PRR Panhandle 2.0

I got a 4x8 loop setup and if I get even one thing done in the basement, I go "welllllllllllllllllll guess I'll drive a few laps. Been working basically all day the last hour or so." haha

Progress looks good by the way!

@BillYo414 posted:

I got a 4x8 loop setup and if I get even one thing done in the basement, I go "welllllllllllllllllll guess I'll drive a few laps. Been working basically all day the last hour or so." haha

Progress looks good by the way!

And why not??? 

Thank you!

George

Updated 12/5/2020:

Didn't get a whole lot done, but I did manage to wire all the western (OH) track feeders to Bus 4 (PRR Bridge Westbound).  That bus is now terminated.  There are a few remaining feeder pairs to connect east of the bridge.

George

Updated 12/10/2020:

I've been working on placement and wiring of the DZ-1010 Crossing Gates at the top of Market Street in Steubenville, OH.

Here's the plan:

It's a tricky fit because:

• The gates need to be a maximum of 14" apart for the IR beam to function.
• The street crosses the track at a switch.  I plan to cover the switch machine with a section of the road (Hey, no real car is going to drive over it.    And besides, it's far away from the viewer and will rise up into the backdrop.)

I tested the gates on the bench and they seem OK.

To get placement correct, I mocked up a section of Market Street (a piece of paper) and pinned it into its location.  Comparing the plan and the actual, it looks like Market Street might be a bit more north & south than planned.  We'll see!

More when I know it. 

George

George, isn't that the way with 1:1 scale crossings?  We have all seen tricky situations where the engineers had to figure out a way to design it, then the details had to be worked out in real life!  Good plan mocking up Market Street!

@Mark Boyce posted:

George, isn't that the way with 1:1 scale crossings?  We have all seen tricky situations where the engineers had to figure out a way to design it, then the details had to be worked out in real life!  Good plan mocking up Market Street!

Thanks Mark.  I just have the sense that it should be moving faster than it is. 

Oh well, patience and I never were well acquainted. 

George

@G3750 posted:

Thanks Mark.  I just have the sense that it should be moving faster than it is. 

Oh well, patience and I never were well acquainted. 

George

I know what you mean, George!

Updated 12/12/2020:

The past few days have been spent working on creating 2-D representations of the windows for the Steubenville PRR station.  Last night I decided to test the size of one of the drawings against the space I have set aside for the station.  It didn't look right; it was too big for the structure that will sit there.

That led to a bit of consternation and then to some deeper thought.  At the moment, I am considering expanding the footprint of the station to full size.  According to the plans, the station building is 172'.   Yeah, that's a big station (the platform is much, much longer).  So, if we divide 172.16' by 48, in O scale our station is 43.09" long.

The changes will require shortening a parking lot, moving the station a bit farther from the track, re-locating 6th Street, and re-arranging the intersection of 6th with 4th, but it all works (I think).

OK, back to work drawing windows and checking them against the mocked-up plan and footprint.

More when I know it.

George

What if you selectively compressed each window a bit.  Would that work out with the amount of space you originally planned for the station?

@Mark Boyce posted:

What if you selectively compressed each window a bit.  Would that work out with the amount of space you originally planned for the station?

Mark,

Thanks for weighing in on this.  I've been up to my ears with proportions and measuring photographs and making approximations.  Some amount of clarity has come with revisiting the plans.  I'm leaning towards a full-sized O scale station, but I'm not 100% there yet.  I will give your suggestion some thought.

Thank you,

George

George,

I had to take a look at your thread and see what is going on with your layout. You certainly are making progress. Your adherence to the prototype is right up my alley. I look forward to seeing it again in person!

@PRRMiddleDivision posted:

George,

I had to take a look at your thread and see what is going on with your layout. You certainly are making progress. Your adherence to the prototype is right up my alley. I look forward to seeing it again in person!

High praise indeed!  Thank you Neal!

George

Mark,

A few posts back, I said:

That led to a bit of consternation and then to some deeper thought.  At the moment, I am considering expanding the footprint of the station to full size.  According to the plans, the station building is 172'.   Yeah, that's a big station (the platform is much, much longer).  So, if we divide 172.16' by 48, in O scale our station is 43.09" long.

