LIONEL 726 VS 736 STEAM ENGINES

Magnetraction for one.

The 726 and 736 are both postwar issues. As with each locomotive, there are different variations that have different motors, smoke units, e unit positioning, magnetraction, and details.

A good place to start reading about the variations and differences:

http://www.tandem-associates.c..._trains_726_loco.htm

http://www.tandem-associates.c..._trains_736_loco.htm

One thing to note when shopping, the tender play into the pricing, especially with the 726 which would come with 2426 die cast 12 wheel tender. That tender alone can be worth as much as a nice 736 Berkshire. To put things in perspective, that tender is the same tender that was issued with the 1950 773 scale Hudson.

Since you mentioned prewar, the 226e Hudson with the 2226W tender would be the forerunner to the 726. This locomotive arguably has the best smoothest running AC motor Lionel ever produced and has firebox glow!

I guess it won't hurt to mention that there are three major variations of the 726 Berkshire:

1946 version with smoke bulb and removable nickel rim wheel sets, with die cast metal tender
1947-1949 version with worm drive motor, nickel rim wheels and die cast metal tender
1952 version with worm drive motor, sintered iron wheels and plastic tender. May or may not be marked "RR" under the 726 number on the cab sides.

There are also minor variations within the 1947-49 locos.

The 736 Berkshire also has a fair number of variations.
For me, the most noticeable are the trailing truck (metal or plastic), and the tender (6 wheel trucks or 4 wheel trucks).

I think the nickel rim wheels on the early version of the 726 is a fantastic look.  The tender is the other critical feature which CW mentioned above.  

The 26 came with better looking wheels!

You have asked a great question, many pre-war operators of conventional trains should chime in. The 736 with magne-traction, 1950  model, with 6 wheel tender trucks would seem to me to be a good puller...The older post war freight cars were heavy..The 726 was a beautiul engine but I wonder about the pulling power. All that being said, they were both nice engines...Win Win... The Century Club 1 modern version of the 726, with TMCC and Railsounds gets my Vote.  It's in my opinion the best made to date...Great thread....

I am willing to be proven wrong but I think the 2046 is more efficient than either the 726 or 736.

I have both and now that the 726 was rebuilt correctly it is a hard choice to make. A good one though.

I think the 2046 is a nice engine too.

I am absolutely crazy about all of Lionel's post war Berkies with special affection for the 1946 726 with the smoke Bulb, nickel rimmed drivers and the dual worm drive.  This engine is a real pleasure to work on and maintain.   All of the Berkshires run well but I have to admit the 2046 Baby Hudson runs extremely well and is a reliable puller.  Actually,  you can't go wrong with either locomotive.

Like the above poster i favor the "46" version 726 great puller also.

At night the smoke unit has smoke coming out with a light beam reflecting thru the smoke due to the smoke bulb and the flapper pushes it out nicely.

Also like our 736 have several versions and good runners great pullers.

Have all the baby hudsons and yes the 2046 is nice with its spur gear motor and another great puller.

Could go on and on about postwar steam "46" turbine the 681 turbine etc etc

It can be explained in this clip

c. lee colbert posted:

So other than one is PRE WAR, & one is POST WAR what is the big difference between the 726 & 736?

Several difference but the one I love the most is the 726 has Baldwin center drivers the 736 has spokes. If wheels can be beautiful the Baldwins are "drop dead".

Bogie

True dat !!

For a 9x6 layout, the 726 pulls enough cars!  I have run 4 HWX Potter cars with it!

I've always heard that the early 726s were superior to the later 736. With the 12-wheel diecast tender, the 726s sure looked great. I had one maybe 15 years years ago now; I don't recall if it was a '46 or '47, but it ran like a Swiss watch. Really incredibly smooth. One of those engines I wish I still had.

The 736 I just acquired came with a 4 wheel tender, 2046W.  How can I tell when it was made (year/era)?

c. lee colbert posted:

The 736 I just acquired came with a 4 wheel tender, 2046W.  How can I tell when it was made (year/era)?

