Tinplate photos 📸 and videos 📽

@Don McErlean  Thanks so much again Don, I really enjoy learning some AF history; it's extremely rare as I said before to find such pieces in France, now since the internet it is different of course but there is no many collectors having an interest for Flyer here, only Lionel.
Thosemodels came from a very old collection, the owner passed thirty years ago and the family kept them in storage as they have no interest for trains.

All my best wishes,  Daniel

Hey Fatman......good to hear from you again, and I just love that highly decorated circus train!!! It is bright and colorful, and looks in fabulous condition for its age!!!

I also have some O gauge tinplate Sakai, but they are only the H P caboose cars, and I think I have about five or six of them, remnants from my childhood.

Daniel......your collection of AF tinplate in France is exceptional......most of the AF trains they ever produced didn't make it to Australia either.....so they are rare here as well!!

And Don....what can I say.....your are "the man" when it comes to stats on anything American Flyer....thank you for your vast knowledge.

I have just received some more Buco tinplate loco's, and bits and pieces from my friend in Switzerland - Beat Joller (aka "Jomo" on the Ricardo Swiss auction site).

Two 301 loco's (0 4 0 wheel configuration) and two 304 loco's (2 4 2 configuration), as well as a passenger car, a bare freight chassis with wheels, and a sub-frame for a 301 loco.

All of the loco's are running (sort of) and will be stripped, cleaned, and parts replaced (where necessary) to bring them back to pristine operating condition.

On a very sad note, after sending an E-mail to Beat this last Monday (9th December) to let him know I had received the loco's safe and well, I received an E-mail from his son the very next day to inform me that his father passed away suddenly on 2nd December, shortly after posting the loco's to me.

I am, and I still remain shattered!!!!

RIP Beat Joller, my very dear friend!!!!

Peter.......Buco Australia.

Peter your post has both good and bad news. Good first those Buco engines look like the will make great additions to your collection. Now to the sad. I am very sorry to hear of your friend. You can never replace a life long friend all you can do is honor and remember them.
All the best my friend

Don

Very sorry to hear of your mate's passing, Buco. Run the trains and think of your good friend often, and hoist a pint in his memory at the first and every opportunity!

PD

Thank you Don and pd for your kind words.

Peter......Buco Australia.

Here is a video of a restoration of a Hornby windup shared by a member of another forum.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/vide...a7699b9a96&ei=42

@Buco  sorry to hear of your friends passing ... seems as we get older it becomes our job to mourn those friends who pass around us, just as hopefully those that outlive us will one day mourn us ...

Time is an adversary that catches us all and never tires of its task .

Oh and PS .. nice bloody locos!

One day I will find a little Buco of my own

@Buco, my condolences on the loss of your friend.

Hey guys - Always checking in, you guys are amazing collectors and fonts of knowledge.  It is a delight to see how much interest you have in the hobby. I really like Daniel’s American Flyer set found in Europe, that is super cool.

Just cleaned the pad after FFEMA left an orange sticker on my door declaring it a disaster area, ok it was time.  Just got thru a big job & got a tad behind there.  Got my dance floor back but not doing the floor layout this year, I’m motivated to building a layout for my prewar standard gauge trains. Get my butt off the floor and sitting on a high stool playing with trains, like a real man  haha.  
When I get it built I’ll get the gang back together and we will build an empire… the Lake Villa Central RR  Ok, we’ll see about that.  All my hands have been on high stools for too long, time to put a hammer in their hands again or against their heads and build a railroad we can be proud of.  
The LVCRR - I like it!

I love this plan, should be fun.  I’ll post when I have trains running.

Keep going!  Cheers        W1

Tinplate Christmas let’s see those prewar roll.

Sorry for the tardy reply Fatman. Life has been getting in the way at the moment.

Thank you for your very timely and kind words.....there is two things we can be sure of....death and taxes!!!

Stay safe and well during our current "heat wave" Fatman....and a very Merry Christmas and a happy New Year to you.

Peter.......Buco Australia.

@Michael Roth posted:

Tinplate Christmas let’s see those prewar roll.

Lionel 290E set under the Christmas tree:

It's 1936 this year...