Whoopsie!  A more careful look at the plans reveals that the station is actually 204.4' long.  That translates into an O scale structure 51.01" long.  Yikes!     That's just too big.  I am looking at shrinking the structure by 10%, which would yield a building 46" long.  Even so, the station will dominate the area.  Revised plan below.  That said, I need to double-check and then re-double-check these numbers.

More when (if) I know it. 

George

George, it would dominate the scene even if shrunk farther, but could then could look out of scale.  I looked up some photographs.  Those are really big multi-pane windows.  Ten percent should work out well!

Hello George,

I bet that considering yesterday's snow storm, you are happy that you no longer live in the central part of the Commonwealth! But just think, if you got snowed in like that for days, look how much work you could get done on the layout...not that it was that great around here!

@PRRMiddleDivision posted:

Hello George,

I bet that considering yesterday's snow storm, you are happy that you no longer live in the central part of the Commonwealth! But just think, if you got snowed in like that for days, look how much work you could get done on the layout...not that it was that great around here!

My son still lives in Central PA and he did get slammed!   And actually, I have been going pretty hard at the layout anyway.  In a few days, I am going to publish a review of tasks accomplished for the Panhandle this year.  The list even astonishes me!

George

Sounds great, George!!

Updated 12/19/2020:

Not a lot to report today, but I did manage to get under the layout and connect some track feeders to the bus in the Staging Area.

George

Updated 12/20/2020:

All track feeder pairs have been connected in the Staging Area (Power District #8).

In our first photo, we see the power is on at the Power Distribution Panel - the Legacy Powermaster is lit.  Plastic sheet covers the rest of the transformer cart and panel to protect them against construction dust and debris.

In the second photo, our voltmeter registers 18.7 VAC at the track.

And finally, our K-Line voltmeter car confirms the voltage on a section of the Staging Area track.

I will take a crack at wiring the dozen switches in the Staging Area tomorrow.

More when I know it. 

George

Nice progress George. I like that voltmeter car. Pretty cool! Wouldn't mind picking one up some day.

It's alive!  Alive!  It's just not the same without Dr. Frankenstein's voice.    Looking good George!

I considered buying a voltmeter car sometime earlier this year.  Whatever the price was, I decided not to put that much into it.

@BillYo414 posted:

Nice progress George. I like that voltmeter car. Pretty cool! Wouldn't mind picking one up some day.

Thanks!  It has its uses.  I bought it a very long time-ago (right after K-Line was acquired by Lionel).

George

@Mark Boyce posted:

It's alive!  Alive!  It's just not the same without Dr. Frankenstein's voice.    Looking good George!

I considered buying a voltmeter car sometime earlier this year.  Whatever the price was, I decided not to put that much into it.

I don't recall what it cost.  It was a very long time ago.

George

@G3750 posted:

Thanks!  It has its uses.  I bought it a very long time-ago (right after K-Line was acquired by Lionel).

I figure it would be one of those things that you dont use often but you sure are glad you have it when you need it.

George,

  I had never seen that car before. I could not make out from your picture if there is a working meter on the side of the car (guessing a big "No" as the cost would probably be too high) or is that simply a decal on the side (with the working bulb on top).

  Glad to see things are moving along.

Tom

I'll step out into traffic here...I assumed that was a working volt meter car haha

I found a few on eBay. I see the meter actually works! How did I miss seeing that?

George, I know you sometimes thin your heard of equipment, do you have an extra one you want to sell (to me)? Remember, it is better to give than receive...

Tom

@PRR8976 posted:

I found a few on eBay. I see the meter actually works! How did I miss seeing that?

Tom

Probably the planetary alignment or something haha I thought maybe I assumed it worked.

https://www.mthtrains.com/30-74942

MTH version at least is functional.  I would assume this one is as well.

@BillYo414 posted:

Probably the planetary alignment or something haha I thought maybe I assumed it worked.

The Age of Aquarius, Age of Aquarius!  No, that's Jupiter aligns with Mars, not Saturn!!   I have seen both the Lionel and MTH cars, yea both are functional.

In honor of the traditional St. Thomas Day (yesterday), I treated myself to a K-Line Volt Meter car:

Thank you George for showing your version earlier.

Tom

LOL.  I turn my back for a minute and this thread goes off the rails like an errant train in a Pizza Hut commercial!     

Yes, the voltmeter car actually works.

