Lionel's Sound cars and Vision Line Reefers (from the 2016 Signature catalog)

The single unit cars are different than the PFE reefer sound car.  First off, they're not command equipped, they just make sounds when powered, presumable only in motion, but I don't really know.  They will obviously work with any version of Legacy or TMCC as they don't know it exists.  The min/max switch, as near as I can see, will work similar to the PFE reefers or the Ethanol tank cars min/max switch.

The sensor cars are obviously designed to work with the sensor track, they're pretty useless without it.  They don't make sounds, they are just loaded with the specifications of your consist that has the sensor car, and then you can use the LCS system and sensor tracks the same way you would with a Legacy locomotive that has the sensor.

Also, Lionel isn't reissuing the VL Reefers, these are all new, different catalog number and car numbers.

Yes, the numbers are different on this year's PFE Reefers.

Erics review is about as thorough as it gets with these:

Reefers are just fine behind the polar express, they can't just park that loco 364 days out of the year

Eric's review is so well done.  I saw these cars in the 2016 catalog, recently received.  There will be at least one or two on my small pike.  I can see the day when you can put in your own announcements wherein the foreman cusses out the slackers and the employees get injured and start talking about workers' comp claims!

These were my first preorder from the '16 catalogs and will be my first sound cars (the PS-1s).

Looking forward to them!

gunrunnerjohn posted:

The single unit cars are different than the PFE reefer sound car.  First off, they're not command equipped, they just make sounds when powered, presumable only in motion, but I don't really know.  They will obviously work with any version of Legacy or TMCC as they don't know it exists.  The min/max switch, as near as I can see, will work similar to the PFE reefers or the Ethanol tank cars min/max switch.

 That's right. The single unit Boxcar With Sound cars will work on a conventional layout, TMCC, Legacy, DCC, DCS, etc. When in motion, you'll hear a variety of wheels-on-track sounds. These sounds are similar to the PFE reefers, the ethanol tank cars and the current legacy station sounds diner cars, but without any dialog or loading/unloading sounds.

The min/max switch will make an individual car sound-off less frequently. This switch, in conjunction with the included volume control, will let you fine-tune the sound presentation when either a single  or multiple Boxcar With Sound cars are used in the same train. 

On Notch 6 one of the wunderkinds from Lionel was on talking about the Sound cars. GRJ's description is dead on from what was said on Notch 6. They are powered by the rail and have no remote functions. Min max was for volume and from what he described it will be a symphony. I scampered down to my LHS and put in an order right away for a PRR car. I think if they have multiple numbers I may buy 2.

In Kentucky I was just south of Louisville and UP has a fair sized yard there. I sat many times at the crossings watching UP power pulling auto cars and other freight. Freaking gorgeous and I loved all the sounds squealing, squeaking, thumping.

Can't wait.

Frank

PRR in the 50s sorta.

I love the vision line cars they add so much to the operating experience! Below are the usage of the reefers.

https://ogrforum.com/v...4664819010543/a/true

Rick and Don, thanks for posting the videos...Eric's video was 43+ minutes long and contained tremendous details on programming the reefer car, kind of a turn-off I have to say for someone like me who likes command control but hates programming. Your other videos were an awesome demonstration of the sound effects.

I am still confused however about the features of the Vision Line reefer set vs. the single PS1 boxcars - or is it as simple as the Vision Line reefer cars only make sounds via remote activation (command control only) and the PS1 sound cars will be automatic as the car is in motion (command or conventional)? If so, I would prefer the automatic sound effects so that I don't have to press a button to get wheel-flange squeals. And, the big question: is the Vision Line set the Gold standard and the separate PS1 sound car a lower standard (in terms of sound quality, variety of sounds, and realism)? Its impossible to tell exactly what to expect from the catalog descriptions.

Thanks.

I wasn't going to say anything...until that stupid idiot thought he could just stop the train to fix a flat wheel! What a maroon!!! I don't know where they come up with this $#!+!

Paul Kallus posted:

And, the big question: is the Vision Line set the Gold standard and the separate PS1 sound car a lower standard (in terms of sound quality, variety of sounds, and realism)? Its impossible to tell exactly what to expect from the catalog descriptions.

I'll be very surprised if these don't have the same quality sound as the Vision Line reefers, the difference is they just lack the command features.

Big Jim posted:

I wasn't going to say anything...until that stupid idiot thought he could just stop the train to fix a flat wheel! What a maroon!!! I don't know where they come up with this $#!+!

