Plywood thickness for benchwork

I have built numerous layouts over the past 50 years or so. I never have used anything thicker than 1/2" plywood for the base. Have never had any kind of warping problems. Now, I am preparing to build what will likely be my last layout. it will only be 4x8. I am using 1x4 framework, with 12" centers, and then overlaying that with 1/4" plywood. On top of the plywood I am placing a layer of 2" thick pink foam insulation board. I do not expect to have any stability problems using the 1/4" plywood with this type of spacing and overlay. I have also used 3/8" plywood in the past. That worked well too. The older I get, the thinner I want to plywood, due to weight of the product. My back can not handle what it used to.

You might be fine with a 1/2" plywood or Oriented Strand Board (OSB) product...one way to control the effectiveness and performance of the sheet product is  the below table frame structure and span.  I used  2 x 4's, 24" on center with 1/2" BC  plywood from a big box store without issue.  You'd save some money rather than using 3/4" and lifting and carrying the sheets is a easier on the back...

I think 3/4 inch is overkill.

I used 5/8 plywood on 2x3 framing (16" apart) 2x3 legs too

Most of the layout is over 30 years old, some 40.  No problems with warping. Held my 200 pounds when needed.

Stay away from cheaper compressed board - hard to screw into and heavy as heck! OSB is ok

I once built a 6x8x10 layout using nothing but 1" thick rigid foam insulation on a 2x4 base with 24" crossmembers. Admittedly, it was only a single perimeter run of RealTrax with dozens of ceramic buildings on it. Mind you, I don’t recommend it due to noise, but it held up for a few years and was moved between rooms and the garage several times. I took it apart when my intention was to build a more permanent layout before life intervened. Also, the late late Jim Barrett did a whole series in the magazine featuring 1/2" plywood on 1x3 framing. I believe it’s available in the digital section.

Hi ,  I used 5/8 ths inch thick plywood or as sold 19/32  inches  @ $ 28  a sheet at Lowe’s .     See my post under my SteamPossum name of my build / framing.    Also 1/4 inch foam for sound deadening.  

Thank you guys for the help. I appreciate it! My wife and wallet will be happy that I don’t need 3/4 inch.

I used 1/2" Baltic Birch multi-ply, topped with 1/2" Homasote.  It's as solid as a rock, and as flat as the day it was constructed.  I've walked on it many times, 3/4" is most certainly overkill.

I used 3/4" for my shelf layout so if I had to I could space the brackets out a little more. 5+ years of mostly reliable service

Have you reviewed the info about model RR bench construction that is out there that aligns best with you planned empire?  There may be other construction techniques more economical and suited to your plan.  But,  your 15 sheets and 480sq.ft. of plywood with no gaps surely makes it easy to lay down track where you want, and be sitting right next to it while you secure it to the table.

I used 5_8 plywood 25 years ago when wood priced were reasonable.

I was heavier at the time so I was building it to be strong and flat

My 2cents don’t waste money on 3/4 plywood, or even the nicer grade of 1/2” plywood.  I used 1/2” OSB on my 40x50 layout and it is just fine, I can walk on it if needed. That being said while I would go lower on the cost of the sheet wood, but what I would not go lower cost on is the homasote layer.

Yes, Foam board is cheaper, and others will mention different types of material, but you will not be disappointed by using homasote, this in my opinion is the area not to scrimp on.  Styrofoam insulation board is NOT very effective at reducing noise like homasote, and homasote takes paint well and is a great base to add ground covering to, and it has the benefit of holding screws like to secure your track until you ballast.

you are not really building furniture, and when you have completed the layout, you will never see the plywood-OSB or even the homasote, it will all be covered in scenery.

what ever way you choose will be fine but cut cost that you can’t see and don’t matter and use the savings for things that do..

I agree 100 per cent with the last post.  That is how I do it.  1/2”  OSB with 1/2” homasote.
Just build it!  Haha

1/2 inch. Every time. With good framework it is all that is needed.

1/2" plywood is fine. I built my frame with 2x4's 24" on center, 2 - 2x4's screwed together for legs as I have the legs on casters so I can roll my 12x6 L layout to access two sides that usually sit up against walls. If you're not moving your layout around, you can go lighter than 2x4's on the construction. 3/4" plywood sheets are overkill.

625 sq ft of table built out of 1x4, 1/2" plywood and 1" foam. I weigh 230 and my wife weighs around 200. BOTH of us have been on the table at the same time with NO problems.