George

@PRR8976 posted:

In honor of the traditional St. Thomas Day (yesterday), I treated myself to a K-Line Volt Meter car:

Thank you George for showing your version earlier.

Tom

Very nice, Tom!!

George

Updated 12/25/2020:  Set-back & Recovery

This one is a bit embarrassing.   It turns out that I made several wiring mistakes that resulted in some pretty funky layout behavior.  It started here:

First the problems:

1. The first and most obvious problem was the “Dead spot” indicated on the diagram above. I couldn’t figure out why it was happening.  Finally, I realized that Switch #31 is a Curtis HiRail O54 RH switch.  Unlike Ross-Ready switches, the Curtis has none of its 3 legs connected electrically.  The straight segment aka “Dead Spot” didn’t have a track feeder pair of wires providing power.  DUH!  That explains a lot!
2. The Decapod with large tender would ignore CAB-1 commands in the two areas identified on the diagram above. I would have to push buttons several times.
3. Power Districts 3 & 4, which are simply PH180s wired to the track, would not turn on when the master ON/OFF switch was flipped. They would turn on when Power District 8 (Legacy PowerMaster and PH180) was turned on.  This was very strange behavior indeed.

Causes and Solutions:

1. As noted above, the individual legs of all Curtis HiRail switches (there are 8 leftover from Panhandle 1.0) are electrically isolated. They must have their own power/ground feeder wires.  I went back through the layout and did resistance checks with my multi-meter.  Then I corrected the RR-Track diagram where I had omitted these feeder pairs.  I am about to pull up the track and install the pairs according to the revised plan.
2. Temporarily installing a ground plane alongside the track appears to have rectified the problem.  We will verify this solution and then permanently install it.  Ultimately, we will disguise the wire with scenery.  Thanks to Bob Bartizek for this advice and solution!
3. Problem 3 has multiple causes:

• Power District Buses 3 & 4 run parallel to each-other on the tracks that approach and pass over the bridge. Bus 3 is the Westbound bus;  Bus 4 is the Eastbound bus.  It turns out that a feeder pair of wires for the Eastbound bus was incorrectly wired to Bus 4 and vice-versa.  That electrically connected two buses (3 & 4) that should have been independent.
• Further, Bus 4 and Bus 8 should have been independent as well, separated by a center rail insulated fiber pin. That didn’t happen.  Because of a wiring error, parts of Bus 4 were directly connected to Bus 8.  That connection was severed.
• As a result of these two mistakes, some sort of feedback loop was created that demonstrated bizarre behavior.  Fortunately, both fuses protecting the respective PH180s at the distribution panel were blown - doing their jobs.
• Replacing the fuses restored normal functionality to both Bus 3 and Bus 4.

We are now going to fix the Staging Area feeder issues, install Bus 7, and wire its two feeders.  Switch #31 (Curtis HiRail O54 RH switch) will act as a block break between Power District 7 (Weirton Steel) and Power District 8 (Staging Area).

Phew!  I'm glad this has been diagnosed.  I hate gremlins - hardware or software!  There have to reasons for these things and I'm glad I found them.

More when I know it. 

George

I had a similar problem with a used Ross switch that wasn’t Ross Ready.  I turned a new one over and copied the jumpers.

@Mark Boyce posted:

I had a similar problem with a used Ross switch that wasn’t Ross Ready.  I turned a new one over and copied the jumpers.

The Curtis switches date from 2005-6; I had forgotten the legs were electrically isolated from each other.  There is a lot to remember, surprisingly.

George

It’s always something!

Updated 12/27/2020:

I believe the problems to have been fixed.  As of this evening:

• Power District 3 fires right up with no issues;  ran a K4s on parts of it.
• Power District 4 fires right up with no issues.
• Power District 7 responded to commands from the Legacy Powermaster and we are reading 18VAC on it.
• Power District 8 responded to commands from the Legacy Powermaster and we are reading 18VAC on it.

Diagram below shows the correctly installed block break just to the left of Switch#32 and that there is no longer an insulated fiber pin in the track joint just below "31".  All the feeder pairs for Power District #8 except 8.17 are connected and showing 18 VAC.

George

Woot woot! Glad you got the gremlins outta there.

Thanks Billy!!! 

There are still many of them out there! 

George