Now we're talking. Melgar, I love the Bipolar. Great looking engine. Marty, your layout is legendary. Would love to see it someday. Nice catenary systems, Jonathan and Dan. Great pictures Pat and Billy and I loved the video, Glen. Today, I'll add a unique electric because it's an electric switcher. The BB1 originally run as a pair but later separated as a B1 is a small electric switcher used by the Pennsy to switch cars in the Northeast Corridor.
Running under wire is the only way to go. All my electrics take power from the overhead. Track power is for the passenger car lights. Filmed this just before I took down my layout on the mainland. Don
scale rail posted:Running under wire is the only way to go. All my electrics take power from the overhead. Track power is for the passenger car lights. Filmed this just before I took down my layout on the mainland. Don
Don, you created a magnificent work of art: the layout, Trains, music and scenery, special effects, film production, is all second to none. I absolutely loved it.
Arnold
Pat Kn posted:Now we're talking. Melgar, I love the Bipolar. Great looking engine. Marty, your layout is legendary. Would love to see it someday. Nice catenary systems, Jonathan and Dan. Great pictures Pat and Billy and I loved the video, Glen. Today, I'll add a unique electric because it's an electric switcher. The BB1 originally run as a pair but later separated as a B1 is a small electric switcher used by the Pennsy to switch cars in the Northeast Corridor.
Wonderful, Pat.
Marty Fitzhenry posted:I run live wire and think an electric with pans reaching for the sky without wire looks silly.
I agree with you, Marty.
All I know about electrics is that as a young child, around 5 or 5 years old, my mother took me with her on a New Haven commuter train with pantographs and catenary from Mt Vernon, NY to Grand Central Station. I was awestruck by that train, as I was with the GG1 at Penn Station from NYC to Trenton/Princeton Junction, NJ.
I literally did not know anything about pantographs when I posted this topic. I have learned from the replies in this thread.
It seems that even when operating, the pantographs are not fully extended, only extended enough to ride the overhead electric wire(s).
Arnold
I run on that new Tesla system as well 
Half an extension at least to above this roofline 
I use a stainless wire with a hoop to fit in the half moon and catch the bases lip when slid over to the tab, leaned forward, and the pant. is lowered to a tiny hook bent into the wire end. Gravity mostly keeps it hooked when depressed accidentally.
The DT&I was bought by Henry Ford and electrification began. He also invested heavily in The Virginian in hopes of bypassing the Saint Lawrence Seaway and keeping more shipments an in house affair. The bridge over the Ohio was never secured or we might have seen him and Edison electrifying everything from Virginia Beach to Detroit too.
They ran some average big box cabs of the era too, I forget what at the moment. We still have some really cool art deco cement catenary arches around town, and some dreamers in the 80s wanted the scrap bound GG-1s to use here as a re-introduction; but no electrics ran here for many decades.
.....except for maybe the tow locos of the Detroit River's tunnel to Canada.
One of the things I really enjoy about watching electrics operate is the movement of the pantograph relative to the trolley wire. The arcing is fun, but watching that pantograph ever so subtly move up and down is one of the fun aspects of overhead electrified railroading. I'm also drawn by the massive horsepower ratings, the speed and the relatively quietness of an electric locomotive. My last trip back east last summer, I got to see a plethora of electrics while waiting for NJT at the Newark Airport Station. The most fun one was the ACS64 powered "clocker" blowing past the station right next to the platform at what appeared to be over 100 mph. It's there and then it's not. That's a rush. As a child feeling how smoothly the GG1s negotiated the high speed switches on the NEC was alway a treat as well.
However, I respect those who run with the wire and those who don't. We all enjoy the hobby differently and that is what makes it great.
My next layout is planned to be 2 rail and I would like to find a prototypical system or get the nerve up to build my own. There is an HO layout that is featured on several facebook pages I follow that has the most realistic catenary I have ever seen down to working position light signals and great scenery. I hope to achieve that in O one day. Probably in my retirement if I am blessed enough to have one. In the meantime a few more photos of my own electrics as well as some prototype photos I've taken. Love the complexity of the wire at Lancaster!
Marty Fitzhenry posted:I run live wire and think an electric with pans reaching for the sky without wire looks silly.
I agree wholeheartedly, my friend. But since I'm restricted to a floor layout, I have to either imagine the overhead wires or restrict my electric roster to NYC prototypes.
Today I will post pictures on my P5a's. The first P5s were built as box cabs. The crews didn't like the box cab design for safety reasons. A grade crossing accident in which the crew were killed led to the substitution of a streamlined steeple type cab for the final 28 locomotives. This design was not given a separate class designation since it was mechanically and electrically identical; they were called class P5a (modified), and colloquially Modifieds. The P5a Modified design was taken from the drawing board of the GG1 which was being designed at the time.
Good morning all:
Please pardon my tardiness to the 'pantograph party'. I do not have the scenery some of you guys do, nor the delightfully feverish activity of Marty's layout. However, catenary powered systems are my niche in this hobby, and the only way I will ever run trains. I have great respect for layouts with electric locomotives and no catenary (or diesels or steam), but I do not prefer to operate that way.
I build robust catenary systems that have the same operational delights and challenges that the real systems do. My wire is under several PSI of tension from adjustable pull-off points, and the entire system is scratch built with parts from Lowe's or HD. The only 'special order' item was the 125ft copper wire spool.
The wire and immediate supports are prototypical of Amtrak catenary above New Haven, and are to scale. The extended supports and other structures are my own designs and not to scale. Operational realism and sturdiness is the aim. The system's construction details can be found here.
I also fabricate my own pantograph shoes and modify pantograph upward tension on the wire as needed for reliable pantograph/catenary interaction. The following are for MTH AEM7s.
