MTH Z-4000 Question

Max throttle on a Z 4000 is around 23 - 24 volts.  Isn't that dangerously high for command equipment?

Bill

I’ve unfortunately never known any way to do that.

Although just a thought the WTIU issue has been chopped power but don’t you use 180PH? Those are just a transformer so they would output a smooth sine wave is there anything else that could be messing with the WTIU

@zhubl posted:

I’ve unfortunately never known any way to do that.

Although just a thought the WTIU issue has been chopped power but don’t you use 180PH? Those are just a transformer so they would output a smooth sine wave is there anything else that could be messing with the WTIU

The new WTIU freaks about when using either the 180PH or the ZW-L. Apparently they are not actually true full sine wave. If I use the 180PH or ZW-L the WTIU keeps cutting the power off and on like it things there's a short going on. Mike Wolf made a post about it a few weeks ago. I think they're going to roll out a software patch for it.

-Eric

@ogaugenut posted:

Max throttle on a Z 4000 is around 23 - 24 volts.  Isn't that dangerously high for command equipment?

Bill

No

A not widely known "special test" mode exists.

First, disconnect all wiring from the Z4000

Then you need that special audio cable- the one we previously use to program and upgrade TIU firmware.

You then plug that audio cable into the 2 outermost black power connection posts. This puts the Z4000 in special programming mode. Caution- only plug into the 2 outer black posts.

Power on the Z4000 with both handles raised fully. It will now be in "factory" "special test" program mode as it senses the audio cable plugged between both black posts.

Press the bell and whistle button 5 times each first starting with the left channel, then the right channel- bell, bell, bell, bell, bell, pause, then whistle, whistle, whistle, whistle, whistle

Press the direction button on the right channel side to store the setting. This mode on both channels in theory allows it to power on with handles up (the 5 bell, and 5 whistle on each side).

Lower both handles- power off the transformer. Last- remove the audio programming cable.

It is very frustrating.  I was having the same issue with my WTIU, and the Lionel 180 w power house bricks, being that the WTIU would shut off the power randomly.  I called Mario’s trains, where I purchased it from and they did not have any information.  They offered to exchange my WTIU for a new one so I sent it in.  Now I did post this issue about a month ago, but no one responded.  My point is with MTH, who do you contact to trouble shoot issues?  

@ogaugenut posted:

Max throttle on a Z 4000 is around 23 - 24 volts.  Isn't that dangerously high for command equipment?

Bill

@ericstrains.com posted:

No

I would exercise some caution here as Lionel does indicate in many manuals not to exceed 19 volts especially in Lionchief sets.

@Vernon Barry posted:

A not widely known special "test mode" exists.

First, disconnect all wiring from the Z4000

Then you need that special audio cable- the one we previously use to program and upgrade TIU firmware.

You then plug that audio cable into the 2 outermost black power connection posts. This puts the Z4000 in special programming mode. Caution- only plug into the 2 outer black posts.

Power on the Z4000 with both handles raised fully. It will now be in "factory" program mode as it senses the audio cable plugged between both black posts.

Press the bell and whistle button 5 times each first starting with the left channel, then the right channel- bell, bell, bell, bell, bell, pause, then whistle, whistle, whistle, whistle, whistle

Press the direction button on the right channel side to store the setting.

Lower both handles- power off the transformer. Last- remove the audio programming cable.

How do you get it back out of this factory mode?

@Jim Sandman posted:

How do you get it back out of this factory mode?

Same steps, but the left channel direction button as the last command. That reverses the "special test" mode.

Power off, remove the cable- it works as normal.

If a user cannot get their Z4000 into "special test" mode, it might not be possible and that firmware (serial number) version didn't have the "special test".

Either way- it returns back to normal operation- just won't let you keep the handles up and power on.

@Vernon Barry posted:

A not widely known "special test" mode exists.

First, disconnect all wiring from the Z4000

Then you need that special audio cable- the one we previously use to program and upgrade TIU firmware.

You then plug that audio cable into the 2 outermost black power connection posts. This puts the Z4000 in special programming mode. Caution- only plug into the 2 outer black posts.

Power on the Z4000 with both handles raised fully. It will now be in "factory" "special test" program mode as it senses the audio cable plugged between both black posts.

Press the bell and whistle button 5 times each first starting with the left channel, then the right channel- bell, bell, bell, bell, bell, pause, then whistle, whistle, whistle, whistle, whistle

Press the direction button on the right channel side to store the setting. This mode on both channels in theory allows it to power on with handles up (the 5 bell, and 5 whistle on each side).

Lower both handles- power off the transformer. Last- remove the audio programming cable.

Yeah that didn't work. If it works it must be for some older version of the Z-4000 because those black posts are in no way designed to accept the audio cable. I tried it with the audio cable as well just a plain wire between the outer black posts with no luck. I guess I'm stuck with it like it is.

-Eric

I doubt any Z4000 has 1/8" stereo jacks as common connections.  I think someone would have noticed and asked about it along time ago.

@ericstrains.com posted:

I guess I'm stuck with it like it is.

-Eric

You could always pick up a Z4000 Receiver and use your DCS remote to control the Z4000:

@H1000 posted:

You could always pick up a Z4000 Receiver and use your DCS remote to control the Z4000:

That's some next-level stuff.  The information is buried in the DCS manual - page 101.  I didn't know that the receiver was available as a separate item, although finding it with or without the remote control will be a challenge.  The ones I saw on eBay are ridiculously expensive.

I wonder if one of the electronics geniuses on the forum could reverse-engineer one.

@H1000 posted:

You could always pick up a Z4000 Receiver and use your DCS remote to control the Z4000:

Well since the WTIU does away with the remote, that would be weird to just have the remote around just to manage the Z-4000. Maybe I'll get a few more Z-1000's instead.

I could get the MTH 40-4001 Z-4000 remote control set. It comes with the remote interface and a special remote just for the Z-4000.

@ericstrains.com posted:

Well since the WTIU does away with the remote, that would be weird to just have the remote around just to manage the Z-4000. Maybe I'll get a few more Z-1000's instead.

If it matters for your scenario I don't think the Z-1000s are pure sine wave. Thought I'd mention it since it is part of this discussion, Pure/Chopped.

@DaddyChooChoo posted:

If it matters for your scenario I don't think the Z-1000s are pure sine wave. Thought I'd mention it since it is part of this discussion, Pure/Chopped.

The Z1000 brick does output a pure sine wave. When you use a Z-Controller to vary the voltage, it will chop the wave.

@H1000 posted:

The Z1000 brick does output a pure sine wave. When you use a Z-Controller to vary the voltage, it will chop the wave.

Excellent distinction!