MTH 3 to 2 Conversions, worth it?

Quite a few other questions to ask here: would you be totally starting over from scratch and are these the prototypical locomotives that you might need to achieve your goals?  Are the 2-rail analogs really available or at least readily found?

 When I can't get a RTR 2 rail engine, like the MTH SD80/90MAC for example, I have to convert it and don't mind the extra cost. After several attempts, I do get tired of the extra work. Then I wait for what I want in RTR models.

 The pilots offered by a member here on the forum make the job much better than using the few 3 rail common pilots with home made shims that don't always match the model correctly. It does get expensive though. So I wouldn't do every model. The most generic ones I would consider selling and buying 2 rail versions RTR.

I don't have a known direction yet, looking at options and weighing them all out.  Local group is looking at starting a modular 2 rail club.  I am leaning toward N Scale for my home personal layout to accomplish certain goals and possibly doing to O 2 Rail Modular to accomplish other goals.  Depends on how the local club progresses if it all works out.

I do the conversion of MTH, I buy the 2 rail version when available. because right now I have three rails  However the next layout will be 2 rail   Wish MTH made all premier 2/3 rail, but then again I can save money by not buying.      

Clem

It is a hobby.  If you like to fool with stuff, convert.  If you do not care to enjoy tinkering, do what you do for a living for the same amount of time, take the proceeds, and buy 2-rail.

Here is a caveat: 2-rail is not designed quite the way 3-rail is, so there is more care involved in making things work reliably.  If your desire is to put it on the track and turn it on, big flanges and fewer insulation challenges will make your life easier.

My hobby enjoyment is making things and making them work.  A completed, tested locomotive is often ensconced in a display cabinet for decades.

I am currently in the middle of converting two MTH N&W articulated locos (a Y-3 and a Y-6b) to 2 rail DC operation.  As most of you know, I have done a lot of this kind of conversion.  It is very time consuming for me and is becoming tedious and I have the proper machine tools and special tooling required to do this work on steam models.  I will be closing my shop for conversions and other work for the months of June, July and August to get some of my own steam loco models (not MTH or Lionel) completed.  I will start up conversions again after Labor Day in September.

If a model you desire has been made in 2 rail I would try to find one.  MTH is producing more two rail models than they once did.  There are plenty of 2 rail locomotives for sale every week on ebay.

I still at times convert a 3 rail diesel to 2 rail DC for a modeler.  I find Lionel diesels more difficult to convert than those made by MTH or older ones produced by KLine.  In any case, I remove all TMCC or DCS components in the process.

Joe

Here is a converted MTH - it started life capable of 2-rail operation, but it was less than satisfying.  As I got in to it, it became clear that MTH had used a truly strange insulation philosophy - insulated at the axle, with siderods also insulated!  Then I noticed that the cylinder block was undersize.  Finally, no matter how hard I try, I cannot stomach U shaped boilers, so to fix all that - new frame, cylinders, drivers, gears.  Recalibrated flywheel for four chuffs.  Brass boiler belly attached with machine screws and JB Weld. Happy, but still no factory reset, so no bell or whistle.  Just removed the battery for safety - over ten years old, but no evidence of leaking, and still holding a charge.

Cash in and start anew. Waaaaaaaaaaay more options if you do that. There will be enough other stuff to do that you WON'T get bored. Reread Joe F's post above!

Simon

What era and prototype are you modelling?  How many locomotives do you have today?   Are you planning to run DC, DCS or DCC?

Also curious what's driving you to 2R ?  besides the lack of a center rail! 

Haven't decided on era and prototype.  Looking to see what comes of the idea of a local modular club.  Total Locos in 3 rail is 10.  Not too many.  I will be running DCC.

As for what is driving me to 2 rail, it's the realism and detail I want to get into.  In the end, although the 3rd rail in and of itself doesn't bother me, it really creates more problems than it solves.  Originally it was an ingenious solution to an electrical issue, but these days it's a really antiquated way of managing that problem.

I launched back into O for my oldest son, now 11, when he was 2 with an MTH Railking Daylight set.  I didn't know a lot at the time as I had not been into O since I was a kid.  I was at the time deep into a 300 square foot HO layout with my dad.  I liked the features the MTH set had for my son.  I really liked the PS2 sound and smoke and then began to learn how far O had come.  When we bought our house I began adding more 3 rail items and finding more about the scale items offered in O.  I had a layout under construction in 2013-2014 then a house fire in 2014 put that on hold, I also lost a fair amount of stuff as the hobby room was the main one damaged in the fire.  When I got back around to it in 2015 I kept at 3 rail O but toyed with going N or HO (my dad and I had dismantled an sold off the HO stuff, he lost interest).  As time progresses I lost interest in non scale items and have been pushing toward scale.  But I also have not been satisfied with what I want and how much space I have.  I have a thread about this in the HONGZ forum.  I have liked the idea of 2 Rail for a while but also realize the space issue won't go away anytime soon.  Fred Swain reached out about starting a local modular club which peaked my interest.  I wasn't interested in the local O gauge club in Houston as their focus seems to be more traditional and tinplate.

So to satisfy my desire for the larger scale, this modular club idea would work.  To satisfy my desire for more prototypical things in my allotted space, N scale will work.

There comes a point in modeling were the many non scale items tend to stick out more and more.  I thought about 3 Rail Scale but figure at that point why not just go 2 rail?  Final point is the two control systems in 3 Rail.  I like if I go 2 Rail and N Scale or whatever, I can cover it with one system.

The last thing I like about 2 Rail is it will force me to narrow my focus some as Mode RR ADD is an issue I deal with.  I looked also at S Scale, but to me it's more of a compromise.  Bigger than HO but with very limited offerings, not as big and impressive as O.

Thanks all to the insight so far.  I will most likely cash out of everything and go from there.

OK, that helps refine some thoughts around your question, with any PS2 locomotive and your desire to run DCC it will require you either upgrade them to PS3 or install a DCC decoder.  IMO, if you're going to consider upgrading a Premier locomotive from PS2 to PS3 and run DCC, might as well rip out the DCS and install one of the excellent DCC/Sound decoders that we have now in O Scale, such as the Tsunami 2, ESU Loksound XL or Select, or the TCS WOW Sound. Any of them give you excellent motor, lighting, sound and effects.  

Next aspect is if you really are serious about a particular locomotive model, roadname, road number, MTH doesn't always have scale wheel/fixed pilot versions, nor are they often readily available in most cases, as they produce fewer of these versions of locomotives. Something to consider.  Having done numerous 3R loco conversions to 2R by changing them to fixed pilot using shims, aftermarket pilots, changing out the wheelsets, extending the handrails, upgrading the pilot details, gutting the electronics and installing DCC decoders.  It really depends on what your interests are and what you can find in the roadname, models you want.   As many have already mentioned, if you start with a fixed pilot/scale wheel model best to start there, but know you can make decent model representations using 3R models too, especially MTH's newer models.

I wouldn't convert any PS2 to 2 rail, only PS3 since it's DCC compatible.  Originally I had a digitrax system, but will probably buy the ESU Cab Control system.