Layout wiring help

Hi MRHORST, the first thing I would consider getting is a more powerful transformer. Will definitely pay dividends down the road, IMO.

Penn-Pacific posted:

Hi MRHORST, the first thing I would consider getting is a more powerful transformer. Will definitely pay dividends down the road, IMO.

I know, it's all I got for now. 

Lionel Legacy/TMCC will work with pretty much any wiring setup you can think of.  DCS can be finicky, but is not always so.  It is probably still best to wire from the start in a way that has been proven to give the least problems for DCS.  This system has come to be called "star-wiring" though the name has nothing to do with the actual process any more.  

This 'Star wiring' is really pretty simple.  The idea is that the engine should only get power from one path at any time.  In practice you want to place insulating pins, or otherwise cut the center rail every 10-12 track joints and only have one power feed per isolated section.  

Your layout looks almost right, actually.  I'm not sure if the grey blocks at the bottom are a siding you're working on, but am assuming that's what it is.  I added blue lines where the center rail needs to be insulated.  I forget how this is accomplished on fastrack.  I also added a feed in the middle of what I think is a passing siding.  

I know it's not really clear, but as long as you wire so that track power, and the DCS signal carried on it, can only get to the engine in one path you'll be good to go.  

JGL

I agree with John's cut, plus I'd add a break in the center rail of the extreme left hand main line, at the straight leg of the switch in the upper left, where John already has one in the curved.  This would allow a train to sit unpowered on that stretch of main line while another loco is working the yard.

if you are still using Atlas track, the blue marks (in JGL's drawings) are where the #6093 insulated track joiners should be installed on the center rail.

Drop feeder pairs (hot and common) to the center of the blocks between the two insulated joints.

For Legacy/TMCC operation both outside rails should be jumpered. This doesn't cause any issues with DCS as it's signal is on the center rail.

You will definitely have issues with DCS and the CW-80. It is conspicuously missing from the MTH list of compatible transformers.

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Moonman posted:

if you are still using Atlas track, the blue marks (in JGL's drawings) are where the #6093 insulated track joiners should be installed on the center rail.

Drop feeder pairs (hot and common) to the center of the blocks between the two insulated joints.

For Legacy/TMCC operation both outside rails should be jumpered. This doesn't cause any issues with DCS as it's signal is on the center rail.

You will definitely have issues with DCS and the CW-80. It is conspicuously missing from the MTH list of compatible transformers.

Carl, 

I am using Atlas track.  So I need to put an insulator in the center rail at each blue mark. When you say both outside rails need to be jumperd - what is that referring to exactly? 

When I go to DCS I'll replace the CW80 with something else. 

Thanks for the help guys! 

Eric 

MrHorst posted:

Moonman posted:

if you are still using Atlas track, the blue marks (in JGL's drawings) are where the #6093 insulated track joiners should be installed on the center rail.

Drop feeder pairs (hot and common) to the center of the blocks between the two insulated joints.

For Legacy/TMCC operation both outside rails should be jumpered. This doesn't cause any issues with DCS as it's signal is on the center rail.

You will definitely have issues with DCS and the CW-80. It is conspicuously missing from the MTH list of compatible transformers.

Carl, 

I am using Atlas track.  So I need to put an insulator in the center rail at each blue mark. When you say both outside rails need to be jumperd - what is that referring to exactly? 

When I go to DCS I'll replace the CW80 with something else. 

Thanks for the help guys! 

Eric 

The common wire needs to be connected to both outside rails for the Lionel control systems (Legacy/TMCC). Connect a small piece of wire to each outside rail (jumpered). Then, the hot and common feed wires only need one connection point or one pair of wires from the MTH terminal board to the center rail and one outside rail.

Saves wire that way and it is the only wiring requirement for Lionel.

Moonman posted:

MrHorst posted:

Moonman posted:

if you are still using Atlas track, the blue marks (in JGL's drawings) are where the #6093 insulated track joiners should be installed on the center rail.

Drop feeder pairs (hot and common) to the center of the blocks between the two insulated joints.

For Legacy/TMCC operation both outside rails should be jumpered. This doesn't cause any issues with DCS as it's signal is on the center rail.

You will definitely have issues with DCS and the CW-80. It is conspicuously missing from the MTH list of compatible transformers.

Carl, 

I am using Atlas track.  So I need to put an insulator in the center rail at each blue mark. When you say both outside rails need to be jumperd - what is that referring to exactly? 

When I go to DCS I'll replace the CW80 with something else. 

Thanks for the help guys! 

Eric 

The common wire needs to be connected to both outside rails for the Lionel control systems (Legacy/TMCC). Connect a small piece of wire to each outside rail (jumpered). Then, the hot and common feed wires only need one connection point or one pair of wires from the MTH terminal board to the center rail and one outside rail.

Saves wire that way and it is the only wiring requirement for Lionel.

So currently I'm using Atlas O terminal joiners pictured below,so I just add an extra "black" wired connection to each outside rail and then wire them together before they are connected to the terminal block? 

MR:

From what I understand the electrical connection with Atlas style rail joiners is almost entirely along the bottom of the joiner so if it is loose such that you can slide it back and forth between the two tracks there may be an issue. Best thing to do is to make sure the joiners have tight connections. 

I have a pair of electrical pliers (for crimping). The end of the pliers has a contour that works well with tightening rail joiners. I have also dropped solder into joiners in difficult to reach areas of the layout. 

I think the best place to use the power terminal joiners for all your sidings is at the end of the siding. It will be easy to keep an eye on them for any loosening and if need be drop some solder into the joints.

Joe

So I'm going to ask what I am sure is a painfully obivious question.  So from the infromation provided above and what I've read else where I keep hearing "both common rails connected".  Does that simple mean that I will have 3 terminal rail joiners - 1 on each outside rail and 1 in the middle?  

yes, if you are going to use that method to connect the power.

Moonman posted:

yes, if you are going to use that method to connect the power.

 

Thanks Carl! 

MRHORST, at present I do not have DCS installed on my layout, but instead of using 3 wire drops at each block I wire the common first to the right side, at the next block it's wired to the left side, thereby connecting the common to both sides of the track, and saving some wire and installation time, which has always worked fine.

Jack

Dr. Jack posted:

MRHORST, at present I do not have DCS installed on my layout, but instead of using 3 wire drops at each block I wire the common first to the right side, at the next block it's wired to the left side, thereby connecting the common to both sides of the track, and saving some wire and installation time, which has always worked fine.

Jack

 

 

Jack - that's a good idea! Seems like it should work fine when I make the switch to DCS!