Question for Union Pacific Expert

re-inserting photos

Good morning. You are very astute with your prototype deliveries. The big kicker is that even though the catalog picture shows the 7 panel type door, it is not always delivered by the maufacture as pictured. I too have had issues with color of a car in a catalog and the color of the carIi recieved which was a differant shade. My guess here is that the picure from the catalog is a lithographed photo of a drawing and has been photo shopped with the clouded background etc. I looked at the photos you have and even the color looks differant in the real one you have and the catalog photo. Either way it is still a really nice car. Hope this shed some light. enjoy

Here's the photo indicating the Youngtown doors- I'd say it looks legit to me

Jeff,

Yes, that is the photo I am referring to but that road number - 106300 - for that car is outside the range of the B-50-40 boxcars Pullman Std built for UP in 1948.  The Lionel model is intended to represent a class B-50-40 car.

I don't have any UP freight car books but the 1958 ORER indicates that car # 106300 is in the 106100 to 106599 range for some other class.   By the photo, it looks like a 1937 AAR design and not the PS-1 design.

So, yes the paint scheme is legit for a UP boxcar repainted in 1954 but is a youngstown door and/or this paint scheme legit for a PS-1 class B-50-40 boxcar?

Bob,

The book, Union Pacific Freight Cars 1936 - 51, by Terry Metcalfe, states the 1600 Pullman-built cars were delivered with Superior seven panel  6' doors.  The UP equipment diagram reproduced in the book also says the same thing.  Now, it is possible that doors were swapped later in the car's existence.

Other things to note from the prototype:

1.  The sides should be welded

2.  Ends should be Pullman

3.  Tabs at the bottom of the left side are not very long and are not as deep as the tab under the door

4.  As-built spec called for black car cement on the roof and ends rather than the synthetic red freight car paint on the rest of the car

5.  Stirrup steps have a slope on the side toward the middle of the car

ChipR

Chip, wow, great info !! I know Bob started this topic but your info is awesome.  Thanks for posting for sure!

Sometimes, the three panel Creco and six and seven panel Superior doors got deformed from inside shifting loads. 

Youngstown doors, with the many horizontal ridges, were thought to be stronger and would resist being deformed, therefore replacing Creco and Superior doors.

Ralph

Men,

All great information to help me believe that the Lionel model is plausible despite not having a prototype photo to confirm without a doubt.  I have heard from other sources as well that Youngstown doors were oftentimes used to replace Creco and Superior doors for the reason stated.

Now, the remaining question is did UP repaint boxcars as early as 6 years into their life.  The Lionel model is stenciled to indicate it was repainted in Omaha on August 1954.

I enjoy these types of discussions on this forum most of all.

I sent an e-mail to the UP historical society as well to see if anyone will be able to answer my questions.  If I get a reply, I will post it here for everyone's edification.

Thanks again, Bob