LIONEL SHASTA SP DAYLIGHT CARS

Alex:

". . . to go with the new Lionel SP GS2 that I have on order."

The 6-11420? Just last night Judy and I were watching a new DVD I received for Christmas, and the Daylight was the featured train, with the GS-2 locomotive - Beautiful! So much so that I may be looking for one.

Excellent choice!

Alex

Hi Alex, Thanks

Yes the 6-11420, what a beautiful engine it is I can't wait to get it. The shipping date says Feb 13th, boy I hope so.

Thanks, Alex

Just a word to those who might be thinking similarly... The Shasta Daylight colors are not an exact match to that of the Daylight steam locomotives from Lionel.  They're close enough for my tastes, but some of you out there may be sticklers for an exact match.

The Daylight steam locomotive colors are brighter, whereas the Shasta Daylight color scheme is a subtle deeper shade of orange/red... more of an exact match to the PA Alco diesels or even the SD70ACe heritage diesel.  You'd need to go back to the 2005-2006 passenger set to get the matching color scheme to the steam locomotives.

Again... just a word of caution.  But these are otherwise magnificent 18" aluminum passenger cars.  Charlie Ro had the 4-car set on sale for year-end.  Might be worth checking in with them if you're thinking of grabbing a set.

David

Hi David yes I agree it will be slightly off, but with the price I got and there in excellent condition I couldn't pass it up.

Thanks, Alex

The 4-pack is still listed on the website for $329.95, which is a great price for these very well-detailed cars.

David

I agree the Lionel cars are the nicest of the 18" cars. This is from the 2005 set. The car in front is the MTH auxiliary tender.

Pete

The SD was a diesel SP passenger train from the start.  Now, did a GS ever run on it?  ????????

Beautiful cars....If only those ridiculous windows didn't ruin them for me.

Borrowing this photo from Big Jim. For whatever reason, Lionel has the windows on all their 18" cars protruding from the car body. The exposed edge of the glass also casts a green tint in the windows, worsening the already silly appearance. It's just such a goofy mistake on what are otherwise gorgeous models.

Nick mentioned this over on another thread... And the photo above certainly accentuates what he's describing.  But honestly, until someone mentions it, most folks would be none the wiser.  Certainly not a show-stopper in my book at all.  In fact, I just write it off as a matter of style.  Each to his own.  These are all magnificent cars.

David

I agree with David, you have to look close and when you do its OMG!

Did any one notice that all the cars are smooth sided except the end observation?

What happened?

Personaly I like the cars but may look at purchasing the 21 inch K line instead.

I always noticed something didn't look quite right with the windows in pictures from several inches to a few feet away. It took Big Jim's photo to highlight the error, and now they stick out like a sore thumb from any distance. The photo of the observation car in the original post also really highlights the issue. Why did they get the vestibule windows right but not the rest?

I too will likely go with the K-Line 21 inchers whenever I put together a Daylight set.

Good morning all, I see what you're talking about Nick but I took some close up photo's of these cars and the windows seem to have a frame around them. I also have the Santa Fe aluminum cars and they seem to have a frame around them also. See what you guys think. I will try to take a clearer photo and post it in a few minutes.

Thanks, Alex

Here's two close up photo's to get a better look. I think these windows look pretty good. Seems to be a big difference from the N&W cars above.

Alex

I see what you're referring to Alex. Looks like a little chrome ring around the face of the glass. That must be the frame that's supposed to be flush with the car body like the vestibule windows, but for whatever reason it's still sticking out.

I'm assuming this was a weak attempt by Lionel to fix the problem. Fact remains, they need to go all the way and make them flush! 

Yes Nick I do agree with you they should be flush.

Alex

You want an SP Daylight train set? With out a doubt, the best one on the market is the SCALE LENGTH Golden Gate Depot train set! It even has the correct 3 section articulated diner and multiple 2 section articulated chair cars. Please remember that there should be NO sleepers in a Daylight train.

Absolutely spectacular train!

Alex....very nicely detailed cars.  The flush window "problem" is something that an individual will have to decide whether or not it is bothersome.  The Daylight has always been one of my favorites and I have it well represented on my Twin Lakes Central railroad.  Along with the steam locomotive, I have all of the K-Line 21" cars.  The steamer is the GS-4 that MTH produced and just so you know, the colors do not match perfectly.  Williams produced a nice ribbed set of scale streamliners back in the late 80's or early 90's that match the locomotive perfectly as I also have all six of those cars.  As a matter of fact, I have a 7 car 20" set of cars that Weaver produced and they match almost perfectly with the locomotive.  In addition, I have the Alco PA ABA set and a set of ABA F-3 units.  I love the Daylight scheme!!

