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Question on TMCC fan driven smoke units...

Jeff TJeff TOGR Forum Member
Having watched both of the Lionel smoke videos by Mike Reagan, it appears the resistor is the key element in smoke production in the old fan driven TMCC engines. Now I'm no electrical genius but would changing the resistor to something hotter work better at producing more smoke?

Or have I over simplified it?

Thanks!!!
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H HOSO&NZOGR Forum Member
Simple answer, Yes, No, and Maybe. Yes, a hotter resistor will smoke more. No, a hotter resistor will burn up the wicking, use the fluid more rapidly, and may burn up the smoke unit. Maybe, you might be able to find something that will be a happy medium but I doubt it. Lionel was looking into changing the resistance in their newer smoke units upward as the hotter resistors were burning up the units. Try the mods Mike recommends in his video. Check them out at Lionel.com.

Al
B brucefclarkOGR Forum Member
Jeff T I modified my old Challenger from 27 ohm to 24 ohm ceramic wire wound resistor. The inlet air hole above the fan was enlarged to the ID of the fan. The direction of rotation was changed for max air flow and the die cast outlet was drilled out to maximize air flow. I repacked the bowl with pink fiberglass insulation to the bottom of the air notch from the fan side to resistor side of the bowl. I would recommend a 25 ohm resistor as the 24 ohm ran a little too hot. Use Mega Steam or the new Lionel fluid. My rule of thumb was to measure the resistance of the existing smoke element and decrease the resistance less then 10%.
Jeff TJeff TOGR Forum Member
quote:
Originally posted by brucefclark:
Jeff T I modified my old Challenger from 27 ohm to 24 ohm ceramic wire wound resistor. The inlet air hole above the fan was enlarged to the ID of the fan. The direction of rotation was changed for max air flow and the die cast outlet was drilled out to maximize air flow. I repacked the bowl with pink fiberglass insulation to the bottom of the air notch from the fan side to resistor side of the bowl. I would recommend a 25 ohm resistor as the 24 ohm ran a little too hot. Use Mega Steam or the new Lionel fluid. My rule of thumb was to measure the resistance of the existing smoke element and decrease the resistance less then 10%.


Thanks for the notes. Would the resistor be a Radio Shack part?
NJCJOENJCJOEOGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBER
So I made the smoke unit modifications Mike recommended. I also replaced the smoke unit circuit board, 27 ohm resistor and the batting. It made very little improvement. If I hold the smoke boost down for 4-5 seconds, it smokes great, but when I let go the smoke is almost non-existent. Is this just the way it is or is there something else to try?
J JC642OGR Forum Member
quote:
So I made the smoke unit modifications Mike recommended. I also replaced the smoke unit circuit board, 27 ohm resistor and the batting. It made very little improvement. If I hold the smoke boost down for 4-5 seconds, it smokes great, but when I let go the smoke is almost non-existent. Is this just the way it is or is there something else to try?

Joe


Not sure which engine you're refering to but I have the original PRR 2-10-4 Texas equipped with the prehistoric mechanical smoke unit. Never could get it to smoke more than a few whifs and even then it was erratic with little to no smoke at all most of the time..
Tried using the little puffer tool that came with the new Lionel S-3. Made a huge difference. I must have cleared out a smoke clog.. Engine smokes better now then it ever did..
Joe
H Hancock52OGR Forum Member
Joe,

Sounds like you are not getting enough voltage to the resistor in normal operation if it only gives you the desired result when boost is applied. Also, at 27 Ohm it will need more juice than a 6 or 8 Ohm to crank the heat up. Apart from this see above for the tip about pushing the resistor deeper into the wadding.

I don't know whether this helps with your model, but a while back I asked Scott Mann about the wispy smoke output from my 3rd Rail TMCC FEF-3. He told me to try throwing the smoke unit switch on the engine from "TMCC" to "Conventional" as that results in a few extra volts being applied to the resistor. It worked.
c.samc.samOGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBER
quote:
Originally posted by NJCJOE:
So I made the smoke unit modifications Mike recommended. I also replaced the smoke unit circuit board, 27 ohm resistor and the batting. It made very little improvement. If I hold the smoke boost down for 4-5 seconds, it smokes great, but when I let go the smoke is almost non-existent. Is this just the way it is or is there something else to try?


Joe, I had the same experience with a new replacement unit for our Lionel Mountain built in 2000. The unit had the modifications and would smoke like crazy at 19v with the boost held on but release it, and the smoke drastically reduced to little more than a wisp. If I ran at 20v the locomotive would smoke better but at 18v or less, it was non-existent..

What is it that causes the MTH units to be so prolific?
GerryGerryOGR Forum Member

Took my Lionel T1 apart trying to do the upgrade Lionel has posted on youtube. My pcb board under the resisitor looks pretty fried. Board is blackened directly under the resistor. Is this normal wear? Engine never smoked well since I've owned it. Did anyone else have a blackened board when performing upgrade and smoke unit worked upon completion?

 

thanks for your help!

joseywalesjoseywalesOGR Forum Member
Originally Posted by Gerry:

Took my Lionel T1 apart trying to do the upgrade Lionel has posted on youtube. My pcb board under the resisitor looks pretty fried. Board is blackened directly under the resistor. Is this normal wear? Engine never smoked well since I've owned it. Did anyone else have a blackened board when performing upgrade and smoke unit worked upon completion?

 

thanks for your help!

yes and no..On lionel from the parts breakdown pics they dont have that gasket running under the resistor ... On the MTH smoke units they have a heat restance gasket that runs under the retire area where the resistor is at. thats supose to protect the board.. well I did that mike regans mods to my MTH smoke unit and man it goes it blows away Lionels !!  But my gasket was bad..I'd ran it without it .it almost burn up my board..So  Id cut out a piece of copper tin and placed it where the gasket was at and used copper high heat automotive RTV.. woked out great..I use the RTV on my exaust headers to seal my gaskets with no proublems! That copper tin acts as a heat sheild to that circet board.. 

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