Locomotives from separate lines working together

In the railroad industry, it is referred to as "Power Pooling". Thus one might see a number of different railroad units MU'ed together in a consist, simply because that railroad is using other railroad units as "pay back" of horse power hours. This happens throughout the U.S. on the big class 1 railroads.

Ah!  Great info, thanks!!  Is it something that's formally tracked?  Like NS is into UP for 200 hours nation wide, and those values fluctuate as usage comes and goes?  Or is it more assumed that it all evens out anyway?

This goes way back.  Back in the 60's I remember seeing Great Northern F's, NYC U25B's and UP GP30's coming out of Cicero on Burlington trains.

Rusty

scolba posted:

Ah!  Great info, thanks!!  Is it something that's formally tracked?  Like NS is into UP for 200 hours nation wide, and those values fluctuate as usage comes and goes?  Or is it more assumed that it all evens out anyway?

The railroads definitely keep track of their loco mileage spent on other railroads in run-through service. As a general rule I think they try to balance out the mileage with additional loco "loans" if necessary. Otherwise there may be monetary charges but I don't know any details of how that works. With modern locos they probably track horsepower-hours instead of just time and mileage.

N&W locos on UP transcon near Cheyenne 1981

When I worked for the Penn Central in the 1960s we had Chinese Red CBQ units coming into Cincinnati with NYC/PRR units. We had a regular Detroit-Atlanta run-through autoparts train that used any PC/PRR/NYC units along with Southern Rwy units.
When I worked for BN/BNSF out of Sheridan WY to Laurel MT I've had CP, CN, MILW, SP, DRGW, KCS, FerroMex, IC, MU'd with BN/BNSF units on my trains. We regularly had CSX and NS units with BNSF units. And yes you'll see UP & BNSF units on one train. Here are 2 UP and 2 BN/BNSF units exiting the MRL (Montana Rail Link, former BN/NP) Bozeman Tunnel with a BNSF Gillette WY to Portland OR coal train. Got all that

I have heard a story that one railroad was so much in debt with hp/hrs that it actually leased new locomotives built to the one it owed standards to pay the debt.  Maybe somebody here can confirm?

Trains Magazine did an excellent article all about Power Pooling and leasing a few months ago. It is a complex process that likely is a major source of paperwork for everyone at the office.

I don't think anyone has mentioned "run through" trains yet. Say an oil train originates in BNSF territory with the end destination being in NS territory. Instead of changing locomotives halfway through the trip they will just refuel the BNSF engines and NS crews will run the train to its end destination.

Wow, fantastic info guys! I love this place!

lol, wyhog, you had me head, and everyone's around me head spinning!! Beautiful pics!! 

Not quite the same thing, but check this out, probably taken about 1963. This was probably the last place in the US where steam of two different companies (the ET&WNC and North American Rayon) interchanged with each other. The location today would be referred to as between the WalMart and Sycamore Shoals museum in Elizabethton, TN.

Amazingly, the Porter fireless 0-6-0 ran into the early 1990s! Both locos still exist today and the one on the left is now at TVRM and best know as Southern RR 630...

You should see some of the BNSF engines that Ive had to pick up when I worked the UP interchange train at the West Colton UP yard (old SP yard). They ( UP ) would run the BNSF engines into the ground, and past the required inspection date. Out of fuel, water, low oil, batteries completely dead so the interior lights won't even come on, burned out headlights, missing walk way lights, mu cables torn, broken glad hands etc. So we have to pick it up with the rest of our power and drag it to Barstow for repairs. 

The following day, we pick up UP engines from Barstow to take back to West Colton and drop off at their diesel service. Guess what, run into the ground and towed DIC (dead in consist) with our power. It's like a battle of who can tear up the other power the most. Sad really.

The UP Heritage engine 1996 sat in the tie up tracks at San Bernardino for over a week this spring. Someone went in the cab and pee'd all over the place and then locked up the cab. Yes, it was over 100 degrees outside. It was finally picked up and drug over to West Colton and dropped off. What a nice surprise for their hostlers to walk into. 

Interesting subject. Did pooling take place in the final days of steam?

Ron H posted:

Interesting subject. Did pooling take place in the final days of steam?

No.

Here is a  link to a related forum discussion on this subject. 

https://ogrforum.com/t...11#48734075380195811

scolba posted:

Ah!  Great info, thanks!!  Is it something that's formally tracked? 

Oh yes!  

The railroads all get together for mutual interests, such as legislative matters, but when it comes to accounting, they figure it right down to the last dime, on division of revenue from interchanged cars, the cost of repairs done to one railroad's cars by another railroad, and on the division of locomotive horsepower hours.

Are there any other restriction on the type or age of the locomotive that a railroad is allowed to share?

Whenever I see locomotives from other Class I railroads on BNSF, Union Pacific or Iowa Interstate tracks around town, it is usually a newer locomotive. My limited understanding of railroads leads me to conclude that I see modern locomotives (made since the 90’s like SD70s, Dash-9s), since there are more of them in service at this time compared to locomotives from previous decades & since the newer locomotives are rated at higher horsepower compared to diesel locomotives from earlier decades, a railroad could meet their “Power Pooling” obligations by sharing fewer modern locomotives.

But are there any other reason why I don’t see Norfolk Southern SD40 locomotives or Canadian Pacific EMD 710-ECO rebuilt locomotives (SD30 or GP22) on other railroads?

These are just my opinion,

Thanks,

Naveen Rajan

Generally, the class I railroads will be "power pooling", or interchanging, only the newer high horsepower units. Why bother with only a 3000HP "older" unit, when 4000, to 4400 horsepower combinations are needed for the run-through trains, and associated shared horsepower hours?

Here's a mixed bag on the BNSF, circa 2002:

The training unit is a GP30.

Rusty

Rusty,

I don't think something from 14 years ago is representative of todays "power pooling".