Lionel U30C Not Moving - Help

Well, the fact that it's obviously responding to commands leads me to believe it's somewhere in the link between the R2LC and the DCDRS.  You might have shorted something and cooked it as well, hard to know.  Have you checked closely the wires to the motors?

Your first, no, second mistake was taking the body off the frame in the first place. To replace the shell in the correct position, you need the factory approved mallet.

Thanks gunrunnerjohn for jumping in.  I hope it's not a board but could be.  I took the wire nuts off at the junction for the blue and yellow wires to the motors.  Checked for DC while reving and nothing.  I was able to see DC when hand rotating the motors so we know the wiring is good from the junction to the motors.

Steims If you are using a Legacy remote make sure you do not have the brake on. JohnB

Get a hammer.  This is a part of the first run: UP, CB&Q, Chessie, SBD (last Service Station loco?).

My Burlington has been bad order on my layout for years for the exact problem you are describing.  I have seen it happen to every loco I have listed above.  All features work perfectly, the darned thing just won't move.

At the time I had it happen it wasn't a year old. Lionel told me the molex connector went bad and they knew about the issue.  They sent me a new molex connector and it's been sitting there waiting for a heck of a long time.  The molex connector is buried under the forward boards under a heat sink.  The only way to replace it is to remove the front truck and unscrew the boards from beneath the stamped frame.  It's pretty much a complete dis-assembly which is why I haven't tackled it. 

What peeves me is that I can foresee this area overheating regularly.  So, what, I replace the molex connector and it works for another six months before it fails again?

It's a generally frustrating situation.

Good luck,

Fred

This is the point where I start substituting boards to see if there's a bad board in the mix.

What peeves me is that I can foresee this area overheating regularly.  So, what, I replace the molex connector and it works for another six months before it fails again?

It's a generally frustrating situation.

You could gut it out and make a nice unpowered unit out of it.

Thank JohnB for the suggestion but I'm using the CAB-1.  I later tried my Legacy just to rule the controller out.

Fred, so you say it might be the molex connector.  That will be a pain to get at.  If you happen to have a part number on the connector that may help me to get a new one if I can prove this one bad.

Gunrunnerjohn, ever transfer a bad board to a good engine and cause more damage.  I assume you are only talking the RL2C board and the DCDRS.  Not the sound boards or the motherboard.  Ever swap an Odyssey board for non-odyssey just to see if this thing will move?

Your local Lionel service station has a manual of procedures that cover almost every eventuality, and a test rig that tests all of the boards in your loco. Contact them to run the diagnostic procedure (I did for a customer's F3 set that wouldn't smoke) and order the parts needed to make the unit operational. If it is the molex connector, they can do the repair skillfully. The service station I worked with ordered the parts for me, I replaced the defective parts, and all was well. Made me happy, believe you me.

I would do what John stated.  If you have a Lionel Tech handy, he has a test fixture that can confirm the boards.  You might want to pull the Molex plug out of the motor driver board and reinstall it.

Ok Doctor but I am about an hour away from any Lionel Service Center so I need to rule out as much as I can before any road trip.

I followed Gunrunnerjohns advice and swapped my RL2C board over to another loco.  It didn't have Odyssey but it worked.  So that should rule out the RL2C board.

My focus now should be the DCDRS board.  Now Fred thought you would have to pull the front truck to remove the frame mounting screw.  However, I'm thinking if I remove all 4 heat sink screws/nuts the board will slide right up.  I can then fiddle with the molex as Marty recommended, swap out that board or take it for a bench test. 

This does not rule out the motherboard though. 

Thanks to all for the suggestions.  We are going to solve this one yet!

On the backside of the DCDS 6 pin connector check continuity between AC Hot and pick-up rollers, check AC Ground and truck frame. On the 4 pin connector check pins 2 & 4 reading left to right as you are looking at the plug in the top left hand corner to pin # 19 & 20 on the R2LC. Check continuity from the 10 pin connector # 1 pin to pin 24 on the R2LC

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Yes, if you take the HS screws out, you can slide the DCDRS up.  However, I'd recommend you clean everything up and put some heatsink compound on them before bolting them back down again.

Boxcar Bill, you have my attention.  I appreciate your troubleshooting plan.  If I deciphered the 24 pin connector numbering correctly, this will be top row pins. 

Molex AC Hot to middle rail ~ 1 ohm

Molex AC Ground to 3rd rail ~ 3 ohms

DCDRS 4 Pin #2 to R2LC #19 open

DCDRS 4 Pin #4 to R2L:C#20 kohms

DCDRS 10 Pin #1 to R2LC #24 kohms

Gunrunnerjohn, thanks for tip on the heat sink compound.  We're fresh out.  Ha! 

You can get HS compound at Radio Shack.

Thanks to Boxcar Bill's expertise, it's looking like we have a bad DCDRS board.

I guess I'll be in the market for Lionel driver board 691DCDSFM3, 691DCDSHM5, or something else compatible.  Lionel list is $99.95 - ouch!!

After the front coupler and now a driver board, the U30 is starting to act like a "boat" if you know what I mean. 