Over the years there has been a lot of mixing and matching of Berkshires and tenders.  If your tender has plastic four wheel trucks and is lettered PENNSYLVANIA rather than LIONEL LINES the tender was manufactured between 1961 and 1966.  As far as your 736 Locomotive is concerned if it has a small wedge placed on the bracket underneath the headlamp it was manufactured anywhere form 1953 to 1966.  Also, in 1955 the trailing truck went from being die-cast to sheet metal with plastic side frames.  There was one additional change which occurred in 1957 when the pickup assembly was made smaller and mounted with only one screw rather than two.  As best that can be determined the last 736 Berkshire was manufactured in 1966 although there were apparently some leftovers which were cataloged in 1968.  If you want additional information on all of the Berkshires produced reference  Tom McComas and James Tuohy's , "A COLLECTOR'S GUIDE AND HISTORY FOR LIONEL POSTWAR TRAINS".  Hope this helps.

And there is the 726RR from 1952. Due to a shortage of magnet material during the Korean War, Lionel steam locos did not come with magnetraction in 1952. The 726RR was like the previous years 736 without magnetraction, a different number, but with smoke and also with the die cast trailing truck.   

I have a fine example and it is one of the smoothest running and quiet postwar locos I have. Also a strong puller.

Jeff

Jeff, .....spot on!....to me 726rr are the best runners for the money!....I snap them up every chance I get...especially the neglected ones on the bay or at a train show....736's are great, but on my pike, on atlas O track, magnetraction isn't worth anything, but as an effective braking system. I repaint worn out RR's and rebuild them for active duty on the water level route....

Beautiful restoration. Reminds us all why we love the Berkshire.

thank you, when the rods and valve gear are rusty, I wire wheel them up and knock off the  rest of any plating that's left and dip them in black oxide for a minute to get the blackened effect, also dip the steam chest, pilot and trailing trucks....gives so many shades and textures of black......looks like it was meant to be that way.......the oxide wont attack the brass rivet detail, so they add a nice level of detail

Looking forward to the new LionChief Plus Berks coming soon. DC can motor with cruise, of course. Not for the purists, maybe, but it should be an nice update of the classic Berk.

\

My 726 is an RR and was a lousy runner for a long time, thought about getting it, many times. Just within the last year a guy rebuilt it for me and runs great.  Lack of Magnetraction not an issue now. No real long rains or steep climbs. My 736 is nice too.I guess my favorite is the 2065, had 6, until I got rid of 3.

I have a lot of PW Berks and Hudsons, from 726 to the '66 736, and many in between.  They all run great with right consist, keep em lubricated and clean.  Sometimes put the modern engines all on the shelves, run only PW Lionel with same consists.  One I have not seen mentioned, and very good runner/puller is the 2035.  I have three and for a good die cast heft and traction, the 2035 gets my vote.  yes, really like the 2046, 2056, 2055, 2065, 726, 736, 773, 681, 682, 2020 and all others.  But, if you have a chance, check out a 2035 for a great unit of PW motive power.

Jesse   TCA   12-69275

I like all that you listed and have at least one of each. I looked at a 2035 yesterday and wondered about it. Everything I looked at "he wasn't selling" so I quit. Worked out OK because I called my antique dealer-friend in western Pa. and he had a nice Standard gauge Lionel 834 that he would hold for me. I have wanted one.

texastrain posted:

I have a lot of PW Berks and Hudsons, from 726 to the '66 736, and many in between.  They all run great with right consist, keep em lubricated and clean.  Sometimes put the modern engines all on the shelves, run only PW Lionel with same consists.  One I have not seen mentioned, and very good runner/puller is the 2035.  I have three and for a good die cast heft and traction, the 2035 gets my vote.  yes, really like the 2046, 2056, 2055, 2065, 726, 736, 773, 681, 682, 2020 and all others.  But, if you have a chance, check out a 2035 for a great unit of PW motive power.

Jesse   TCA   12-69275

Yes the 2035  can pull really well on tin track , have the "50" 1 year only version that has large round magnets and the half moon shape eccentric cranks.

Also have the "51" version that has the rectangle magnets and the 2 pin eccentric cranks both strong pullers.

Quietest postwar runners and have a lot of post lionel steamers are the late 40s version with baldwin wheels 2025 and 675. These are very quiet and run like a swiss watch(so smooth) compared to the 50 s versions with non baldwin wheels which i had several of and sold.

It was said that Lionel loosened up there machining standards or tolerances not sure but can attest to their running nature.

A good maintained "46" berk with the dual worm drive with its drive train in good shape in my opinion cannot be beat even though i have read reports that they need a lot of voltage and are noisy which is simply not true if they are in good shape as i have have a pair of them maintained and run often.

