Sunset 3rd Rail CNW H-1

GNNPNUT

   Agreed with that!

Just my opinion, but I have had to turn the sound DOWN on all my Sunset/3rd Rail models, as well as all my MTH and Lionel models! Unless I am running something at a train show on our Independent Hi-Railers, Mid-West Division modular layout, I find the sounds just too darn loud for my home layout, even when we are having a "Run beer, Drink trains" session.

Ive been on and in both the SP 4449 and the Milwaukee 261 and I have the 261 on my layout with with almost 20 other scale steamers. I love steam and I love the CNW. i bought the H1 because I love C&NW and the 3rd rail model was not a disappointment by any means. Knowing what I know now, I still would have bought it because i cannot get it any where else. The detailing is good and it is a nice loco, I like the engine but I don't love it. There are enough quirky details about it that put it at the just nice instead of great. For instance, its an enormous PITA to plug the tender in and the smoke is not that great. Much like my Lionel engines the smoke is mediocre. My MTH locos look like they are on fire when they smoke and the puffing is incredible, on my H1 its hard to tell if its smoking form 5 feet away. Then there is the new sound system, which I cannot bag on because 3RD Rail is stuck buying the TMCC system from Electric RailRoad and I have the to be thoroughly impressed with their products. Lionel is dropping the ball not making Legacy upgrades for sale but that is a different discussion altogether. If I were rating this loco on a 5 star scale it gets 4 1/2 for looks and detail deduct half a star for the ugly wires on the tender harness, 3 stars for sound, 3 for functionality because of the tender harness and the smoke. All in all 3 stars

Not THAT'S funny! 

What does that have to do with this discussion, however?

Everything

She wasn't fired up she was parked in the 261 shed while she was stored in Minneapolis. Ive seen her run and she was plenty loud. They guys down at the 261 shed are all super cool and as long as you are respectful they do not mind you being on the equipment. They are both the reason I do O gauge, I switched to O after I bought Lionel's 261 model, I realized I just cant get the impact and the fun out those dinky little N scale and HO scale trains. If you're ever in Minneapolis, look me up and ill take you down to the 261 shed

Believe me, I have been to Minneapolis MANY, MANY, MANY times. We were even there in 2009 with SP 4449, during our lay-over enroute to Train Festivel in Mich. We needed to make some repairs while at the 261 shop (4449 was NOT 'on loan').

I have also "seen her (261) run", as well as SP 4449.

Want to just throw in some facts:

We are using the same sound board (Circuit Board, Audi Amplifier) that Lionel Uses in their engines. The volume of the sounds are dictated by the speaker system used. So a new speaker might make the difference you are looking for (Hearing For) Matt.

Other than that, I believe the H-1 to be one of the most detailed and accurate models we have made to date. It is the first to use our integrated Design Team / Tooling and Factory System for accomplishing a 3 D Design of a Loco to match the prototype as closely as possible. The 2 Railer's delight in this engine is proof of our success. We had many C&NW fans pouring over our drawings, making corrections and suggestions in the process. To them we are grateful.

But, this ever shrinking pool of customers seeking scale models forces us to make these models in ever decreasing numbers, hence the upward pressure on prices.(only 90 H1 made in 3 Rail).

So, we need more and more Matts to come over from HO and N to join us in this hobby. Or we will have to be more selective in the models we can produce at any price.

So enjoy your hobby.

Thanks for listening, Scott Mann

You've got a customer here Scott, I still have the AC-9 on order and if you release any other sweet engines I want I'm gonna buy em. Like I said the only issue with the detail and accuracy I had was the tender tether otherwise it looks beautiful. this being my first 3rd rail loco I had no expectations of this loco but everyone on here was saying how loud it was and how great it sounded and I did not have that experience with mine. Whimpy smoke always bothers me, there is no end to the pile of locos on my work bench in need of some sort of upgrade so the H1 will not be getting a new speaker any time soon. I am not the nit picker of my engines that some are but I dont buy my engines to look at everything I buy gets ran. I don't usually complain about my purchases either publicly or privately but for some reason this one bugged me. Scott, Maybe when I find myself less busy and have the time to enjoy my hobby a little more there will be a new found appreciation for my H1. Your product defiantly scored big points with the fact that it worked when it comae out of the box and still works unlike 40 percent of somebody's locos I've bought. I didnt realize Vision line meant I would see them go back for service all the time. Scott, you got any of those Freedom trains left in 3 rail?