GoJr88,   I agree.  We used 1/2" plywood for subroadbed and 1/2" homasote for the roadbed.   One thing additionally i'd like to throw out there is that we intentionally looked for 1/2"plywood w as many plys as possible.  So we chose to use the 1/2" blondewood from the big blue box store.  It has i believe 7 plys.  - at least 6 for sure. It's a little pricey ($50some a 4x8 sheet) but very strong and smooth surface.  We cut the homasote roadbed edges at a 45 deg angle and paint it w a cheap light grey (glidden sparrow grey (from HD) to prep it for ballast.     

I used 1/2" plywood with 16" centers - rock solid benchtop, no sagging or warping.

Going by the prices at my Depot, you would save $12.00 a sheet. That's $180.00 savings.

5/8" is overkill.

Look up L-girder benchwork, originally developed by Linn Westcott - it's been the gold standard for train layouts for over 50 years.  Lightweight, plenty strong for a layout, economical, simple to build and easy to modify later.

2x4 is usually overkill (1x4 works), ditto for anything beyond 1/2" sheet goods - can possibly go thinner and/or use OSB.  2x2 legs (with cross bracing) are sufficient, especially since you should cross-brace legs regardless of size anyway.

@CALNNC posted:

Have you reviewed the info about model RR bench construction that is out there that aligns best with you planned empire?  There may be other construction techniques more economical and suited to your plan.  But,  your 15 sheets and 480sq.ft. of plywood with no gaps surely makes it easy to lay down track where you want, and be sitting right next to it while you secure it to the table.

Well, maybe easy if you fly!   480 sq/ft of plywood with no gaps will make it interesting to reach a lot of it unless it's a huge around-the-room setup!  I have a 12 x 24 layout and I have a large opening at one end and a pop-up at the other end, it's still hard to reach some of it!

Plywood !      If you are moving 15 sheets of plywood this dolly off of Amazon is fantastic if there is any distance to your building area.  My wife and would move 2 sheets with ease over sloping ground about 50 feet to the basement layout area .      It is also great for moving large 77 “ TV’s or Sheetrock

I echo many of the thoughts here, 1/2" plywood works just fine, especially if you're not going to be crawling on top of the layout.

That being said, I went with 3/4" AC grade plywood. Sure, it was expensive, but I also crawl on top of my layout A LOT. And the 3/4" is extremely sturdy with the benchwork built underneath.

- Jason

I used 1/2” plywood on my last layout (11’x19’) and never had an issue with it supporting my 190 lb body when I climbed on top.

@jdstucks posted:

I echo many of the thoughts here, 1/2" plywood works just fine, especially if you're not going to be crawling on top of the layout.

That being said, I went with 3/4" AC grade plywood. Sure, it was expensive, but I also crawl on top of my layout A LOT. And the 3/4" is extremely sturdy with the benchwork built underneath.

- Jason

I'm guessing I weigh at least as much as you do, and my 1/2" plywood hasn't complained about me walking on it.  Unless you have very wide supports, I can't imagine needing 3/4" plywood.

Note that new construction underlayment on 16" centers frequently uses 1/2" material, and they count on a whole lot more weight than one person walking on it.

I've done both 1/2 and 3/4.  I've landed on 1/2 as my go-to unless there's a special area I'm concerned about, such as where I have my Millhouse Studios turntable. I probably could have gone 1/2 there as well, but I erred on the side of overkill "just because".

Here is a picture of my layout plan. The track plan itself is not the most current iteration. I am working with a friend that is much better at SCARM than I am at refining the track plan. I am getting rid of the 3 track mainline and opting for a double and then a loop on the top level to save on track cost and to make the plan more interesting. Anyway… I digress… here is the benchwork picture. I am opting for kind of a hybrid setup. Partially around the room with peninsulas. Just to give you an idea of the square footage. The room is 30x40. I will look for the half inch plywood. My local home improvements stores do not carry homosote. Mr. Muffin said I don’t need it. 😁 I am going to go with the 2x4's as I have already those on hand and they were cheap... at least I thought so. Is it ok to go 1/2" without homostote?

Tom

@Godale03 posted:

My local home improvements stores do not carry homosote. Mr. Muffin said I don’t need it. 😁 I am going to go with the 2x4's as I have already those on hand and they were cheap... at least I thought so. Is it ok to go 1/2" without homostote?

