gunrunnerjohn posted:Well, it actually caught fire doing the repair, so in a way I lost it on the repair.
Really, What did you do? G
As Clint would say, a Man needs to know his limitations. But on the serious side, learning some of the in and outs of repairs from some one who has done it, especially if your a do it yourselfer with competencies is not a bad thing.
Just to be clear MTH does hold courses at MD. G
GGG posted:gunrunnerjohn posted:Well, it actually caught fire doing the repair, so in a way I lost it on the repair.
Really, What did you do? G
George, it's a joke. 
Well, not the part about sacrificing a board at times, it's easy to do something stupid and cook one.
gunrunnerjohn posted:GGG posted:gunrunnerjohn posted:Well, it actually caught fire doing the repair, so in a way I lost it on the repair.
Really, What did you do? G
George, it's a joke.
Got it
Yes we all toast a board or 2, just want to know what could cause a fireball! G
I've been known to get a small fire started, but I try to minimize the damage.
George,
And qualified does not mean certified.
True, however, certification is factual while qualified is an opinion. 
So then has anyone who attended the MTH classes been deemed un-qualified to be certified? Can you fail train fixing school?
I suspect you could fail Matt, but most of the folks that go seem motivated to succeed.
Barry Broskowitz posted:George,
And qualified does not mean certified.
True, however, certification is factual while qualified is an opinion.
I agree just being a smarty pants to the stalker G
LOL, you guys who are so against web based training must have missed this comment from MTH:
MTH is looking at moving as much information as possible to the website so service training can be done online. We feel this is a much more effective way to reach a broader base while still providing excellent training resources.
Moreover, colleges are moving all sorts of classes online, which often includes discussions held via webcams and group meeting software. I know several people who have earned their masters and doctorates through online education.
Yes, I'd agree that live, in person interactions are preferable, but they aren't always practical.
I'd be hesitant to send my stuff to somebody who watched some videos and now feels "qualified" to dismantle and repair my $1500 steam engine.
Heck, there are only about 3 persons I know to who I would entrust even a $500 engine, all 3 of whom have posted in this thread. I can recall over the years encountering certified techs who were, as a matter of fact, not qualified to service trains.
C W Burfle posted:Yes, I'd agree that live, in person interactions are preferable, but they aren't always practical.
Pretty much what I said earlier. I do like the personal interactions of a live classroom setting, but you can certainly learn a lot with web based training. One has to remember one fact about "live" classroom training, or any training for that matter. In the span of a two or three day class, you are not going to learn all the in's and out's of the trade, that only comes after a lot of field experience.
Another thing to consider is most folks taking the classes have been doing model train service for a long time, they're just going to learn the particulars of the manufacturer's products. I don't care if the classes were two weeks or a month, if that was the only training and experience a tech had, I sure wouldn't let him work on my stuff! I'm sure if you talk to anyone that's been doing this for some time, you'll hear some interesting stories where things didn't go right, those are the learning experiences that you can only get from working in the trade.
The idea is to have the person doing the work to have had his (or her) share of those experiences that they've learned from.
C W Burfle posted:LOL, you guys who are so against web based training must have missed this comment from MTH:
MTH is looking at moving as much information as possible to the website so service training can be done online. We feel this is a much more effective way to reach a broader base while still providing excellent training resources.
Moreover, colleges are moving all sorts of classes online, which often includes discussions held via webcams and group meeting software. I know several people who have earned their masters and doctorates through online education.
Yes, I'd agree that live, in person interactions are preferable, but they aren't always practical.
LoL too. I think there are more than a few studies that say it is not as effective, and quality of student measure in field is not as good either. At least if your an organization acting as a filter. If you are just for profit trainer, who cares. On Line Master Degree mean something? Yep, you can get plenty of them from all sorts of schools and countries. What is the accreditation. Ultimately it comes down to the student and their effort. Like working at home.
In the end some companies do trade off training for expense and profit. In fact, in many companies it is the first budget to be cut. Just because it is being done does not mean it is the best way to be done. G
I think the debate between on-line and classroom training is somewhat pointless. Both types of training have advantages and disadvantages. FWIW, I see plenty of stuff on web based training that is positive as well as negative, so I don't think the opinion that it's obviously inferior is necessarily always valid. From all I read, the better web based training is actually designed from the ground up to be web based. If a company tries to take a classroom course and simply put it on-line, that will probably yield an inferior result.
Some pages on the topic, I tried to weed out the ones that were for training companies that obviously have an ax to grind. I think the topic is far from settled.
Study Finds That Online Education Beats the Classroom
Comparing the Effectiveness of Classroom and Online Learning
eLearning vs Classroom Training—How Different Are They?
Are You Ready for Computer-Based Training?
Hey it's new it must be better. The fact you can't afford how you use to train has nothing to do with it, and I have all the Power Point Slides to prove it! Too much of my opinion is tilted from Military. Not that simulation isn't beneficial in areas. Obviously job scope/degree has an effect. Funny you don't see a lot of car, truck, airplane mechanic/electrician tech schools all based on online course work...no hands on training to be certified. G
I agree with GGG, Marty ,Matt ,John etc., I really feel the in person hands on training is always the best and you will get the most out of that type of training as long as your truly interested in wanting too learn and not just trying to become Mr. fixit on your on personal trains. I have personally taken microprocessor board repair down to the component level when I worked in nuclear power repairing all types of computer boards in security systems and radiation monitoring systems all microprocessor based with test rigs, vcr's etc.
believe me the best training with HANDS ON TRAINING is classroom as Marty stated earlier in this forum . you also get other people twists on how things work and tricks of the trade of how to replace a sometimes difficult part to replace or where to purchase the required parts.
I hope MTH stays with the class room hands on training, if not I will understand because it is expensive to set up classes like that! IMHO
ALAN
On Line Master Degree mean something? Yep, you can get plenty of them from all sorts of schools and countries. What is the accreditation.
The program with which I am familiar is run by SUNY Empire State College. It's part of the State University of NY.
Is that good enough?
Guys,
In the third message in this thread (which supposedly was posted by MTH) the web based training was first mentioned as being something that MTH wanted to go to, so, if as you say, this isn't practical, don't you think maybe all would be better served explaining this fact to MTH (after all, it was their idea). That said, isn't having as much good information about DCS available to everyone on the web something that would benefit everyone, just as having this forum to disseminate information is beneficial?
Bill in FtL
Bill Nielsen posted:Guys,
In the third message in this thread (which supposedly was posted by MTH) the web based training was first mentioned as being something that MTH wanted to go to, so, if as you say, this isn't practical, don't you think maybe all would be better served explaining this fact to MTH (after all, it was their idea). That said, isn't having as much good information about DCS available to everyone on the web something that would benefit everyone, just as having this forum to disseminate information is beneficial?
Bill in FtL
Yes, But they are still holding courses. It is Lionel who has not had a course in many years and has been on record as working on an on line course. Certainly having info on line is useful/good. Look how much is posted here and above in the references. How to train, how to cert, and who wants what type is for the manufactures and LHS to determine. For me, I have no issue traveling to a school. Some one in CA may think different. You can do everything you train to on line in a hands on course, there are plenty of things you do in a class room that can't be replicated on line. Whether that matters...???? G
I do not have enough time do do everything I want at York. I hit York all three days. I feel all training should be done at the facility. Show and tell goes a long way. A lot more goes into training than folks think. Nobody will ever know what Jason Wenzel knows. If you learn from him, you learn the right way.