No need to defend yourself. Everyone has their preferences. Grateful for your business too.

Yes, we have GS-4 in Freedom Color's In Stock.

We should talk when I get back after the 20th

Scott - China

hello Scott.............

Thank you for the copy of the drawings of the engine but where is the copy of the tender drawing? I still love my Sunset 3rd Santa Fe Texan and it still running well and we don't use the smoke unit at all due to the fact I have asthma.

the woman who love the S.F.5011,623

Tiffany

Hello Scott. I see 90 H1 Made in 3-Rail.  How many weare made in 2-Rail . I have two in  2-Rail. and one more ordered. in my opinion money well spent for a C&NW H1  engine never made before in o-scale in this price range. I would also Like to say thank you fore making this one. and job well done.   thank you scott. 

We are using the same sound board (Circuit Board, Audi Amplifier) that Lionel Uses in their engines. The volume of the sounds are dictated by the speaker system used. So a new speaker might make the difference you are looking for (Hearing For) Matt.

I didn't buy an H-1: outside my interests, as nice as it is. However, at its price I would have thought that a premium speaker, properly baffled, would have been provided. And thus endeth any criticism I have of 3rd rail products.

But, this ever shrinking pool of customers seeking scale models forces us to make these models in ever decreasing numbers, hence the upward pressure on prices.(only 90 H1 made in 3 Rail).

Inevitable. As you move away from models of ubiquitous locomotives and railroads, the number of folks willing and able to buy is going to shrink. We remain grateful that you will produce other models even if in lower numbers. Still, we are getting pretty far along the cost curve for many of us; now the model has to be absolutely, positively a must-have. My example is the B&O P-7. I'd "like" to have one, but I'd then have to come up with a string of proper B&O passenger cars (not repainted PRR equipment), so it's a no-go (OTOH, if GGD produces the Cincinnatian set I'll be all over it...).

Any folks with complaints, albeit minor, should recognize that this locomotive, and a fair number of other locomotives, would never have seen the light of day, in O Scale, without Sunset 3rd Rail. In earlier years, all that was produced was the "Holy 5", ATSF/Pennsy/NYC/UP/SP.   Any other roads were orphans........like the C&NW! I, for one, am very appreciative of the efforts of Scott in broadening the foundation of available locomotives in O Scale. I love my Canadian Pacific 4-8-4, 2-10-4, and D10 4-6-0's as well as CNR and GTW 4-8-4's!

I wasnt complaining, I was just giving my honest opinion. Third rail makes nice stuff and I have tons of engines and none of them are have to have locos. Come to think of it, the im not all that in love with any of them. Now as I am preparing for yet another call to Lionel to send 4 more engines in for warranty I am thinking that maybe I was a little harsh on the model, I worked when I put it on the tracks. Speaks volumes, im sick of sending trains back to Lionel, this is the 4th time this year

Now THAT certainly does, doesn't it? Thinking back, out of the 18 or 19 Sunset/3rd Rail steam locomotive models I have, I can only remember ONE that "had to go back" for repair. AND that ONE, was due to packaging damage at the original Korean factory, i.e. they had wrapped it so tight to its board, that they crushed the tender trucks and the trailing truck (the Northern Pacific A-4 model).  

Matt: my comment was not pointed to you, but rather generic. It is irritating when the complaint gallery comes down on an importer. It appears that Kohs has pretty much given up the trade (I know, there were some legitimate gripes about big deposits, no deliveries). We all need to remember that any importer is a small business man, with his capital on the line. If the complaint gallery drives all the importers out, we will have no high quality, high detail products, just mass-produced toys!

I retract my previous statement about this being a thousand dollar loco. It is worth every penny of $1400 to not have problems but the wimpy smoke still bugs me

Well maybe as you progress more toward "3-Rail SCALE modeling", you will do what I, and many others, have done. That is, up-grade to Kadee couplers, and weathered locomotives & rolling stock, then shut all your smoke units OFF, so as not to screw-up the weathering.

