Someone, not really into the hobby, mentioned that he had a GG-2. I said you mean a GG-1 and he was emphatic that it is a GG-2. Did such a thing exist?
Thank you
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Not on the Pennsy roster.
I’m gonna make a wild guess that he may actually be referring to a PRR DD2. There was only one prototype built but, it did somewhat resemble a GG1.
Curt
@juniata guy posted:I’m gonna make a wild guess that he may actually be referring to a PRR DD2. There was only one prototype built but, it did somewhat resemble a GG1.
Curt
Almost certainly correct. The DD2 was a 2-B+B-2 (in steam terms: 4-4-0+0-4-4). Styling was shorter GG1. Would make an interesting model - and possibly a very popular one, owing to its exotic-familiar nature.
Maybe MTH would....no, wait. Sigh.
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Thanks for the information. But, I’m guessing that it was never produced by Lionel or anyone else?
I learn something every day. A Baby-GG1.
I can guess it was never produced because why would Pennsy want less HP. 
They had all the experience they ever wanted with double-heading K4s on Varnish. Passenger trains were getting longer and heavier not shorter and lighter.
Lew:
PRR actually intended for the DD2 to be the prototype for a new electric freight motor. At the time; they were still considering electrification of the Middle and Pittsburgh Divisions. Diesels came along, the electrification idea was scrubbed and the DD2 became a lone oddity.
Jay, I’m not aware of any three rail manufacturer doing the DD2. If he has one, it must either be a custom build or someone modified a GG1.
Curt
Could you say that Lionel and others technically produced a DD-2, as in the 027-sized GG-1? How close are the dimensions I wonder?
Firewood:
Don’t know how it would scale out but, the wheel arrangement would still be wrong.
Curt
@juniata guy posted:Lew:
PRR actually intended for the DD2 to be the prototype for a new electric freight motor. At the time; they were still considering electrification of the Middle and Pittsburgh Divisions. Diesels came along, the electrification idea was scrubbed and the DD2 became a lone oddity...
Curt
Aha. So it was freight geared. That weight/tractive-effort should have worked as long as Pushers were used from Altoona to Cresson and Johnstown to Cresson. And yes, Diesels sure made electric traction moot. Too much capital in fixed plant and too much maintenance anywhere except in the Corridor where traffic density is high enough to support it.
Thanks folks. I will be seeing him soon so maybe I can get him to take a photo or provide the number.
Considering that it was a one of a kind locomotive, it lasted from 1938 to 1962. It was 72 1/2 feet long which is still longer than a traditional Lionel GG1. It was rated at 5,000 horsepower. While it’s lines are similar to the GG1, comparing pictures of the two, you can see that the DD2 has a bulkier appearance and would require massive reworking of a Lionel GG1 shell. This might have been a job for MTH but, today, it would fall to 3rd Rail. I would love to have one but, with a limited interest it might not happen.
The mystery has been solved. Turns out it is a 1950’s Lionel PRR “Little Joe”.
Thank you everyone for responding.
@Tranquil Hollow RR posted:The mystery has been solved. Turns out it is a 1950’s Lionel PRR “Little Joe”.
Thank you everyone for responding.
OK,,,,,,,,what is a PRR "Little Joe? Only the Milwaukee Road and the Chicago, South Shore & South Bend RR had "Little Joe" electric locomotives.
@Hot Water posted:OK,,,,,,,,what is a PRR "Little Joe? Only the Milwaukee Road and the Chicago, South Shore & South Bend RR had "Little Joe" electric locomotives.
If I had to venture a guess it’s an EP-5 in PRR livery. Often and incorrectly called a Little Joe.
No doubt you are correct, but Lionel did manufacture them in PRR livery.
With apologies to George Bernard Shaw; sometimes we are a common hobby separated by different languages...
Curt
@Firewood posted:Could you say that Lionel and others technically produced a DD-2, as in the 027-sized GG-1? How close are the dimensions I wonder?
Regardless of its length, Lionel's PW stubby GG-1 is still a "GG-1", because the PRR did not assign these letters randomly. A PRR "G" locomotive - steam or not - has a 4-6-0 wheel arrangement. A Ten-Wheeler.
Two 4-6-0's back-to-back - as the GG-1 is - is a "GG". The "1" is a variation (a "release"; these days - a 1.0).
PRR Eight-Wheelers - 4-4-0's - were designated a "D" type wheel arrangement, so the DD-1 was considered 2 Eight-Wheelers back-to-back.
This is, of course, only the PRR's class system set up by them for them.
Good information, thank you.
The DD2 spent most of its days as the Baltimore Tunnel Helper being replaced upon retirement by a GG1. The prototype was ordered during the many times the PRR was considering electrification to Pittsburgh. Since that did not occur, this locomotive was yet another PRR electric orphan.
It had a higher HP rating (5000ho continuous) than the GG1 (4300hp continuous) and was designed for freight service.
As an aside, Varney accidentally almost offered this model in their original HO pre-war GG1 offering as the GG1 casting was used with their Mikado steam locomotive frame to make a 2-8-2. They are a very desirable model to own for HO collectors in that the 2nd Varney GG1 was offered in the 60's after Gordon Varney sold the business.
As for an O scale version of this? There might be an oddball cast brass shell version floating around. I was tracking a very crude 30's-40's P5a in O on eVilbay with outside 3rd rail that looked more like a DD2 :-)
While never built - there were widely circulated rumors in the early 1950s that the PRR was developing a GG2 when yet another study was being done on extending electrification west.
@rplst8 posted:If I had to venture a guess it’s an EP-5 in PRR livery. Often and incorrectly called a Little Joe.
@Tranquil Hollow RR posted:No doubt you are correct, but Lionel did manufacture them in PRR livery.
I recall it was Lionel/MPC that started calling the EP-5 "Little Joe." Postwar Lionel catalogs just referred to it as an electric.
Rusty
The best way to describe the DD2 (besides ugly) is the drive of the R1 with the articulated chassis of the GG1
Stuart