Congrats on your new set Alex!

Alan

Alex:

These are beautiful cars and I would not worry one bit about the window issue. Enjoy them with your GS2 when it arrives. You have great taste in passenger train selections. I admire what you do.

That is correct for the Shasta Daylight. The observation used was a 1941 corrugated side car. The rest were smooth. Commendable for Lionel to offer this.

Interesting that many will dismiss the Lionel cars for incorrect windows but overlook the fact that no one else except GGD has full width diaphrams which were an early trademark of the Daylight to make it appear to be a continuous train with no breaks. 

Pete

It comes down to what we reasonably expect from different companies and what we are willing to pay. If you want cars that capture the general look of the Daylight but forgo the more expensive little intricacies, you go Lionel or MTH and save money. When you want the best of the best, you look to brass importers like Weaver and GGD and pay more for ultra-correctness.

In the case of flush windows, ALL companies need to get this right, as it is a most basic of details. So yes, unfortunately I have to dismiss the Lionel cars from my consideration. I'm paying for models that are pleasant to my eyes, not for those bulging green windows to stare me in the face every day 

Thanks Pete! Well that sums that up. So the earlier release with all corrugated cars from Lionel was an error that was fixed? Or did the SP have corrugated cars upgraded later on?

Not sure I follow on the diaphrams being full width. I thought Lionel had them on thier cars as seen above, they just do not touch to accomodate smaller radii.

Pete, I honestly don't think there are that many folks dismissing Lionel for the window issue.  Frankly, I never heard of it until Nick clarified a comment on another thread.

I would however agree that GGD has top of the line models if one is looking to purchase the absolute best in O-scale passenger cars.  I saw the GGD Congressional set that The Public Delivery Track brought to York last October, and it was magnificent -- definitely in a league of its own.

David

J, the cars made in 2005 are "correct" (quotes because they are not copies of the actual cars) for the 1937 Daylights which were all corrugated and also lettered in the pre 1946 scheme of "Southern Pacific Lines". The Shasta didn't begin service until after 1946 so "Lines" was correctly omitted. I think smooth side cars actually began service in the early 40s on various trains.

I was adding GGD to Lionel as the only 3 rail manufacturers offering more correct diaphrams. Now to figure out a way to paint them to match the car sides.

I have started lobbying Scott to rerelease the Daylight cars in both early and late lettering schemes. Hopefully those planning to get the Lionel and MTH Daylights will do the same.

Pete

Just ordered the set: $330 + $9 S&H!

MSRP $640, Hobby Station $465, so the $330 was/is indeed a ver good price - I think .

THX!

Alex

Alex, FWIW Nicolas Smith has the two car add  on set (6-35446) for these.

Alex you got an awesome deal, I paid more for them used. Great work

Alex....very nicely detailed cars.  The flush window "problem" is something that an individual will have to decide whether or not it is bothersome.  The Daylight has always been one of my favorites and I have it well represented on my Twin Lakes Central railroad.  Along with the steam locomotive, I have all of the K-Line 21" cars.  The steamer is the GS-4 that MTH produced and just so you know, the colors do not match perfectly.  Williams produced a nice ribbed set of scale streamliners back in the late 80's or early 90's that match the locomotive perfectly as I also have all six of those cars.  As a matter of fact, I have a 7 car 20" set of cars that Weaver produced and they match almost perfectly with the locomotive.  In addition, I have the Alco PA ABA set and a set of ABA F-3 units.  I love the Daylight scheme!!

Congrats on your new set Alex!

Alan

Thanks very much Alan

Alex

Color may not match even on the real thing.  Sometimes there can be changes in color in each paint batch even from the same paint source.

During this time period:

TTG:  Overnight train, with sleepers.

Daylight:  Day train, no sleepers.

Also, look at the color of the winged ball.  If the ball is orange (the sun), it is a day train.  If the ball is gray (the moon), it is an overnight train. 

I watched the Shasta Daylight many times, but never did get around to riding it.  It went into service in1949 with diesel power.  It never was steam powered.  Of the daylight trains, I always looked on the Shasta Daylight is the finest of them.  The two features that stood out in my mind were the larger windows, excepted on the fluted tail car and the elevators by the doors for loading luggage.  The elevator doors really set the Shasta cars apart from the other other daylights.  I believe that the Shasta Daylight had the longest route and longest schedule of any of the daylights.