I dont know I will ever go to scale modeling, I love smoke locomotives and dancing hobos on box cars way too much. I love the fun that comes with the "toy" train aspect of O gauge. Operating accessories and widgets and doodads are way too much fun for me to just ignore, after all Im just a 10 year old with a paycheck. The way I see it, scale railroading is for guys who love railroads and I'm a guy who loves trains not just railroads. On my layout, steam engines pull inter-modal cars and the right now the UP #80 coal turbine is heading up a string of passenger cars and the Milwaukee RD 261 is pulling super-liners. Ive got a 50 square foot amusement park dead center of my layout with 11 or 12 operating  rides and a full blown roller coaster which is pretty fricken ridiculous, I love that stuff because its fun wimpy smoke isnt fun. Maybe someday Ill be a scale railroader but for right now I stay a train guy

More Smoke: Matt, The smoke unit we use in our engines is temperature regulated and  has a Thermistor mounted under the heating element. Sometimes the factory puts them right up against each other and the heater never gets hot enough (Wimpy Smoke). If you poke around in there with a thin metal wire (Paper Clip), try to move the thermistor down 1/8th of an inch or so (Blindly) away from the heater (Try it a few times), the smoke may drastically improve. Also, the batting can get in the way of the outlet hole, poking down on it will open up the exit hole. Give it a try, if it breaks it is under warranty.

To answer the question, how many 2 Rails, we made 70 2 Rails.

Thanks for the info Scott, I have to eat my words on this one. I must have been a crab apple when I started running my H1, shouldn't formulate opinions after a 90 hour work week. My H1 sounds great, parked it nose to nose with a GS-2 and an S3 and it sounds just as good as both of them but looks so much better, 3rd Rail did a great job and I look forward to my next purchase form you

One of the guys in our modular layout group (Independent Hi-Railers, Midwest Division), brought his new C&NW H1 over to test it out and break it in. I must confess, that I have NOT seen a Sunset/3rd Rail steam locomotive model so well detailed. I must have close to 20 Sunset/3rd Rail steam locomotive models, but this new C&NW H1 truly raises the bar. I mean, when was the last time anybody saw a 3-Rail steam locomotive model with sand pipes, which include the sand NOZZLE on the end of the pipe?????

A truly superb operating model also, which had absolutely NO PROBLEM negotiating 072 curves and cross-overs. I was also impressed with the sounds, and we even had to turn the volume down in order to hold a conversation.

Sure glad I don't model the C&NW, or I would have to own on of these H1 models.

I was a little disappointed at first but quickly got over it I'm rapidly starting to love my H1. Hot Water, word around the water cooler is tat you are quite the choo choo guru.

Matt,

You might say that,,,,,,around the water cooler.

When I'm talking around the water cooler I'm usually the only one there, makes me look a little crazier. I keep reading all these good things about you, i know you know your stuff, youve put my foot back in my mouth more than once. Referencing an earlier topic, I had to call Ohio again today regarding some locos I got on Friday, I should be on a first name basis Lionel customer service I call them so much. At least I didn't have to send them in

I've kinda reached the point where I don't even run the smoke units. They sometimes "spit" on your weathering which messes things up.

You interested in seeing some never seen, other than my dad n me rail photos from the 60's? Got lots of steam diesel transition. UP turbines, Alco PA's, I'm just getting started digitizing photos and he has thousands of them from all over

Now I'm gettin there, I got an oil slick on the top of my new GP9 and it's  driving me nuts.

Help!  I am currently finishing up the construction of a Lobaugh C&NW J-4 Berkshire in 2 rail.  I can find not photos of the lettering on the rear of these tenders and would like to at least copy(with the correct number) what is on the Sunset H model assuming that the C&NW would have a standard practice for this lettering.  I saw the nice set of photos in a previous post showing the rear of the tender but cannot make out the small lettering on the top rear corners of this tender.  Can someone please tell me what this lettering says?  I know the correct coal and water capacities for the Berkshire tenders and suspect that may be what that lettering indicates.  Any input will be appreciated.

Thanks,

Joe Foehrkolb

Joe,

I sent you an e-mail with all the info you requested that I took from the sample model I still have at my house.

Bob

Bob,

Thanks

Joe