 early USH K4s.    They run well and are robust enough for operating sessions.    As you say Jonathon, at my price range they are just fine.    I am not in the Kohs range either.

I agree that most of the requests are for things that have already been done.    The odds of getting them again are not as great.    Even the Box cab has been done well in brass.   

Sunset has done the 44 tonner, NJCB has done it.   Rich Yoder has done multiple versions, There is another brass import also, and MTH has done it.    Why do we need anymore?

Results of research for a presentation I will give next week:

PRR O Scale Steam (2 rail)         

Goodness knows there is an absolute dearth of PRR model railroad offerings. It is high time that the manufacturers get on the stick and start offering motive power and rolling stock options for our friends from Pennsylvania! 

I have a list of Lionel Legacy engines I would love to see produced again or for the first time:

                    T1 4-4-4-4 hopefully the end of their run version.

                    G5  4-6-0 Please don't tell me MTH made it, I am a Lionel guy.

                    Q2 4-4-6-4 Forget the Q1, there was only one of them

                    I10 2-10-0 With the long haul tender and a operating front coupler so it can be used as a pusher

And just for the heck of it. Throw in a Pennsylvania H10. Consolidation.

That is not too much to ask for.

JohnB                  

GG1 4877 posted:

rex desilets posted:

"I model commuter operations for PRR, so the freight locos don't interest me quite as much although I have a Sunset J1 for some reason (I guess to pull 100 P70's or something). "

Well, the PRR J-1 is a truly handsome loco. I have a Lionel and a 3rd Rail version. Unfortunately I have not gotten around to fiddling with its suspension to allow it to go through O72 curves.

I agree.  What's not to like about this C&O design after the Pennsy Treatment?

Got one of them C&O locos, too. Can't resist.