So, you can fix them while you're still moving?

It's a special train, they have a monster jack to lift the car and slip another bogie under it.

Big Jim posted:

 that stupid idiot thought he could just stop the train to fix a flat wheel! What a maroon!!! 

This is the maroon who did it.

Do you think it's safe to assume the PFE cars are going to be an exact match cosmetically --- colors / graphics --- just different numbers than the  cars from last year ???

Thinking of getting a set to run behind my Lionel SP black widow F-3's

Thx

Joe S

Paul Kallus posted:

 

I am still confused however about the features of the Vision Line reefer set vs. the single PS1 boxcars - or is it as simple as the Vision Line reefer cars only make sounds via remote activation (command control only) and the PS1 sound cars will be automatic as the car is in motion (command or conventional)? If so, I would prefer the automatic sound effects so that I don't have to press a button to get wheel-flange squeals.

Flange squeal track joint clatter and grinding and bumping sounds occur randomly once the car is powered up. You also get coupler slack and banging when the train starts and stops.

The only thing triggered by remote is the flat wheel sound/repair and loading / unloading dialogue and brake squeal sound.

There really isn't much to programming, really all you do is give the car an id# like you would a loco, then when you address it you get icons for loading uload,flat wheel and brake squeal.

You can make it part of a "TR" train with your loco so the brake sounds will come on when the locomotive brakes , but thats optional. I just leave mine with its own id#, then I just put it in any train behind any loco and activate the extra sounds with the icons.

 

And, the big question: is the Vision Line set the Gold standard and the separate PS1 sound car a lower standard (in terms of sound quality, variety of sounds, and realism)? Its impossible to tell exactly what to expect from the catalog descriptions.

Thanks.

From Rudy/Railsounds  post above:  "These sounds are similar to the PFE reefers.....but without any dialog or loading/unloading sounds."

IMO you won't be dissapointed, these are right up there with the command control crane with regards to the "neato" factor that no one else offers in O guage. The fact that the first run of these were going for somewhere beyond neighborhood of $450 on ebay once dealer stock had all dried up. Ro has preorder price for the vision reefers at $214.

Well, assumptions are rarely safe, but I'd sure hope they kept the colors the same!

breezinup posted:

Big Jim posted:

 that stupid idiot thought he could just stop the train to fix a flat wheel! What a maroon!!! 

This is the maroon who did it

Are you sure? I thought it was one of these guys?

Maybe they could add the sound effect of Maroon 5 falling under the wheels???

Seriously though, if the dialog / unloading jabber are the only things missing from the new sound cars, that will be fine as they are the least appealing features, for me, on the Vision reefers.

These guys stopped the train to fix the flat spots 

So will the 2016 sound cars have pickup rollers on both trucks like the Vision reefers? Also seems like the new cars will need a battery to take care of the occasional loss of power in command mode and low voltage operation for conventional operators. Do the Vision reefers use a battery or super caps?

Ken

The VL Reefers have no battery or capacitor, they seem strictly for command.  The VL Tank cars have battery provisions, but it appears to be also strictly command in design.  The VL cattle car doesn't have a battery and appears to be strictly command based as well.

Hi everyone,

The good news is that the speaker, sound enclosure and sound quality/volume between the sound car PS-1's and the Vision Reefers will be identical. In fact, the same stamping tool used to create the sound pass through holes in the frame of the reefer is being used on the PS-1 frame, same speaker, same speaker enclosure, same volume level, same great quality of sounds as all Railsounds products (just no command control, in the PS-1's anyway). 

We are certain you will be very pleased with the sounds these cars make and the additional "fun" it will add to your operations!

Thanks,

Mike

Thanks for the verification Mike, I suspected that Lionel wouldn't drop the sound quality for this offering.  After all, it's a "sound" car, so it should have good sound!

can someone provide a link or number so I can find these new cars? Ten minutes of searching and I can't find them.

Lionel Ps-1 Sound Boxcars

All I know is I plan on getting one of each as I love my VL sound reefer.  That'll be 11 noisy cars in a train.  I can't wait!

I hope Lionel adds sound to tank cars, stock cars, hoppers (covered or with loads), gondolas (also covered or with loads), cabooses, and anything else the speaker will fit in, too in the future like these PS-1 boxcars.

The milk cars! the milk cars! don't forget sound in the milk cars!!  

