New gateway to Everest

Hmmmm, at over 16,000 feet elevation, they better have oxygen available for passengers, or pressurized passenger cars.

In Tom Zoellner's book TRAIN, he has a chapter about riding some of the new Chinese lines into these very high mountainous regions, and talks about his interviews with government officials about the reasons the country built this lines.  It is one of the more fascinating chapters in the book. China is expanding its rail lines greatly including these areas that, the book says, are questioned by the World Bank and such as to if it really is good use of money.  But its their money they are wasting if it is a waste, and I'm glad they did it.  Kudos to them.

I see the government having other motives. Military control and natural resources. That would justify such an investment under the guise of tourism.

Sorry for the rough edge, but it is the Chinese.

>>and talks about his interviews with government officials about the reasons the country built this lines.

Hey people, it's a TOTALITARIAN country.  You have NO rights.  You are guilty until proven innocent, if even then. The government has control of EVERY aspect of your life (think of the one child rule).  The only "freedom" allowed is that which the "leaders" believe benefits the country as a whole. 

Trains provide for closer control of travelers than highways.   

Be thankful you live in a country where you can get in your car and drive anywhere at any time for any reason without hindrance.  

Chinese are not the evil empire, or even Klingons.  Their government has morphed considerably since Mao and communism and while the government and the people are socialst, I have great respect for the Chinese people and culture.  I also admire a good deal about their government, even though I recognize that they don't have a system of justice I would wish to live within, and have a spotty record on human rights (well, so do we, to a lot of Europeans I also respect greatly).  As a people and as a government, they value individuality and personal freedom less and stoic cooperativeness with an adoption of the "team's  view more.

Whatever China's government flaws, I admire their ability to get things done, to formulate and execute truly visionary ideas: they concieve of and build entirely new cities rather than let the ones they have (well, except for Bejing) grow too large, and they are building what will clearly be the best rail system in the world.  Of course politics comes into it a lot.  It did the last time we did something similar (the interstate road system comes to mind). they are far from perfect, but then neither are we or anyone else.

I firmly believe that through most of this century the US will still be a, if not the only, world leader.  But the Chinese have a willingness to work as good as any culture on this planet, and a government that is lightening up on the domestic front and can get things done (unlike some other countries i can think of).  I think it quite possible the first human to set foot on Europa will be Chinese, and I think it more than likely the first human to boldly go where no one has gone before and set foot on a planet orbiting a star other than our own will be speaking Chinese when she does so . . . 

In the mean time, they have awesome trains . . . and we don't.  We rode back from Baltimore on the Silver Star last night.  25 mph for more than four hours or our scheduled eight hour trip that was much longer because of bad track.  They had to stop twice to shut down the train and everything so they could reset breakers because the lights in the cars kept going out due to some overload or something.  

However, as those who saw the 60 Minutes report this past Sunday know, they're also building huge cities with no one in them. Miles and miles and miles of empty buildings in these ghostly cities. Rampant out-of-control building because of speculation is fueling an enormous and dangerous bubble, which, if it bursts, will endanger the entire economy.

2 Billion people, (China)  makes 300 million (U.S.) look very small, though most of the world production input centers around 300 million (Chineses) along the coast.   The world has become very small in the last 10 years.  Those huge oceans have become ponds.  My daughter and I were talking this morning about the company she works for, most of the conversation was about China. 

Absolutely right, and there is this.  Take all those couple of billion people, and take out the educated, professional, making middle-class or better income group that matches the profile of the US, and you have about 350 - 400 million -- i.e., about equal to the US. Those folks and the government have the other 1.5 billion or so less well to do people they have to help get boosted  up the economic ladder as their challenge.  I'm not sure we could do any better than they are doing if we had a similar challenge . . . 

A must-see video detailing some of the great engineering on this railroad:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yo7FBo4mLgU

Mark

The way they have found to run the rails over the permafrost, etc., is pretty innovative.  Good engineers over there, but then we knew that - they've been building big walls, etc., for thousands of years.

The line to Tibet is on my wife & I's list.   There is oxygen on the train and the cars are actually pressurized.  One thing disconcerting to me is that it's actually difficult to get permission from the government to go to Tibet.  The application takes months & months (we've tried.)  Once there you have to be accompanied by a government "minder".  All in all still easier than all the nanny handholding required by the Russian government to ride Rossia No.1, but still irritating.

Kent in SD

Just a note. Most noticeable altitude effects start at about 7,000 to 8,000 ft. above sea level. Maybe a day to acclimate.  12,000 ft. uncomfortable. IMO. There is also notable temperature change. Bottom of the Grand Canyon, around 2,300 ft asl. is easily 30 degrees warmer than either the South Rim, 8000 ft or the North Rim 9,000 ft.   You can punch a lot of weather change in a small area due to elevation difference. Here, close to Pittsburgh, PA, @ 800 to 1,200ft. asl., we take a lot for granted. Surprisingly high humidity, (common in this area), is good training for higher elevation/low humidity activity.  Internal combustion engines also have issues with altitude/lack of oxygen.