Realtrax switch question - Now with pic!

Well there's a ground post and a hot post, take the transformer....J/K

Can you specify your question a bit? Do you run conventional, command, or both? Also- how would you control the turn-outs? With the switch controller that comes with it, via the MTH AIU and/or via one of Lionel's ASCs or SCs? Regardless, I'll answer what it is I think you want and give a description of how they're used on my layout.

At one time I had 4 MTH realtrax switches on my layout but I currently only use two right-handed Realtrax turnouts( the others are fasttrack). I had previously powered these two Realtrax turnouts with a single accessory transformer. I've never used powered these turnouts with track power due to using Legacy/DCS, but it is useful to utilize a separate accessory transformer regardless of command or conventional operation. I just remove the jumper plate and then attach the hot and common wires per the manuals instructions. They are, for the moment, powered by separate accessory transformers due to laziness.

On each side of the straight portion of the turnouts, they are connected to another piece of realtrax just like connecting two straights. My layout currently has 3 isolated blocks: Main, Local and yard. One turnout is on Main and the other is on Local. The turnouts serve to connect Main and Local. There is a 4.5" or so piece of realtrax in between the diverging part of the turnouts. At ONLY ONE END of this connecting  realtrax piece, I crimped the middle tab inward and put a piece of electrical tape over it- thus keeping the two loops isolated from each other. You could use the standard 5" realtrax insulating section, but I needed/wanted a smaller piece.

I've never connected MTH Realtrax turnouts to each other directly. The non-derailing feature works decently well.

Hope that helps a bit

I use command control. Turnouts are powered by track power. In my experience, if you connect two realtrax switches with the single ends together, they won’t conduct power. You’ll need another lockon on the inside loop you create. I’ll take a pic tomorrow and post it.

I revised the original post to include a pic and be more direct with the question.  Any general info on Realtrax switches and how they connect electrically with adjacent track is still appreciated.  Thanks!

@Mark Holmgren 110217 It's been so long since I went through the testing/trial & error phase with my Realtrax switches that my memory is fuzzy. I know I didn't ever connect them to each other directly(aka without a piece of track isolating the center rails in between the diverging sections) on my layout, but I definitely did in my test loop area and just attached some straight sections to each switch. What you're saying is ringing some bells, possibly something to do with both switches switched to the diverging route?

I remember one time that I set up my switches with a short straight in between them and did not sufficiently isolate the middle rail on one end. I powered up the main line(outer loop), and the inner loop's cars lit up. That was the only connection between the two loops- however it's possible I'm confusing that with an instance when I accidentally connected a drop from the outer to the inner loop.

What I do know and can say without a doubt is that if you do put a section of insulated realtrax between two switches diverging(or turn) part, if you remove all three wires on that realtrax section, your loco will likely stall. If you have two turnouts, Turnout A and Turnout B, both of them lack a power connection on the "inner rail" of the diverging curved section of the switch. Turnout A only provides power to one half of one outer rail of the insulated section and turnout B only provides power to one half of the opposite outer rail on the other side if the insulated section. Thus, you can end up losing your ground connection

@Mark Holmgren 110217 thanks for the diagram! Nice looking layout!

Is the spot were it says "lock on goes here" the only lock-on that you have on the entire layout? If the answer is yes- I'd suggest adding a couple more lock-ons. If no BUT that side is the only side which has lock-ons, the other ground rail isn't receiving any power. Unlike regular tubular track or Fastrack, the Realtrax outer rails are isolated from each other. Hence, especially for a layout like yours, you'll need to have lock-ons on both sides of the track. Below are two annotated pictures- one of a realtrax switch and the other of your layout and the possible power issue

Red markings indicates power where power is being conducted, the black markings indicate where power is cut off/non-powered rail. The yellow markings are for added effect and indicate that rail is unpowered due to lock-on placement. Ultimately, The annotated diagram below demonstrates how neither outer rail is receiving power for your inner loop. Is the lack of power in the upper corner constant? That's the only thing that the picture below doesn't cover

I'd definitely recommend adding at least 3 more lock-ons. Lock-on recommendations shown below:

The lock-on suggestions are basic- I just wanted to ensure that both ground rails were powered throughout your layout which this should achieve. The lock-on in the upper corner is just a power drop to get your corner power up.

What transformer(s) are you using?

Thanks! Looks like I will be ordering more lockons. The lack of power in the top right is constant. I’ll try placing the lockons I have on opposite sides of the track as well as adding more  

I’m using a Z500 with the DCS Explorer for power. It’s not powering anything but the track and my test light (aka caboose) until I get the power issues resolved.

Keep in mind that Realtrax ground rails are not connected to one another, unlike Lionel.   So, only one rail has ground.   Running a wire under the track from one ground rail to the other side helps with power issues.

Thank goodness for the banner ads at the top of every page.  I just pounded away going through all the sponsors' websites to find someone who had a couple of lockons in stock.  Seems like they're getting rare.  Has MTH said whether they're going to keep making Realtrax?  I really dislike Fastrack because it is so incredibly loud.  I don't ever want to have to switch.  I'd probably go with one of the fancy ones when my Realtrax is finally toast from being assembled and disassembled a million times.

