Kadees on El Cap?

For what it's worth, I did not up-grade my GGD SP Daylight passenger set to Kadee couplers for two main reasons:

 

1) When the whole train set is coupled up, it is very difficult to see the claw couplers, and they still are coupled nice and close together anyway.

 

2) The cars were way to difficult to take apart without potential damage to the spectacular red & orange Daylight paint. I only up-graded to Kadees on the front of the baggage/combine and the rear of the observation cars.

 

I would follow Laidoffsick's suggestion.

I was going to kadee my set too, but LOS's main point is a good one. On most cars, the diaphragm is flexible, but with the El Cap cars, the frame is pinned to the car. So if the diaphragms make contact, they wont get out of one another's way. 

I decided to just leave the claws on mine and am going to follow the suggestion to de-thumbtack the couplers. The gap between the diaphragms is minimal anyways.

 

Have you considered replacing the diaphragms?  

Hi Jim,

I think the issue will be the metal outer frame for the diaphragm, not the diaphragm itself. Still, it seems to me the cars would track better if the truck and the coupler were independent from each other.

Uh oh. I'm wondering what the 2 rail versions will look like? They must use KD's? The gap must be larger than normal?

       
       


I know that.  You do not need the metal. There are several other diaphragms out there w/o the metal.

The 2-rail versions use shorter diaphragms.  With the existing 3-rail diaphragms, for shorter radius curves, Kadee couplers will need to be pushed out towards the edge of the car further than the stock Kadee mount allows for without modification.

Those diaphragm frames are prototypical and a huge difference in appearance than just a rubber diaphragm. You could remove and replace them easily...but why? You will notice the diaphragms more than the couplers anyway, because they are already close coupled with the 3R claws.

 

Actually the cars tracks better on tighter curves when the 3R coupler is attached to the truck. My SP Daylight cars, which I did convert to Kadees, were nothing but a PITA, even running on club layouts with big curves. I had to change them 3 times, drilling new holes in mounting brackets, and using extended Kadee couplers on every other car end, to keep them from derailing. As long as the cars are close, I won't convert. More hassle than its worth.

I did put a Kadee on the head car where it couples to the engines, and a Proto Craft coupler on the rear car. No one even notices the couplers in the rest of the train, and I've run them about 10 hours already on 3 different layouts

 

 

LOS you are the man when it comes to all thing kadee.  I agree 100% the prototypical diaphragm with outer frame is frickin cool, and there is no way I am going to alter it.  So, i will remove the thumbtacks, leave the claws and put kadees on the head end car and the second step down car.  I can live with that.

 

thanks for all the feedback

BTW Doug,

It is totally your fault that I can't stand the o-gauge coupler/claw.  After seeing your videos I began converting all of my rolling stock to Kadees.  I have a 5 gallon bucket 2/3 full of discarded claws.  It probably weighs 6 or 7 lbs.  I am spoiled by the appearance and operation of Kadees and I want to put them on all of my cars.  I will have to make an exception for the El Cap cars, which is ashame because they are some of the best looking cars I own and they deserve Kadees!

Doug,

 Sure like the #19 in your picture.

 

Ron H

Don't forget that O-98, while it sounds like a huge radius, is really a 49" radius curve, far too tight for 21" cars with scale-like couplers, diaphragms, and spacing.

 

If you want realistic looking passenger cars of that length, you need at least O-140 or so. My articulated coach would not go around 74" radius (O-144) with scale spacing between cars.  I had to open it up 1/16" ( half a scale foot).  And those are 65' car halves!

 

Not opinion.

Operating full scale passenger equipment is not for the spacialy challenged. Is spacialy a word?

Keep this in mind---


Reality check:

A tight radius in 1:1-- 16 degree minimum on the Union Pacific used on Y's
In o scale the equivalent is 90" radius

O-108 Diameter
54" radius

O-72 Diameter (full circumference)
36" radius in 2 rail from center point to edge

I would rather see scale gear sit in a straight line before operating any 1:48 70' to 85' passenger car operate on anything below a 78" radius. What was that called in "O-???" 

3 Rail scale is nice stuff and looks the same to me on beautiful 90" or greater radius.

That's my opinion I'm sticking with it.

If you are willing to mount your Kadees on the truck mount, replacing the lobster claws you can have your cake and eat it too. Close coupling and still able to negotiate tight radiuses.

 

Here are a pair of F3s with truck mounted Kadees negotiating an 042 S curve.

 

 

Test truck for a Lionel ElCap. Will be replaced with Coupler boxes and new mounts.

 

 

 

 

Pete

This is one of my consists operating on a relatively tight 74" radius. The models are brass 1/48 PS/Budd cars. The locomotives require a minimum radius of of 64" to operate.

That's amazing Norton they will run through that turnout like that.

LOS I love the weathering on your F's.