MTH to offer "puffing smoke" in future S Scale models

Dodge:

 

Thanks for posting this tidbit from the MTH Volume 2 catalog.  Does this mean there is a consolidation in the near future?  The bones keep coming.

 

Roger

Roger

 

if you were to dig through all of Derek's notch 6 podcasts, I believe there is one where Andy E from MTH says that the S helper consolidation is in line for production. I too have high hopes for MTH S gauge 2015/2016 catalog.  

 

Ben

Not much of a surprise. All of the former S-Helper products are in line to be made depending on sales according to Andy E.

That's what I was thinking, Roger.  MTH most likely won't produce any new steam models in S for a while.  I think that the consolidation was the only steam produced by S helper.  Perhaps as Ben noted, we might see a 2-8-0 listed in the soon to be released catalog.

Right, the 2-8-0 was the only steam locomotive SHS produced.  Before the end, they were stating to collect data for a B&O 4-6-0.

 

Rusty

I met with Andy at York for the interview for S the Gaugian.  He told me what is in their plans for the 2015-16 catalog and there is not going to be a steam locomotive in it.

I talked to Andy at a show last year and he said that the 2-8-0 was probably about 3 years away. So maybe it will be announced some time next year and delivered in 2017? I would wager that would be the soonest you would see it. Likely it will slip even later.

I wonder at what point MTH S gauge sales cover the cost of the purchase of S helper?  I know they will never tell, but I would guess it will take a few years and a few catalogs before it happens.

I'm sure "newly tool" items will not come around till MTH comes out of the S helper purchase in a profit. 

Ben

Right now, I'll settle for the F3's to show up, which I guess is now June-July 2015.

 

Rusty

Just posted by MTH a couple hours ago.

 

http://www.mthtrains.com/sgauge/spotlight/07_2015/a

 

Hmm.  In their features list for the S scale F3 it says:

 

"Proto-Scale 3-2 3-Rail/2-Rail Conversion Capable"

 

Huh? Silly me, I thought S scale WAS 2 rail?

Ahhh, the wonders of cut 'n paste...

 

Well, MTH sells 2/3rail O, 2/3(stud) rail HO.  Maybe this is a way to expands S?

 

Rusty

That is a marketing piece and probably not linked to reality.  It says this...

• Remote Controlled S Gauge Proto-Coupler

And they dropped this from the engine.  Not enough space to have a big enough coil to operate the coupler.

That was supposedly one of the big hold-ups for the F3's.

 

Rusty

 "a marketing piece and probably not linked to reality."

 

  unless the reality is it's easier to hype puffing smoke and 3 rail couplers than it is to actually produce some S scale models? ......DaveB

I`ve heard that Proto-3 uses 'Muscle Wire' now and that the  problem with the Remote Couplers was partly the proper Shank Length. I believe also the different Sizes of Couplers require different electrical setups for the 'Muscle Wire', which takes a lot of technical development.

If I were still in S scale, I would applaud this "loss".  That's one of the hokiest things about MTH's HO offerings: Oversized couplers to accommodate the razzle-dazzle of "electro uncoupling", which 99% of the HO community could not care less about.

 

 

 

Unfortunately, things like electro-couplers are what the non-scale (meaning deep flange non-Kadee) folks seem to be more and more demanding of.

 

All one has to do is look at the 3-rail side for folks wishing the Williams by Bachmann 44 tonner had electro-couplers.

 

It seems to me that many folks in the hobby not in HO and N are more enamored with the "bells and whistles" (bling?) of a locomotive than the locomotive itself.

 

Rusty

As an average guy just getting into S Scale, I could care less about smoke, remote couplers and iPad apps to run my locos.  I need the fundamentals...track, turnouts, modern cars and fair priced locomotives (SD40-2s).  For now I am getting by with picking up "closet releases" of SHS on EBAY but if MTH wants my money to cover the SHS buyout, then offer newcomers what they need.

All very good points.

 

S Gauge is a strange animal at best.

Everybody wants scale proportioned equipment.

The high-railers want their Flyer compatible couplers. Which I completely understand. Electro-couplers are a perk, but I'd rather have close coupling than having it projecting way out of the pilot because of a coil. Even in high-rail.