I don't have an answer regarding the continued production of realtrax, unfortunately. I hope that they do. It often gets knocked but if you put the work in to get it right, it's a nice track system and preferable to fastrack IMO.

Regarding your power source- I'd recommend  a KW type transformer or one of equivalent wattage for your layout or maybe a z-1000 AT THE MINIMUM. If your running any type of loco that doesn't have DC can motors(i.e. postwar locos with AC motors),  non-LED lit passenger cars, and/or Command control(18v minimum for the track)- any combination of these will quickly tax that z500. Especially if you're powering those turnouts with it! Which is why...

I highly recommend using a separate power source for your Realtrax turnouts. Whether you're running conventional or command, it's really the most optimal way for powering and operating your turnouts. Further- you can use your turnouts as lock-ons themselves-even though it's not in the MTH instructions booklet.

Below is some info that may help you with track. Basically my personal track odyssey after switching from tubular:

I do agree- fastrack is unfortunately louder. Because I still have the two realtrax switches, I have two sections of about 30 to 35 inches of Realtrax(includes the 10 inch length of the switch) on each loop. That doesn't help with the noise of the fastrack- when trains go over realtrax it's like sweet relief, then they go back to the fastrack and the noise picks up again ha. It's taken me awhile to get used to sound of fastrack, probably longer due to the aforementioned use of two types of track.

I switched from Realtrax to fastrack when I enlarged my curves.. My layout had been all realtrax with O-42 curves. I only had two o-42 Realtrax right handed switches connecting the inner and outer loops which was an issue in terms of switching between the mainline and inner loop. I wanted to switch to Gargraves, Atlas or a combo as I have a number of both their 37" wood tie, flex track straights and 37" black plastic tie straights. When it came down to it, the main reason I didn't pursue atlas, Gargraves or Ross was because I didn't want to ballast the track. My secondary reason was that I didn't want to go through the hassle of learning how to connect their turnouts.

That led me to consider if I wanted to continue using Realtrax or move to Fastrack. I had a TIU, AIU and TMCC base, but then I acquired Legacy and began running Lionel motive power almost exclusively. The reason I ultimately moved to Fastrack were curve diameters, wireless command switches and sensor track. I could do a combination of 1 o-72 and 3 o-60 with Fastrack which allowed me to keep longer straight sections on each side, MTH realtrax didn't allow for that as their o-54 apparently only requires 12 sections for a full oval(sources differ) and o-72 requires 16 sections. With fastrack, I could use o-72 and o-60. because they both require 16 sections for a circle. After further reading, I saw the o-36 half sections also required 16 sections for a circle, hence I actually made a curve combo of o-72, o-60, o-60 and half an o-36- Which allowed me to keep 100" and 25" of straight track on my sides. Now I have one end like that and a couple days ago switched my other end to the intended 0-72 and 3 o-60 sections just to give it a try. All of my rolling stock goes through the half o-36, but some- specifically Atlas 60' autoparts boxcars and 30k gallon tankers, less so for 21" Horizons- definitely didn't like that half o-36.

Anyway, keep us updated on your progress

I would add more lockons or just solder more power and common feeder wires around your layout, and solder jumper wires at each lockon and/or if you solder more feeder wires, from one common rail to the other so both rails are powered all around your layout except where you need an insulated rail to trigger track accessories. You probably could do that also between your two switches so both common rails are connected. I'm using Fastrack and I have power and common feeder wires soldered to every 6 pieces of track. Since my old layout has been torn down for 6 years, stored in the garage before I have been able to start rebuilding a new layout, cleaned the tarnish off the best I could, threw away a lot that had rusted too much to save, cheap tin crap metal, with testing on the track I was still having conductivity issues with it, I have been soldering power and jumper wires from one piece of Fastrack to the next piece in that group of 6 pieces of Fastrack, it's been a royal pain to do, but it has worked. I just got my outer track completed and have no issues running a couple different locomotives around it, so working on doing the same thing for the inner track. Wishing you good luck with it.

The realtrax switches use a printed circuit board under the switch points to conduct electricity from the center entrance rail of the switch to the center rail between the points and the exit center rails.  If a derailment occurs on the side of the switch opposite a lockon, the trace in the pcb will fry causing the center rails to be dead.  The MTH solution is to solder the center entrance rail to the center rail between the points, or replace the pcb.  You can check continuity between the center rails with a VOM, test light or lighted car.

@StevefromPA posted:

I don't have an answer regarding the continued production of realtrax, unfortunately. I hope that they do. It often gets knocked but if you put the work in to get it right, it's a nice track system and preferable to fastrack IMO.

Regarding your power source- I'd recommend  a KW type transformer or one of equivalent wattage for your layout or maybe a z-1000 AT THE MINIMUM. If your running any type of loco that doesn't have DC can motors(i.e. postwar locos with AC motors),  non-LED lit passenger cars, and/or Command control(18v minimum for the track)- any combination of these will quickly tax that z500. Especially if you're powering those turnouts with it! Which is why...

