Issues with postwar 2343 (circa 1952)

Sounds like you have a one motor dropping out. Take top off and see if both motors are responding together. 

Even if the other locomotives work, try testing the voltage to the track.  2 motor F3's draw lots of power.

Dominic Mazoch posted:

... 2 motor F3's draw lots of power.

Plus 10 lighted cars.

It sounds like the grease is warming up and the diesel then reaches full speed.

Also, try running the powered unit at the back of the ABBA, running in the opposite direction, pushing the dummies and pulling the cars.

I have several horizontal motor F3's. Franktrain is on to something.  Apply power to the locomotive with the shell  off so you can see it both motors are turning.  You will see if one is turning slower than the other.  I suspect that the grease in the trucks is old and hard.

You will need to remove the truck from the locomotive and strip them to clean all of the old grease.  You may even have to pick it out.  I use a tooth brush and Brake Clean.  It will dissolve any old grease and oil.  Blow all of it out.  You will want to do this over an oil drain pan.  I even remove the worm shaft and both bearings, so I can inspect the worm wheels.  This can be tricky. 

When reassembling be sure the brass bearing blocks have their holes toward the bottom of the truck frame.  It is subtle but you will see it.  I use Red and Tacky for grease.  Be sure to oil the wheel bearings as you have removed all lubricants with the Brake Clean. DO NOT let it get on to plastic, It will dissolve some plastics.

Have fun,  This will take a couple of hours for both trucks.  Tip, do the rear truck first if you have never done this before.

@Dominic Mazoch   I have no issues with power to the track or any of the other engines I have (8 different postwar engines plus a postwar inspection car).

@ACDX Rob  I did switch the A units and still the same issue. 

@FrankTrain and @Oscar  I did clean all the old gook and hardened grease from both motors and re-lubed/greased everything a year ago but you did hit the nail on the head.  I applied a little power to that A unit while it was on the track and tipped it just enough to see if  the wheels on the trucks were turning and sure enough  I’ve lost power to the rear motor. Then I remembered when I serviced it last year that one of the soldered wires to the armature had come off.   I may have not gotten it re-soldered good enough.

I'll take the shell off and reinspect all the solder connections and contacts this evening.

I’ll update here with my findings.

There is a lot of neat newer items out there today, but I still favor the older postwar Lionel.  They’re pretty much ‘bullet-proof.’  Dad’s trains hadn’t been run from the early 70s until I started getting in to the hobby a few years ago.  A little servicing, a little power, a small oval layout and they ran like new until the above issue.

Thank you everyone for your expertise and input. I sometimes tend to overlook the obvious.

You may want to consider after getting the F unit fixed is to replace the lights in the A units and passenger cars with drop in LED lights.  You get more light for the buck, use less current, and they run cooler.

I do run my powered F unit as the last one in the set, if thete is a powered and dummy A.  But if one has the 2245, which is AB, that is not possible.

Good luck on repairs.  PW are easy to fix.  And you will not have disasters like you see on other threads on this blog.

Happy New Year everyone!  An update to my 2343 in-op truck issue.   I took the shell off last night and really inspected it closely.  All the wires were intact with solid connections that looked good.  I was getting power to it but something was hanging up in the truck itself.

I removed the truck from the motor and upon a close inspection, low and behold, a chunk of old hardened grease was wedged around the worm gears at the end of the truck where the coupler is located.  I didn’t see it at the time and must have knocked it loose last year when I serviced the truck and it worked its way in to the worm gear.  Makes sense, once I’d get it moving friction would soften it and then it would hardened up again after cooling down.

I disassembled the truck and thoroughly cleaned the worm gears and shaft with an old toothbrush and some brake cleaner I sprayed into a bowl, then fished the rest of the softened crud out of the gear teeth and shaft with a toothpick.  I sprayed rinsed the disassembled truck, blew the residue out with a small pancake compressor I have, greased the gears with some LaBelles, oiled the axles, put it back together and voila!  Running like new again.

The LED lamp exchange is a great idea.   We have a train show locally coming up here in a few weeks and I’ll be looking for the replacements for the bulbs.

Thank you again to everyone for their suggestions and advice.  Much appreciated!

JD

When you replace brushes. You should clean the commutator also.  The face and carefully clean the slots out. 

@riki  will do.  

J D posted:

... close inspection, low and behold, a chunk of old hardened grease was wedged around the worm gears at the end of the truck where the coupler is located.  I didn’t see it at the time and must have knocked it loose last year when I serviced the truck and it worked its way in to the worm gear.  Makes sense, once I’d get it moving friction would soften it and then it would hardened up again after cooling down...

I've seen this happen...

Def, clean that old grease out and make sure you have proper mesh contact between the worm shaft and the gears on the axles.  The axle gears are the ones that will strip if the cover is loose. since they are Bronze.  There is supposed to be a dimple in the bottom of the cover than will place pressure on the bronze bearing at each end of the shaft and keep it seated correctly.  However, and I can't remember for sure, but want to mention it just in case, if that shaft hole is offset in the bearing, you have to make sure you get it installed in the correct direction or you could have the too loose situation I mentioned above.  You should also check for stiff or hard grease in the top reservoir of the horizontal motor itself, there should be a hole between the motor head and the gear end for lubrication. If someone put grease in there long ago and it is as hard as the grease below, in the truck, that will add to the situation. You must remove ALL old grease to properly fix that problem!

Love the 2343s; my favorites. Not to change the subject, but what does the @ tag do on this forum? Does it prompt a notification to the person a la Twitter? And if so, how? Thanks

Dennis and Chris....Thanks for your inputs also.

As far as the ‘@‘ goes, most of the other hobby and car forums I subscribe to do use them to notify the poster/subscriber of a comment that was left.   Didn’t know if it applied here too or not, sort of ‘old habits’ thing.   

J D posted:

Dennis and Chris....Thanks for your inputs also.

As far as the ‘@‘ goes, most of the other hobby and car forums I subscribe to do use them to notify the poster/subscriber of a comment that was left.   Didn’t know if it applied here too or not, sort of ‘old habits’ thing.   

Yup, The "@" symbol is  away of tagging a user in a post. Users can elect to be notified when they are tagged: