Has anyone heard from the TCA on the special boxcars they were offering last year ? I purchased a Seabee emblemed car, knowing it would be some time before they were to be shipped.
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Waiting on the Heinz car. I think delivery was to be March. I think March has passed.
The Heinz Lionel O gauge car is currently scheduled for June, 2018 delivery. The Seabees car is a 2018 convention car. It will be a while before you see this item. Stu Rankin has a status report on all of the TCA offerings on page 6 on the May, 2018 National Headquarters News.
We shall see when June Passes.
DOC posted:We shall see when June Passes.
Stu is generally pretty accurate when it comes to shipping dates.
Any more news on these cars ?
June has passed and July only has a 2 more days. Wonder what they will tell us now if anything.
As TCA Convention Car Chairman, I always pass along the most accurate information I have. The current delivery estimate based on info provided from Lionel is that the cars (both Seabees and Heinz) will be here at the end of the summer.
Stu
So to me the end of summer is the end of Aug, Then we will be told something else. It goes on and on.
I hate to poke with a shtick.. but, oh the irony. 
I'll even leave Carly Simon out of it for now 
<irame width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/nc_CCViZrFY" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>
So now November for the Heinz car. This is the last club car or offering that I will ever buy.
Who thinks we will see the Heinz car in November. I am not holding my breath.
Me neither. We got a production sample 2 weeks ago. We rejected it because the red color of the body was wrong. Graphics looked great though.
Looks like December because we won't cut corners on quality. Otherwise they would have been here in November.
Stu
Dan Padova posted:Has anyone heard from the TCA on the special boxcars they were offering last year ? I purchased a Seabee emblemed car, knowing it would be some time before they were to be shipped.
Dan
We received a production sample of the Seabees car. It was approved. They should be here late November.
Stu
The Seabees Box Car is in production. I received an updated sample of the Heinz Box Car. It's been approved. We're getting there.
Stu
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Stu
I missed the SEABEES ORDER ANY AVAILABLE?
GG1GUYY
GG1GUYY posted:Stu
I missed the SEABEES ORDER ANY AVAILABLE?
GG1GUYY
Maybe. TCA does not order extra cars to cover orders after the deadline. A couple cars were ordered to cover lost/damaged cars. If these aren't needed for lost/damaged replacements, then they will be available to TCA members on the wait list. To see if there's spots on the wait list, email Amy at membership@traincollectors.org
I only handle design, not order fulfillment.
Stu
Heinz Box Cars are done. Sitting in Lionel warehouse on a pallet waiting to ship to TCA right after Christmas. These will be in members hands in January.
Seabees cars are getting decorated right now. They're about a month away from delivery.
Stu
GG1GUYY posted:Stu
I missed the SEABEES ORDER ANY AVAILABLE?
GG1GUYY
Not that this will make you feel any better, but the Seabee boxcar is now to be shipped in January. We've heard this before.....LOL As soon as the car was announced, I plunked down my money. Ex U S Navy Seabee here. MCB-7, Dong Ha, Republic of Vietnam, 1968/69.
I agree Dan These cars are coming. We have heard that over and over.
I will never order another special car from any club etc.
I'd blame the MFG, not punish the TCA 
.
Waiting on club cars isn't really new. It's proportionally about the same I think considering it's a longer wait for anything "special" today.
They didn't hold off on everything, and I cant recall what it was now, but I know I waited over a year for a missing item in my space X set as a kid. I was worried I'd never get it as it wasn't looking to hot on Lionel staying in business. I think I waited until 67 or 68 before we got a call.(Gramps had pull too)
What I don't recall was being fed B.S. which I'd guess Stu may have been fed by Lionel. (any ideas to help him? 
)
The Heinz looks good. "Worth the wait"...? (obligatory katsup joke )
DOC posted:I agree Dan These cars are coming. We have heard that over and over.
I will never order another special car from any club etc.
I'm with you Thom. I don't usually go for any of the special cars marketed by any of the clubs I belong to. But I had to have the Seabee boxcar, for obvious reason.
When a club orders a car from a MFG there should be in the contract that the car should be here by this date. If it is not then the cost should be reduced by a %. Then have a second date they miss it goes down % more. Maybe that would help get these cars done in a reasonable amount of time. what does the MFG care they have the money and they do it over and over.