This is an interesting discussion.  One other noteworthy difference to add to CWB's comments above is the operation of the E-Unit.  On the 1946 model, the E-Unit was operated by moving a banana plug from one jack to another, where the jacks were located directly on the brush plate of the motor.   This picture, borrowed from another thread, shows the detail:

On the 47-49 models, the E-Unit is operated using the more familiar stamped steel lever accessible along the top of the engine's boiler.

I am doing a long, slow, steady search for a 726 because I think they're drop dead gorgeous.  Here's a question: What exactly is the difference between the drivers/driver rims used on the 1946 vs. 1947-49 models?  Or am I misunderstanding people's descriptions?

Thanks in advance.  Enjoying this thread.

Steven J. Serenska

After reading the latest additions to this string I put my 2035 on the track with a mixed postwar-modern 8 car freight. As always, my smoothest and quietist postwar steamer. My Dad gave me the 1950 version and it is still my favorite, even though I have plenty of Legacy and PS3.0. When I run the 2035 I imagine the Gunny (MSgt USMC retired) is still next to me.

finished the tender this morning on this re-built 726RR, scabbed the tender from a 785 as a lone piece off the bay for peanuts......

 

On the 47-49 models, the E-Unit is operated using the more familiar stamped steel lever accessible along the top of the engine's boiler.

I am doing a long, slow, steady search for a 726 because I think they're drop dead gorgeous.  Here's a question: What exactly is the difference between the drivers/driver rims used on the 1946 vs. 1947-49 models?  Or am I misunderstanding people's descriptions?

Thanks in advance.  Enjoying this thread.

Steven J. Serenska

Hi Steven,

I am by no means an expert on the 726, however I did acquire the 1947-49 version on my first trip to York a few years ago. Actually, when I purchased it, I did not realize there were differences.  I met Roger Carp and bought his book "101 Classic Toy Trains" which ranked his top 101 post war trains.  The early version (1946) of the 726 was ranked number 10 and that's when I learned that I bought the later version.  In looking at the Greenberg repair manual, the two versions of the 726 have different part numbers for the wheels, while Roger's book notes that the 1946 version of the 726 has removable Baldwin Disk driver assemblies, so I think that is the difference. From the pictures,  I think they look about the same, which is beautiful.

 I think that there are enough differences between the two versions of the 726, that I probably will get the 1946 version, which does not have the exposed E-unit lever.  

all the best, Dave

I must be the only guy who doesn't know what "Legacy and PS3.0" are and don't want to know.....I strictly run Lionel PW, and a few MPC/General mills and also some K-line from way back and lots of kit-bashed stuff. So I want to keep learning more about the PRE-WAR & POST WAR trains!

Lee-- I know the feeling. I read about the new things but really not in to them.

I got my 726 at a train show near Houston.  He had two 26's, one for $150, another for $750.  I asked what was wrong with the lower cost one?  It had no tender.  I had at home the Vandy K-Line SP tender already!.  So I told the guy I did not need the tender, and made the sale.  It ran well, but I put a new Lionel made valve gear with it.  I run it with some Hogwarts set cars, or a few SP passenger vars.  Run with 360 watts TMCC Conv., with the TMCC adjusted  to the engine.  I can get this baby to crawl!  

While clearly not postwar, we should mention 6-28074, a Nickel Plate Berkshire, #759, with TMCC and railsounds. It is believed to be the last Lionel loco produced in the USA. (A Hudson was made around the same time. However, I have read that it was produced from existing parts parts.)

The Lionel Berkshire has a long and noteworthy history.

While clearly not postwar, we should mention 6-28074, a Nickel Plate Berkshire, #759, with TMCC and railsounds.

If you want to include Modern era Berkshires, there are several that are being left out, starting with the 8002 Union Pacific Berkshire (1980). It has a mechanical e-unit and electronic whistle. That's more than enough electronics for me.  

Isn't the 2035 being brought into this thread a 'prairie' type 6 wheel driver.  The 726 & 736 are 8 wheel.

Isn't the 2035 being brought into this thread a 'prairie' type 6 wheel driver.  The 726 & 736 are 8 wheel.

As is the 2046 Mentioned earlier. The 2046 uses the same boiler casting as a postwar Berkshire, but does not have a boiler front that opens.

I think the Lionel's use of interchanging parts with the older steam engines is an interesting study. Wish I had more info on it. Had some but somehow misplaced a bunch of books when I moved.