I think they are pretty close. I do not paint my pans.
The following are the final models for MTH E44s.
Again, they are close enough for me. This is the pan for the PRR E44 in Strasburg, PA.
I pulled the junk pan that came with the E33 and replaced it with a Japanese brass pantograph.
Pans and the wire are lubricated with silver conductive grease.
Below is the "pantograph factory", AKA the back part of my loft space.
My operational period is the early 80s Amtrak on the NEC or Keystone Line (the old PRR main between Philly and Harrisburg). Also, long coal drags on the Enola Branch, Port Road, and the A&S branch. As such, you will find AEM7s , E44s and E33s on my system. I run DCS6.x with all PS3 locomotives.
I use a stripped MTH AEM7 as a catenary test/alignment vehicle. It is un-powered and a direct short between the wire and outer rails. That is by design, just like the real cat maintenance vehicles.
Below are the videos I have up for the system.
The E44s pull a 21-car coal drag of Lionel die-cast metal hoppers that carry real coal. The E33 is the helper on the rear. I hope to shoot the coal drag soon, along with other run-bys and rides.
I run the system hard, and to date have never had a derailment or operational failure of a pantograph. There have been only 2 minor instances of catenary support failure, which was remedied with some minor design updates. In addition to my desire to share what I do with all of you, it is tremendously relaxing to lay on the couch and listen to the electrics roll.
Thanks, Arnold. This is a great thread.
Impressive and innovative craftsmanship!
Pantenary posted:Good morning all:
Please pardon my tardiness to the 'pantograph party'. I do not have the scenery some of you guys do, nor the delightfully feverish activity of Marty's layout. However, catenary powered systems are my niche in this hobby, and the only way I will ever run trains. I have great respect for layouts with electric locomotives and no catenary (or diesels or steam), but I do not prefer to operate that way.
I build robust catenary systems that have the same operational delights and challenges that the real systems do. My wire is under several PSI of tension from adjustable pull-off points, and the entire system is scratch built with parts from Lowe's or HD. The only 'special order' item was the 125ft copper wire spool.
The wire and immediate supports are prototypical of Amtrak catenary above New Haven, and are to scale. The extended supports and other structures are my own designs and not to scale. Operational realism and sturdiness is the aim. The system's construction details can be found here.
I also fabricate my own pantograph shoes and modify pantograph upward tension on the wire as needed for reliable pantograph/catenary interaction. The following are for MTH AEM7s.
I think they are pretty close. I do not paint my pans.
The following are the final models for MTH E44s.
Again, they are close enough for me. This is the pan for the PRR E44 in Strasburg, PA.
I pulled the junk pan that came with the E33 and replaced it with a Japanese brass pantograph.
Pans and the wire are lubricated with silver conductive grease.
Below is the "pantograph factory", AKA the back part of my loft space.
My operational period is the early 80s Amtrak on the NEC or Keystone Line (the old PRR main between Philly and Harrisburg). Also, long coal drags on the Enola Branch, Port Road, and the A&S branch. As such, you will find AEM7s , E44s and E33s on my system. I run DCS6.x with all PS3 locomotives.
I use a stripped MTH AEM7 as a catenary test/alignment vehicle. It is un-powered and a direct short between the wire and outer rails. That is by design, just like the real cat maintenance vehicles.
Below are the videos I have up for the system.
The E44s pull a 21-car coal drag of Lionel die-cast metal hoppers that carry real coal. The E33 is the helper on the rear. I hope to shoot the coal drag soon, along with other run-bys and rides.
I run the system hard, and to date have never had a derailment or operational failure of a pantograph. There have been only 2 minor instances of catenary support failure, which was remedied with some minor design updates. In addition to my desire to share what I do with all of you, it is tremendously relaxing to lay on the couch and listen to the electrics roll.
Thanks, Arnold. This is a great thread.
Thank you for sharing your techniques and materials for building realistic scale catenary, Your videos show that your electrics and operating pantographs and catenary look and run great, and as good a model of same as I have ever seen.
You might be able to make some serious money as a professional modeler duplicating what you have done for affluent O Gauge hobbyists and clubs, especially if you can build such catenary systems relatively quickly.
Love your layout. I love electrics much more than diesel and some steam. When I was a child back in the 70's and 80's I would go down to the New Brunswick train station and watch for hours. I would see a bunch of different E60's with screens on the windshields to GG'1's with paint coming off with different paint schemes showing. My grandfather worked for the Pa railroad for 43 years. Maybe that's another reason I am into the hobby.
Thanks for posting information on your catenary system. Very interesting cat system you have, I really enjoyed your videos.
M. Mitchell Marmel posted:Marty Fitzhenry posted:I have seen many people do big time damage to pans by hitting bridges above or a tunnel.
They also don't play well with gi-raffe telltales when raised.
Mitch
I was mulling over the use of Marklin overhead with Lionels and the fact that pantographs don't play well with giraffe/brakeman telltales...
And then a little lightbulb lit!
For $2 a pop, you can buy all the overhead catenary supports your heart desires, add a bit of music wire or brass rod, and hang Marklin catenary to your heart's content! Single track, double track, triple track, even! Just drill proper size holes in your roadbed and go to town! For double and over track, just add another telltale pole on the other side of the tracks...
Definitely a "now why didn't I think of this earlier" moment...
Mitch
All:
The photo below is the ultimate "stretched pantograph". It is almost comical.
From the Navajo Mine Wiki page: "The catenary has a voltage of 25 kV 60 Hz AC. The pantographs of the E60s are mounted on top of pedestals on the roof to adapt their working height to the unusual high catenary position."
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