I highly recommend using a separate power source for your Realtrax turnouts. Whether you're running conventional or command, it's really the most optimal way for powering and operating your turnouts. Further- you can use your turnouts as lock-ons themselves-even though it's not in the MTH instructions booklet.

Below is some info that may help you with track. Basically my personal track odyssey after switching from tubular:

I do agree- fastrack is unfortunately louder. Because I still have the two realtrax switches, I have two sections of about 30 to 35 inches of Realtrax(includes the 10 inch length of the switch) on each loop. That doesn't help with the noise of the fastrack- when trains go over realtrax it's like sweet relief, then they go back to the fastrack and the noise picks up again ha. It's taken me awhile to get used to sound of fastrack, probably longer due to the aforementioned use of two types of track.

I switched from Realtrax to fastrack when I enlarged my curves.. My layout had been all realtrax with O-42 curves. I only had two o-42 Realtrax right handed switches connecting the inner and outer loops which was an issue in terms of switching between the mainline and inner loop. I wanted to switch to Gargraves, Atlas or a combo as I have a number of both their 37" wood tie, flex track straights and 37" black plastic tie straights. When it came down to it, the main reason I didn't pursue atlas, Gargraves or Ross was because I didn't want to ballast the track. My secondary reason was that I didn't want to go through the hassle of learning how to connect their turnouts.

That led me to consider if I wanted to continue using Realtrax or move to Fastrack. I had a TIU, AIU and TMCC base, but then I acquired Legacy and began running Lionel motive power almost exclusively. The reason I ultimately moved to Fastrack were curve diameters, wireless command switches and sensor track. I could do a combination of 1 o-72 and 3 o-60 with Fastrack which allowed me to keep longer straight sections on each side, MTH realtrax didn't allow for that as their o-54 apparently only requires 12 sections for a full oval(sources differ) and o-72 requires 16 sections. With fastrack, I could use o-72 and o-60. because they both require 16 sections for a circle. After further reading, I saw the o-36 half sections also required 16 sections for a circle, hence I actually made a curve combo of o-72, o-60, o-60 and half an o-36- Which allowed me to keep 100" and 25" of straight track on my sides. Now I have one end like that and a couple days ago switched my other end to the intended 0-72 and 3 o-60 sections just to give it a try. All of my rolling stock goes through the half o-36, but some- specifically Atlas 60' autoparts boxcars and 30k gallon tankers, less so for 21" Horizons- definitely didn't like that half o-36.

Anyway, keep us updated on your progress

Thank you for all of the insight!  The power supply for the DCS Explorer was inadequate so I grabbed the Z500 from my first starter set and so far it seems fine.  You make a good point about lighted train cars though.  I have a Z750 transformer lying around.  I also have a Z1000, but I used that in setting up my dad's carpet empire.  I have a 2013 CW80 from a train set, so I could use that to power switches and accessories.  All of the locomotives I run are MTH PS3.

I got started with RealTrax with the starter set that got me back in the hobby.  I really like just about everything about it except the conductivity issues with the switches.  I fully understand it's a consequence of the wonderful anti-derail feature, I just wish it was better explained in the manual.  Realtrax laid on a soft surface is pretty quiet.  Fastrack is a really nice system too but it's even loud on thick carpet.  I have a ton of it now, and I'm really not looking forward to having to change.  My stuff has been assembled and disassembled about a million times and some of the switches are showing their age.  

I'll post once I receive my lockons and can finally run trains properly on the thing.  It's just a temporary setup on a ping pong table covered in green outdoor carpet.  I've been auditioning track plans for years and I really like this one.  Plenty of parking, the internal spurs are fun for operations, and the dreaded S-curves deliver some panache you don't get with ovals.  If only I could get the electrons to go all the way around!

@Jon G posted:

The realtrax switches use a printed circuit board under the switch points to conduct electricity from the center entrance rail of the switch to the center rail between the points and the exit center rails.  If a derailment occurs on the side of the switch opposite a lockon, the trace in the pcb will fry causing the center rails to be dead.  The MTH solution is to solder the center entrance rail to the center rail between the points, or replace the pcb.  You can check continuity between the center rails with a VOM, test light or lighted car.

Hey that's great to know, thanks!  I have found two switches that have this problem.  Well, problem, but also an opportunity to teach my four-year-old about soldering.

@Jon G posted:

The realtrax switches use a printed circuit board under the switch points to conduct electricity from the center entrance rail of the switch to the center rail between the points and the exit center rails.  If a derailment occurs on the side of the switch opposite a lockon, the trace in the pcb will fry causing the center rails to be dead.  The MTH solution is to solder the center entrance rail to the center rail between the points, or replace the pcb.  You can check continuity between the center rails with a VOM, test light or lighted car.

Okay this explains why I don’t have power to the top right corner of the layout! Where do I solder, side of the rails? I took the bottom off the switch and don’t see any wires or other connections to solder.

It’s not at the bottom, but at the entrance center rail to the rail between the swivel points.  Clean the blackening agent off the side of the rails before soldering and use flux.

Here is a sheet I include with any switches I repair or sell.

Excellent, thank you!