Getting them to do "custom" cars at all is iffy from what I gather.
If it was that easy, Menards would still have Lionel making cars like they had in the past. I suspect "no" had a lot to do with them entering the market.
DOC posted:When a club orders a car from a MFG there should be in the contract that the car should be here by this date. If it is not then the cost should be reduced by a %. Then have a second date they miss it goes down % more. Maybe that would help get these cars done in a reasonable amount of time. what does the MFG care they have the money and they do it over and over.
In the construction world, there are incentives and penalties to completing a project on time or behind schedule.
Still waiting......
Heinz are at the Business Office. They're in the process of shipping them out.
Seabees are on a truck between Lionel warehouse and TCA Business Office.
Stu
Dan Padova posted:DOC posted:When a club orders a car from a MFG there should be in the contract that the car should be here by this date. If it is not then the cost should be reduced by a %. Then have a second date they miss it goes down % more. Maybe that would help get these cars done in a reasonable amount of time. what does the MFG care they have the money and they do it over and over.
In the construction world, there are incentives and penalties to completing a project on time or behind schedule.
There are more than likely also more than one construction company trying to win a given job as new business, not passing on the business and only begrudgingly doing it because there are no such clauses.
-Dave
Haven't seen any comparisons with the LOTS 2014 Convention Heinz car, or heard any mention of it. Very sharp car, IMHO (it's a scale double-sheathed boxcar, probably more correct for the billboard era). Here are a few shots of mine. It would be nice to see this and the TCA Heinz car running together. Colorwise, it would be a neat black & white color contrast.
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So got my long waited for TCA Heinz car. What a disgrace TCA put ou such a piece of crap. Overpaid for a O gauge car them the paint job is terrible. Shame on the TCA. Plus the red is flat not bright at all.
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That's how all the USA made boxcars look. They are ink jetted with UV curable ink. Allows complex graphics for low volume runs. Over time the tech will keep improving. I think its a nice looking boxcar.
Thom,
You are absolutely correct. That's why I stopped buying that stuff a few years ago.
Norm
If that's the kind of products the Lionel USA turns out have them made in CHINA. A product that cost $95 should be better than this.
It is a nice car that's why I bought the overpriced car. I collect Heinz. But this one will not be in my collection.
I just hope I can get my $95 back when I sell it at the next train Meet.
DOC posted:If that's the kind of products the Lionel USA turns out have them made in CHINA. A product that cost $95 should be better than this.
It is a nice car that's why I bought the overpriced car. I collect Heinz. But this one will not be in my collection.
I just hope I can get my $95 back when I sell it at the next train Meet.
Hate to tell you, but China cars have just "different" issues these days, not "no" issues. The method used for US cars, while not perfect, is generally less prone to random defects than the China products. I have a bunch of the US cars done using the method used for this Heinz car.
As Mike W stated, the things you are noticing are consistent artifacts of the production method, and right now the printer they use to do this is not able to print colors from the top of the car looking down on details that protrude form the flat surface of the side of the car (door guide edge, top of ladder rungs). Do I hope they can evolve the process to address this and improve in the future? Sure I do. But I find it more acceptable than the China stuff right now.
China products recently are much more susceptible to careless cosmetic manufacturing defects. I mean paint where it doesn't belong, paint that has somehow been scratched and again carelessly touched up in a manner that is so obvious that it draws attention to the defect, chips on the truck frames when they are painted. Things like that. As I say, it's random. I recently had experiences with 2 add-on passenger cars, and found issues of some sort with 4 cars (2 types of car, 2 of each) that I looked at before accepting at the hobby store. A person who has recently picked up the actual main set has not seen any issues. I have not picked up mine yet, I hope when I do I am as lucky as he was with his set, but it concerns me.