I have a 691-DCDS-E (EM2) in my parts here, is that compatible?  It's an Odyssey I board from an upgrade.

Hmm.  That knowledge doesn't thrill me considering what I was told years ago by Lionel.

Okay, what exactly is a DCDRS board, and what does it do that it costs $100?

Thanks,

Fred

The DCDR-S board is a DCDR that has the additional logic for Odyssey speed control input sensors and motor speed control.

STEIMS-

SOUNDS FAMILIAR-I HAVE A 18276 SEABOARD U30C AND I SHUT IT DOWN RECENTLY FINE ON THE TRACK AND I CAN'T GET IT TO RUN-NO SOUND, NO LIGHTS - NOTHING. TRIED IT CONVENTIONAL TOO AND NOTHING.

I AM LISTENING.

FREIGHTRAIN

CHECK YOUR ANTENNA WIRE TOO

No lights or anything else sounds like a connection issue from the pickups to the track.  It's rare to have that total a failure in the electronics.

Yeah, I took mine apart when I had minor problems.  Ultimately it ended up in the parts bin (fine contributions it made, too) and I bought another one.  It is impossible to get it back together correctly, in my opinion.  

Lee, do you happen to have the old DCDR board from yours still laying in the parts bin?  Just trying to get my U-boat afloat again.   

I certainly wouldn't buy another DCDR-S board, I'd replace it with the ERR Cruise Commander M for the same price.  You'll have much better cruise functionality.

Since this happened when you opened it up, presuming you didn't short anything in the process, I still believe it's something pretty simple like GGG is suggesting.

I had this problem with both my EL and BN U-boats.  In fact, it happened twice to the BN unit.  I shipped both back to Lionel for repair.  

Had to pay for the second repair on the BN unit (about $70) as it was long out of warranty.  Mike Reagan was very helpful in getting it repaired.

Any chance the invoice told you exactly what was replaced?

Thanks,

Fred

If anyone wants to send me their bad board, I would take a look at it to see if it is something simple.  G

GGG, the only thing that may have gone wrong when I placed the cab on the loco was that the cab lighting contacts could have been out of alignement.  This creates the potential to directly short out or ground those circuits.  Seems odd to cause a fault on the motor driver board.  So I would like you to check my board out.  Email sent.

I'd think that would affect the R2LC, since that's where those lights are supplied from.  Did you try swapping the R2LC with a working one?

Gunrunnerjohn, I did swap U30C RL2C board over to an operable SD-70 (non-odyssey).  The SD-70 worked fine with the U30C's board and the U30C was still stuck with the SD-70's board. 

Well, I guess that eliminates the R2LC.

I am going to throw this in because I have a Burlington U30C that wouldn't move.  It sat on the shelf for quite a while.  About 2 weeks ago, I took it out, and it ran fine.  I was pleasantly surprised.  I opened the hatch where you can change the battery and there was 'stuff' hanging down from the roof that was or was very close to contacting the motor.  I scraped away enough of the' stuff' so it wouldn't come into contact with the motors, thinking it may have stopped the motor from turning.  It has been working fine since.  I will say, the design where the roof pushes down on the contacts for the light is not the best. I was surprised when I took the hood off and saw the design-cheesy?  The motors are tall and close to the roof.  I've had this engine repaired.  To be honest, I can't remember what for.

A second thought is, this was one of first Lionel Odyssey equipped engines I believe.  I've learned that Lionel's first run technical products have their issues.  I would look into the Odyssey system as a potential source of your problem.  Maybe it thinks it's cruising along at 0 MPH. 

Just a couple thoughts.  Good luck.  Now don't even get me started on those ears that always want to break off...

Glad you were able to get yours running.  Mine won't even run with the shell off and both motors spin just fine when I twirl the flywheels.

Fred

I was going to suggest running it with the shell off.  Come to think of it, I think I tried that and the rear motor was stuck.  I don't know why it decided to start running.  From the feedback , it seems like quite a few folks have issues with this engine.  I hope I didn't just jinx myself. Long may she run???...  Best of luck. 

Great, nice to know it was also a simple repair.

Long may she sail.  Nice job figuring that out and fixing it.  I'm starting to get the idea a lot of folks post their problems with their equipment, but have no inclination of fixing it themselves.  Why post your problem if you are not going to work through what it takes to fix it?  Bring it to a service station and quit complaining.  Stuff breaks, just ask a real railroad man.  Sorry for the mini rant---Nice Job!!!

Post it on the for sale board here.  I'm looking for a low priced U33C (Lionel) if someone wants to get rid of.

HI-

This is Bill McCaughey, new to O Gauge Railroading.  My first TMCC operating unit is UP U30C-6-38419. Front & rear couplers used to unlock using CAB 1.  Neither one unlocks now. Repair shop can't figure out what the heck is wrong.  Tech replaced one coupler but no results.  I'm not schooled in Lionel's electronics, just want to run engine & build layout.

Any suggestions on fix? Perhaps I should call Lionel CS and explain issue.  Don't know what to do.

Thx

Bill

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