It's easy for someone that won't be living with the layout to suggest that you don't need any sound deadening.  Maybe they're right, it depends on what you are looking for.  Personally, I paid a ton of money for all these locomotives with fancy sound systems, and I want to hear those over the track noise.  The difference between track on Homasote and on benchwork with just plywood is pretty significant, it sure matters to me!

I am certainly not calling anyone out for liking or not liking homosote. I personally have never been to a layout as there is nobody in my part of MD that has a layout to visit. So I have not heard a layout with or without homosote. That being said I am using atlas track on foam roadbed. I don't know if that will be enough or not. There is not a store in my area within an hour anyway, that carries homosote, so right now its not an option for me at least unless I am willing to drive long distance to purchase. I am trying to spend money where I should and hopefully not waist it. I don't have a ton of fancy engines but I hear what you are saying about the sound. Your right, its easy to say or recommend things on a layout you will never see or interact with. Thats the hard part when asking questions like this. Who is right and who is wrong or is anyone right or wrong? Its so hard being a rookie among the gods on this forum. I try and think long and hard about asking a question here... mostly because when I do it exposes my inexperience for all to mock.... and some do.... but I also sometimes find it hard to find a right answer. Or I start an unintentional debate. So I apologize for my rookiness...

Tom

@Godale03 posted:

So I apologize for my rookiness...

Just remember, everyone here started from the same Rookie corner.   I hope you don't think I was mocking you as that's clearly not my intention.  I'm just expressing my opinion on the topic, as I've been on both sides.  I had Fastrack laying on plywood, so I know what really loud track sounds like!  Now I have Ross/Gargraves on Homasote and then foam roadbed.  Needless to say, I like the latter much better.

As for the Homasote, there are other sound deadening solutions.  I recently saw this ad in a quick search.

1/2 in. x 48 in. x 96 in. Acoustic Insulation Sound Board for $18.71.

  However, when I actually went to look at it, the new price is $48!   So, everything seems to be getting a lot more expensive!

Oh, I didn’t think you were mocking me at all. John you’re always helpful. I’m just afraid to ask questions sometimes. You guys have a lot of knowledge and I am trying to be a sponge. I just worry that if I don’t do things the way that people suggest that some how I offend them. Now I don’t get that impression from you. I know ultimately it is my decision and nobody can make it but me. Anyway, i appreciate all the help and advice. Good thing is i haven’t cut the first 2x4 so im not too far gone. 😂

@Godale03 posted:

... Is it ok to go 1/2" without homostote?

As GRJ mentioned, homasote is primarily for sound deadening.  That's a personal choice.  It's also easier to screw track to homasote.  Another consideration is whether or not the floor is carpeted.  Carpet will deaden the sound somewhat.

From a structural standpoint, 1/2" plywood is adequate by itself - homasote adds very little strength.

If homasote isn't stocked near you (so I assume you're not near a Menards), I think it can be ordered from Lowe's.  Not sure about Home Depot.

Do you know any layout owners in your area?  Perhaps you could visit a couple and get a sense for homasote vs. not.

Edit:  I saw in your profile that you live in Maryland.  There are a lot of train guys near you - if you're not in TCA, I suggest that you join and find folks near you.

I buy plywood every ten years or so, and always get sticker shock.  The last piece I bought at Home Depot was 15/32" so not quite 1/2 inch.  I like homasote for sound deadening, also skirts around the layout, carpet on the floor and foam roadbed under the track. If I would do it over again, I would consider the 2 inch foam core.  I recommend the Dennis Brennan book "Realistic Modeling for Toy Trains - A high rail guide".   Anyone considering building a layout should read this book.  Amazon has it for a very good price (less than $20).  I think for you @Godale03  the 2 inch foam core would give you the option to put some features like a bridge going over a creek or road and perhaps some elevation in places.  Planning the layout is aways fun, so hope you can enjoy the journey.

Realistic Modeling for Toy Trains: A Hi-Rail Guide (Classic Toy Trains Books): Brennan, Dennis: 9780890247457: Amazon.com: Books

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

Just remember, everyone here started from the same Rookie corner.   I hope you don't think I was mocking you as that's clearly not my intention.  I'm just expressing my opinion on the topic, as I've been on both sides.  I had Fastrack laying on plywood, so I know what really loud track sounds like!  Now I have Ross/Gargraves on Homasote and then foam roadbed.  Needless to say, I like the latter much better.

