MTH RJ-17 SUBWAY ENGINE PROBLEM

First, I assume that you mean DCS, not DCC.

I also assume that the lights to which you refer are the coach lights, only. I expect that the headlights and marker lights don't work, either. The coach lights will generally be on whenever the engine's getting power and have nothing to do with the engine's electronics. The other lights require that the engine be operating before they come on.

It's possible that the engine's DCS ID# has gotten outside of the normal range. If you're running DCS 4.10 opt 4.20, you can try to recover the engine. Assuming that your TIU is #1, proceed as follows:

• Make sure that the engine is the only engine that's getting power and that it is, indeed, on a track connected to Fixed Channel #1
• Put power to Fixed Channel #1 Input
• Press: Menu/System/Engine Setup/Recover Engine

So, If you operate it conventionally with out DCS it still does not work?  Do you hear a relay click when you apply voltage?  It is possible your PS-2 5V board has gone bad.  G

Thank you for getting back to me so quickly.

  Hi Barry, Yes, I meant DCS.  Yes again, the coach lights are the ones that come on.  I will do what you recommended.  However, I probably will not be able to do it until at least next week due to scheduling conflicts.  I am also embarassed to admit that my DCS software is not up to date and I will also have to do that first.  I do not have a serial port available on my PC. So, I have to get a 9-pin serial male to usb cable. Will this cable do the job. It may be a while but,I will let you know how it goes.

  Thanks again, Clarke  

   Hi GGG, that is correct it does the same thing when I operate it conventionally (also when just in a maintenance cradle).  I do not hear a relay click when I apply power.  How can I test for a bad PS-2 5v board. 

    Thanks again, Clarke

Clarke,

The cable you want is a USB to serial adapter cable that comes with a driver (on CD) for your version of Windows. I recommend the Radio Shack cable.

When you ran the engine in the cradle, did you connect the transformer directly to the engine, bypassing the TIU? If you did and the problem persisted, then you most likely have an electrical problem in the engine. In this case, the Recover Engine feature won't resolve the problem. Rather, you can look inside the engine for any broken, unplugged or pinched wires.

Hi Barry,

Yes, I understand the cable should include serial to usb capability and have a built-in chipset such as pl-2303.

When I ran the engine in the cradle I did connect the transformer directly to the engine.  That is, ground to the wheels chasis and live to the pick-up roller.  When I replaced the battery I did not see any problem wires.  However, I was not looking for any, so now I will do that.   Even if that is the problem, I still will go ahead and update the software.  It sounds like a good thing to do.

Thanks,   Clarke

Thanks again to everyone.  It now looks like the 5v chip is either fried or scrambled.  I contacted MTH, have not heard back yet, about them replacing chip.  Do you know of anyone who offers this service or can chip be purchased and installed by a handy individual.  Clarke

Clarke,  There is no 5V chip per say.  If this is the PS-2 5V board, and it has died.  The only recourse is installing a PS-2 3V board that has 5V connectors.  This also requires the 8.4V battery to be changed out to a 2.4V AA, and the speaker changed to a 4 ohm.  I just recently did this conversion on one.  It is tight, but it can be done.  Unfortunately, parts for the boards and the conversion kit (battery/speaker/bracket and hardware) is about $234 MSRP, then add labor.  You can contact me via my profile e-mail if your interested.  

You can buy the whole PS/2 conversion kit for $179, why buy those parts for more?

If this is the PS-2 5V board, and it has died.  The only recourse is installing a PS-2 3V board that has 5V connectors

 

You can buy the whole PS/2 conversion kit for $179, why buy those parts for more?

Unfortunately, neither of the above solutions will resolve the problem completely. The 5 volt subway boards are different form other 5 volt boards because why have extra RAM for the actual transit announcements and programming of subway routes.

If you do get one of the aforementioned 3 volt boards, you'd also have to ask MTH to convert your subway's sound file to a 3 volt version. Alternatively, you could use a sound file from an existing 3 volt PS2 subway set.

This and a whole lot more is all in "The DCS O Gauge Companion 2nd Edition", now available for purchase as an eBook or a printed book from MTH's web store site! Click on the link below to go to MTH's web page for the book!

Because there is a lot more labor involved when you then have to gut the original wiring harness.  The kit harness are generic with very long wires.  It is an option, but the hours involved for this type of engine go up taking that route.   G

My thanks to all.  I certainly now have a lot to think about.  Barry, I just recently got your book and have started reading it, it seems like a great reference tool.  I also made a verbal copy of it so I can listen to it in the car.  Listening is safer than reading while driving.  It of course lacks the visuals, but does help to reinforce my old memory when I read the actual printed book.  Thanks again, Clarke

I would think taking the guts out of an existing locomotive could be more difficult, especially if the wires don't reach.

I bought one of the upgrade kits, so I'll be able to see first hand how much effort it takes.

I also made a verbal copy of it so I can listen to it in the car.

I'd be interested in knowing how you did that. Please E-mail me off-forum using the address in my profile.

Thanks!

Out of curiousity, what tests led to the conclusion?

That is what I said, so what is your point?  When you use the PS-2 3V with 5V connectors you can save in place all the existing wire harness except the battery charge harness.  The board goes in the same vicinity and you plug in the 12, 7, 4 pin connectors. Actually in most upgrade installation the harness are too long and you need to cut and splice.  Having excessive wire only leads to a pinch and further troubles.  G

Since your RJ-17 was shelf-sitting for so long anyway, another idea is to wait to see how PS3 subway plays out. That is, you’re forced into a $200+ “upgrade” to PS2-3V for what amounts to a repair. For what might be a similar price you’d get a true upgrade (as well as the repair) by waiting for PS3. True meaning more features.

AFAIK PS2-3V boards will be discontinued once PS3 comes fully online so going directly to PS3 might skip the entire PS2-3V step should you need additional work in the future. Stated differently, if all this happened 1 year from now, the PS2-3V option could be history.

Maybe and maybe not.  It will be interesting.  The PS-2 upgrades where made to cover on the original PS-1 engines.   You need to make a lot of changes including lights.  Don't be surprised if a PS-3 upgrade kit is a lot more than the current PS-2. 

It is one thing to upgrade from non-command to command, it will be another to upgrade from Command to Command. 

It is equivalent to saying everyone should gut there TMCC and add Legacy.  Not sure that is viable.  It will be interesting to see if folks want to upgrade from a PS-2 to a PS-3 especially if the cost of parts and labor go above $300 just to get rid of a battery, get LED lights and maybe an improvement in Sound.  G