Now the scalers; does MTH include another scale electro-coupler in the box, or just give us a Kadee compatible mounting pad?

I'd say always include the pad, because if the scale electro-coupler would stick out too far, it would end up in the box increasing the inventory of stuff I don't use yet pay for. 

But until all 7 units I have on order land at the local LHS, and MTH matures their S product line to make models other than the MTH line, we may have a long wait to find out.

Flyer compatible and mounting pads would keep me and many others happy, and is the cheap way to go to boot.

 

I agree with Ham.  Personally I would have been happy getting my new MTH F3's with just kadee pads alot sooner.  The muscle wire, while a cool idea,  delayed these engines by about a year.  IMO, on O scale engines and rolling stock, standard factory couplers look not too bad - but on S scale stuff they ARE Lobster claws.  

 

Lower the price for me with less bells and whistles (even sound).  Just DCC control with smooth speed range and a few lights is all.

Well, speaking as a deep flange non Kadee kind of guy, I am NOT enamored of the "bells and whistles", and would be delighted with the same product as SHS put out on the market (i.e some thing that could be converted to kadees, that will run on AF track on AC but can be converted easily to DCC and scale flanges with a sound system with a horn and a bell and something that sound like a Diesel ) .

 

PLEASE do not make the same mistake as LIONEL often does and assume that the "deep Flange, non Kadee" guys who are currently modeling in S have the same wants and desires as the "deep flange, non-Kadee" guys in O gauge. I don't want a giraffe car, and aquarium car, or a NASCAR or Looney Tunes Paint Scheme.  

 

Little Tommy

I'll come in on the other end, F3s with good sounds and command (dcs) for me.  I would prefer operating couplers but the lack of them for a more timely release is fine with me.  

 

Ben. 

Here's the F3 features per the latest press release earlier this week:

 

...otherwise these might be my only MTH F3 purchase.

 

Rusty:

 

For the sake of all the scalers, I hope so too. However, since they're determined to hold onto the electro-coupler concept, I'm afraid it just won't be.  IMHO, there's simply too much stuff to cram alongside/inside a coupler for it to remain near scale in size and shank length.

 

 

In MTH HO-Scale, there is no Tether between the A and B Units and the Electronics make them sync in speed to each other in an MU and they are built so you can switch out regular scale couplers. I would think that this is being done for S-Gauge also. MTH has announced that they are now moving these Features into O-Gauge.

 It's not really about the stuff inside, it's about the bracket and coupler SHS supplied with each F-unit.  The Flyer-like coupler was mounted on the the trucks with a special bracket like on the SW's (and the gap was huge...)

 

...while these were included for us scale guys or those Flyer/Hirail folks who wanted to reduce the gap.

 

And they also were available for separate sale.  I used them to body mount the couplers on my AM E8's, which had no provision for body-mount Kadee's on the rear of the unit. 

 

I'm hoping MTH didn't "engineer out" this excellent way of handling things.

 

 SHS actually had a tether of sorts.  There were two plugs right above the end doors

 

and they also included two small jumper wires.  These were intended primarily to keep the 3 position electronic reverse units in sync (just in case) for the AC guys.  SHS really did try to think of everything.

 

Rusty

As a follow up to my comments about close coupling between the SHS F-units, this arrived over the ether from the SHS Yahoo Group:

 

"Dear Paul, several things, our 01295 KD style coupler sold out before we sold to MTH. I do hope they make them soon. As for the supplied screws, they are metric, 1.6m. The English conversion is 0-80.
  This is a coupler we never wanted to make. When we were in the design phase of the F3 we could see from the drawings that the Kadee 802 box were too long and found they interfered with the rear truck. I called Larry Edwards of Kadee and begged them to produce another S Scale coupler to fit our F units. He said that they had no interest in tooling a 2nd S Scale coupler. So, we based our coupler gear box on the KD #5 with the 802 head and screw spacings and placed them on a bracket for easy installation on the rear of the F units. We ended up with the same clearance problems with the ore cars and the 01295 was born.
Best,
Don"

 

Rusty