As for the Homasote, there are other sound deadening solutions.  I recently saw this ad in a quick search.

1/2 in. x 48 in. x 96 in. Acoustic Insulation Sound Board for $18.71.

  However, when I actually went to look at it, the new price is $48!   So, everything seems to be getting a lot more expensive!

I just checked Home Depot's website, shows out of stock.

Just my luck.

Also, on the plywood,  on the last 4 by 8 piece I bought for my layout,  I actually needed 2 foot by 8 foot pieces, so I had Home Depot cut it for me.  They have saws that can easily cut length wise or width wise, this made it easier to carryout.  I get to the store  early in the morning before they get busy so I don't have to wait too long to get help.  I also recently built a shed in my back yard, and needed 3/4 inch plywood cut in multiple sizes.  As always, measure twice and cut once.   For really precise cuts,  you always need to factor in the width of the blade when giving measurements to the person cutting the wood. Chop saws are great for cutting legs and frames.

For framing and legs,  Sometimes I have bought 16 or 20 foot long pieces,  and have the Home Depot cut them to the smaller dimensions,  Usually, the first two cuts are free on one piece of wood.  THe longer pieces are cheaper per foot than the shorter lenghts.

As an FYI, if you are ever in the Tacoma area and you see this truck carrying lumber home,  do not follow this guy. Although everything went well,  I think it was more luck.  Also,I think these pictures, show that I basically became my dad...

After the trip home in the picture below, I decided that in the future I will have the Home Depot cut this type of lumber into shorter pieces.

@DMASSO posted:

I used 5_8 plywood 25 years ago when wood priced were reasonable.

I used Lionel Trains 25 years ago when toy prices were reasonable

@DL Brunette posted:

Best pictures posted on this site is quite some time! LOL! I’d hire you in a second to help me move your stuff.

Great tip on having the Depot cut the wood. I do that all the time for layout needs. The best thing going.

Thanks for that story and the pictures!! You and own the exact same truck too! Except I live in southern MD. 😁thank you for the advice my friend!

tom

@Mallard4468 posted:

As GRJ mentioned, homasote is primarily for sound deadening.  That's a personal choice.  It's also easier to screw track to homasote.  Another consideration is whether or not the floor is carpeted.  Carpet will deaden the sound somewhat.

From a structural standpoint, 1/2" plywood is adequate by itself - homasote adds very little strength.

If homasote isn't stocked near you (so I assume you're not near a Menards), I think it can be ordered from Lowe's.  Not sure about Home Depot.

Do you know any layout owners in your area?  Perhaps you could visit a couple and get a sense for homasote vs. not.

Edit:  I saw in your profile that you live in Maryland.  There are a lot of train guys near you - if you're not in TCA, I suggest that you join and find folks near you.

Hopefully the floor is level. 2 years ago we had a 30x40 2 story building built on our farm to act as storage. We decided to go up with it so that I had room to build a layout. I know I will make mistakes but hopefully nothing that sets me back to much!

@Godale03 posted:

Hopefully the floor is level. 2 years ago we had a 30x40 2 story building built on our farm to act as storage. We decided to go up with it so that I had room to build a layout. I know I will make mistakes but hopefully nothing that sets me back to much!

The floor not being level is not a big deal as long as you deal with it during the benchwork build.  My floor varies about 1.5" from end to end, but the actual layout top is leveled to 1/8" end to end.  The leg levelers account for any floor variation.  Do all the leveling work before you start putting the surface plywood on, it's much easier at that point.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

The floor not being level is not a big deal as long as you deal with it during the benchwork build.  My floor varies about 1.5" from end to end, but the actual layout top is leveled to 1/8" end to end.  The leg levelers account for any floor variation.  Do all the leveling work before you start putting the surface plywood on, it's much easier at that point.

Absolutely! I hired my father to assist in the benchwork build. He is a retired carpenter so I figured I would just show him some pictures and let him roll while I assisted. 😁

Here is what we have built so far. I know the benchwork is not typical, but dad said this would be a very stable platform to work on. I trust him. We squared and leveled everything as we went along. I’m sure I will catch some heat for posting these pictures because I am not following the norm, but I am excited I am making progress. Besides once the facia and skirting is applied nobody will notice. 😁

Tom