Mike if your listening how about some VL reefers in eastern roadnames with meatpacker dialogue?

Well that confirms it. I will be ordering another set of VL reefer cars with 3 new PS1 sound cars...

Now, what ever happened to that Crew Talk  Caboose?

Do you have the VL stock car?  I do.  According to the owner's manual, moving the Max/Min switch to Min is supposed to mute the rail clatter and curve grind sounds.  I don't know if "mute" is supposed to mean silence or soften.  With my car, it doesn't seem to do either.  Does the Max/Min switch work on your stock car?

Actually, I like the freight car sounds more than the cow sounds.  IMO, the cows are too loud.  It seems the only way to quiet them is to adjust the volume pot, but then you're also quieting the freight car sounds.  It would be nice if it were possible to adjust the cow sounds independently.

Keith

I confess I've never switched the car to Min to see what it does.

According to what Rudy posted above the Min-Max switch on the PS-1 cars controls the frequency of random sounds, not volume.  There is a separate volume control.  I don't know if the same holds true for the Vision Line cars.

Yes, the MIN/MAX switch just turns off some of the effects.  This is from the PFE Reefer manual.

Min/Max Switch
Used to make the sound, simulating the scraping and banging of the contents of the reefer car, less
or more active. When the switch is in the MIN position, the dialog and some background motion
sounds will turn off. This allows you to put more than one sound-equipped reefer car on the same
ID. To do this, set one car to MAX and then trigger loading/unloading. Sound effects will come
from all cars; however dialog will only come from one.

From the Ethanol Tank Car Manual.

Sound Set Switch
For all sound effects, keep the Sound Set switch in the “MAX” position. If you wish
to mute Freight Sounds sound effects from playing (wheel grinding in curves, rail
clatter, and coupler sounds), move the switch position to the “MIN” position.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

Yes, the MIN/MAX switch just turns off some of the effects.  This is from the PFE Reefer manual.

Min/Max Switch
Used to make the sound, simulating the scraping and banging of the contents of the reefer car, less
or more active. When the switch is in the MIN position, the dialog and some background motion
sounds will turn off. This allows you to put more than one sound-equipped reefer car on the same
ID. To do this, set one car to MAX and then trigger loading/unloading. Sound effects will come
from all cars; however dialog will only come from one.

From the Ethanol Tank Car Manual.

Sound Set Switch
For all sound effects, keep the Sound Set switch in the “MAX” position. If you wish
to mute Freight Sounds sound effects from playing (wheel grinding in curves, rail
clatter, and coupler sounds), move the switch position to the “MIN” position.

What I'm wondering is if, with the stock car, that actually happens when you move the switch to MIN?  With mine, at least, I don't hear any difference.

Keith

If I understand correctly from Rick and John's description the only sounds feature difference (or missing) from the PS1 sound cars vs. the VL reefer set will be the sound of unloading/loading and fixing the wheel? If this is right, then I will order the PS1 sound cars - same neat sound effects minus the two mentioned above that work automatically as cars move. I wonder how the wheel-flange squeal activates - prototypically it would occur on curves - is there a transducer or other sensor in the car that detects the train in curves - or is it just randomly played at certain intervals?

From the catalog description, Lionel suggests placing a sound car every few standard cars (after the locomotive) - so for a 12 car freight consist this would be - locomotive - 3 standard cars - sound car - 3 standard cars - sound car - 3 standard cars - caboose. For you guys who have the reefer sound car - does this sound about right or is one sound car per consist good enough?

On the VL cars theres a motion sensor on one of the axles. Flange squeal does occur on curves.

Having said that, sounds change and vary a bit based on car speed. as I stated earlier you get coupler slack and banging during when the car  motion starts and stops .

There are various intermittent" worse" grinding sounds when the car is traveling at a crawl. At speed you also get track joint clatter.

FWIW, I only have 1 car in that PE video posted above, I'm very pleased with how much sound/interest just the one car adds to the 16 car train.

I'm sure an extra car or two would be better, butIMO one car does a nice job of adding "ambient" trains sounds without being overkill.

Not every car squeals on the prototype either.

I was led to believe there was actually sensing for curves, but that's a question for Rudy or Jon I suspect.

Your correct John! I never really paid much attention while running trains. ( I fixed my previous post)

I just pushed the car around my layout by hand and indeed the car senses the curves and flange squeal sounds occur accordingly.

These cars are even better than I thought!!