PD

@pd- Hey Mate! that beautiful thing under the tree is "Outfit" # 290E right?  Pulled by the 259E locomotive in black with the 654 Oil, 651 Flat and 657 Caboose.  1936-37 Catalog   Beautiful display @pd I have a similar set and I am just interested in confirming its heritage.  Merry Christmas!

Best Wishes

Don

Hey guys - Awesome collecting and sharing of knowledge.  I think all I need to complete my collection of Lionel standard gauge 500 freights is a 514R refrigerator car cream with a blue roof all original in mint condish… There has to be one out there  haha.  I know they exist.  One of these days…

Tho there is a rogue 515 tank car - yellow Sunoco I think…  Might be a stretch for Santa, I don’t know if I was a good enough boy for one of those to be left in my stocking.

Plan going forward is to build a layout, I think I got it figured out.  Onward towards the fog…

Merry Xmas all you crazy train nuts!
Cheers.       W1

@William 1  -  Well here is some news you might be able to use:

1.  In 1927-1928 There was a refrigerator car labeled 514 (NO R)  The only difference between it and the 514 R was the "R" on the name plate.  In 1929 Lionel replaced the 514 Reefer with the 514R Reefer which allowed it to use the 514 number for a box car.  This car came in 3 schemes (all available in 1927-1928 ) Dark Pearl / Peacock roof ; Pearl / Peacock roof ; and Cream / Flat green roof

2. In 1929 Lionel issued the 514R which through the years came in a surprising number of color variations, especially in the 1929-1934 era.  It came in Light Pearl, Cream, Ivory or White body with Peacock, Peacock, Light Peacock, and Peacock roofs.   Then in 1935 came perhaps the most common reefer, the White / Lt. Blue roof car which was available 1935 -1940, always with Ni trim.

3 Now to the 515 Tank Car...if you are interested in variations, my reference source states that there are 22 known variations of the 515 car, more than for any other 500 series car.  The earliest is a terra - cotta car with no oil company decal available from 1927-1929.  Then came a series of Ivory tank cars, some with "Sunoco" decals and some with no decals.  Finally in about 1935 things settled down and we had the well known Silver Tank with Sunoco decal 1935-1940 and then your "rouge" tank car, the Orange Tank with Shell decal available 1936-1940.  I have a terra-cotta one, do not have a silver one and most certainly do not have an orange one!!

4. The Shell tank car is indeed a considerable rarity.  To give you an example, the David Doyle "Guide to Prewar Lionel Trains" gives a value in LN condition for the ivory or silver car as $225 with a rarity of 4 (out of 8) however for the orange tank car its $725 with a rarity of 6.  Now I list these prices not because they are absolutely correct, but just to illustrate the difference in pricing / rarity.

So Good Hunting.

Don

@Don McErlean posted:

@pd- Hey Mate! that beautiful thing under the tree is "Outfit" # 290E right?  Pulled by the 259E locomotive in black with the 654 Oil, 651 Flat and 657 Caboose.  1936-37 Catalog   Beautiful display @pd I have a similar set and I am just interested in confirming its heritage.  Merry Christmas!

Best Wishes

Don

That’s correct, Don, outfit 290E from 1936/37. The 259E is in gunmetal with the thick nickel-rimmed drivers. Fun stuff.

Have a terrific Christmas!

PD

The very rare Paya M10000 streamliner from ca 1991 in action.  This runs full throttle; 22 volts on my Z4000 transformer.

@pd- Thanks for the confirmation on that set mate!  Don

@cbq9911a- WOW...FAST!!!  Not seen one before and certainly never saw one in action.  Thanks for the video - Don

@cbq9911a posted

The very rare Paya M10000 streamliner from ca 1991 in action.  This runs full throttle; 22 volts on my Z4000 transformer.

Nice train!  I also love the popsicle-looking loads on the flatcar.

Fun Running

just having Christmas Fun more to come.

@cbq9911a:  Great shots of that Paya at full tilt!!!

From my limited knowledge, these trains were manufactured in Spain, and they suffered badly from "zinc pest" in the cast wheel sets, to the point they crumbled and cracked, and rendered the loco's inoperable.

Just asking.....have you checked the drivers on your train??