While the USA made products are not perfect, I'll take that over random defects that draw my eye to them. Your car, while you are entitled to be unhappy with the way it looks, is quite consistent and not actually showing any actual manufacturing defect in the finish itself that I can see (note the same artifacts are clearly visible in the sample Stu posted in early November - obviously you had committed to the order at that point, but what he showed is what you got, IMO). I know that's a fine line, and you are entitled to think it's BS or defending Lionel. I guess if this was the first US made car you've ever seen, you would have no idea that they all have those characteristics. It's more prominent on cars like this where the base color for the roof and ends is different than the sides. That's of course why you see the red color of the car itself where it really should be white on this car. Had the car been made with similar graphics to the car Breezinup showed, it probably would have been less obvious, since all but the lowest rungs of the ladders and the lower door guide were on a base of black, just like the main color of the roof and ends.
As to the overpriced nature, I think we all understand that we pay more for limited club runs than standard items. While the MSRP on a USA general issue car may be $85, most of us buying at a LHS are not paying anywhere near that. One of the US based companies that used to do small runs of special car decoration for clubs unfortunately folded up his tent a few years ago (along with his own line of trains), so a new method was needed for club cars.
As to getting your money back with a resale, I wish you luck. Hopefully there is somebody who would like this car that missed the order period and is still interested. You might not want to print your endorsements of what "crap" the car is and place them next to the item on your table though. Based on your descriptions of the item in this thread alone I'd pay you $40-$50 to take your "crap" off your hands, even if I would have happily paid full price (had I been interested) from TCA in the first place, since I had experience with the manufacturing method and would have known what I was ordering.
-Dave
Yeah club runs will always be more expensive and slower to market. They always have been and this is nothing new. The Made in USA aspect lets them control a small quantity of production. China requires too large of an order in many cases. I will take a low volume, quirky, made in USA club car any day. I also like the upcoming TCA Tinplate Orient Express fantasy piece. Too bad only 8 people will get to enjoy. I am sure the option exists to paint and mask more areas on the car and then ink jet the rest but I assume that varies the price and number required to order.
DOC posted:So got my long waited for TCA Heinz car. What a disgrace TCA put ou such a piece of crap. Overpaid for a O gauge car them the paint job is terrible. Shame on the TCA. Plus the red is flat not bright at all.
Not seeing an issue. Looks great to me. I like it. I guess I'm not that picky. BigRail
Dave45681
The LOTS car that Breezinup was not made this way it is painted I have two of them. They are Professionally done. I believe in China. The car STU posted was a sample. I thought that the final production would look much better. I think it is sad that people accept items like this.
I don't think I am the only one that thinks the quality of this car is acceptable. Many of my friends do not like they way it looks either.
I posted in another thread that I received my Seabee boxcar. Probably should have posted it here. I am very pleased with the car. In the end, the wait was worth it.
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DOC posted:Dave45681
The LOTS car that Breezinup was not made this way it is painted I have two of them. They are Professionally done. I believe in China. The car STU posted was a sample. I thought that the final production would look much better. I think it is sad that people accept items like this.
I don't think I am the only one that thinks the quality of this car is acceptable. Many of my friends do not like they way it looks either.
I'm aware of that, I was only comparing the design of the decoration (not the manufacturing methods used), pointing out that since the side of your car is basically white, but the roof and ends are pure red, it's more noticeable. Red stands out against white pretty significantly (as would most colors, aside from maybe pale yellow or light grey).
For the design of the older car from 2014, with much of the side of the car being black (same as the roof and ends), there would be less opportunity for the issue to show up, since only the lower 20-25% of the side has paint that is not the same base color.
I'm still not suggesting you have to like it, or that it's perfect (the process is not perfect, I agree with that). But I feel it's going in a better direction than many of the items coming out of China today, based on defects I see in pre-ordered items recently. To me, those defects are more objectionable than these limitations of the new process.
My point is just the look of these cars is based on the method and it's limitations vs. actual defects that are due to carelessness. I haven't seen too many of these USA assembled cars with scratches from tools (or whatever method the Chinese factory is using to ding up otherwise nice cars recently - for all I know they throw them all in a big round tote when they move them from paint to final assembly - that could easily explain the chips/dings/etc.).
Also note, the good example Dan posted just above this post possibly benefits from the base color of the car being the same for the sides and ends/roof.
-Dave
I guess they could have masked the white as well and then ink jetted the rest of the deco. Still a beautiful Heinz Boxcar and the Seabees looks great as well!