Peter........Buco Australia.

Getting ready for tinplate Christmas run scheduled for tonight.
1. MTH 260e Christmas freight train set (Red/Green/Brass)

2. MTH 263e Blue Comet W/710 Passenger Cars with Freight cars

3. Lionel 261e Prewar Christmas Train Red/Green/Brass with 600 Passenger and Freight cars.
4. Lionel 262e Prewar Black/Brass with 600 Grey/Ember Passenger Cats

6. Lionel 263e Prewar Black Yellow, with Yellow/Red Crane and Gondolas and  Caboose

7. Lionel 260e Prewar Black/Green/Brass Original with 605/6 Black Blue Passenger with Red/Green Caboose

8. Lionel 260e Prewar Lionel Orange/Brass with New Lionel Lines Freight cars, Caboose along with Prewar Orange Cattle, Spotlights, gondola

9. Lionel 260e Prewar SeaFoam/Brass with matching gondola and caboose

10. Lionel Prewar Black/Green/Brass with 710/20 and 605/6 Red/White Passenger Cars.

Merry Christmas

more to come

Merry Christmas to my international train tragics !!!

Found a last minute present to myself on ePay last night ... what I am pretty sure is an early Hafner/Overland Flyer loco that has found his way down under .

He needs a new key ( screw version) and is suffering from a broken off tender pin at the rear ( which I am pretty sure can easily be crafted by a bit of milliputty over wire to make him usable)

Also missing the boiler band , but apart from that looks to be in not bad nick ?

For the bargain $1 + postage paid how could I resist ! ( 16AUD all up or about 11USD shipped)

I love the external winding pawl, I have a suspicion this is an early production model? Would I be wrong?

Any info my esteemed mateys can add would be really cool ( as you know American stuff isn't my forte sadly)

Another "little beauty" to add to your collection Fatman.

I know you've said....."gotta watch the expenses" when it comes to tinplate wind-up trains, but I think you scored yourself a bargain this time around!!

Merry Christmas my Aussie mate from up here on a stinking hot and humid Gold Coast, Queensland.

Peter.....Buco Australia.

Hey Fatman...I just got myself a Christmas present much like yours.  I didn't post them on this post because they are cast iron not tinplate, but you have opened up that barrier.  Mine are American Flyer, both 100 years old and both have fully functional clockwork mechanisms and came with keys.

The first is slightly larger, it is the # 13 and features drive rods and an engine brake.  She was first introduced in 1923 so she is 102 years old after New Years.

The next one came with a tender as well (tender on order for #13) and she is a simpler loco and is an American Flyer #10 from 1925.   Never had drive rods even though the cylinder casting has the hole , you can see the drive wheels do not have a boss for bolting them on. She also does not have the engine brake.

Both of these are a little more worse for wear on the paint than Fatman's but I really love the old stuff and these were offered at a price I couldn't pass up.  I was surprised that although the paint is somewhat worn in places there is really no rust on the castings and no zinc pest on the drive wheel.  Now if I lived in France, I would be planning a trip to see FRENCHTRAINS to borrow his new American Flyer passenger cars which are of the same era.

Best Wishes, Happy Holidays, and Happy New Year

Don

Since we’re off the rail from tinplate can anyone identify the clockwork train the picture

Here is my Fandor set. The "transformer" chrome with wattage adjusting bulbs sold me on it. It ran around an O gauge village under my Christmas tree last year

@Michael Roth posted:

Since we’re off the rail from tinplate can anyone identify the clockwork train the picture

I group the cast iron locos in with tinplate - they typically came with tinplate cars and ran on tinplate rails.  But, I digress...

My best guess is that your loco is a Hafner "Century of Progress" type engine - they are actually stamped tin bodies instead of cast iron.  I zoomed in on your picture and this seems to be the closest loco I can find to it.  Here is a picture of one of mine from about the same angle as your picture.  This one has a red smokebox door, but they also came in an all black version.

I concur with James @WindupGuy  looks like hafner tinplate to me

@Don McErlean  I think the cast locos fit in fine with tinplate as the rest of the set would have been all tinplate !

Also crossed another off the bucket list this month , this one was spotted by a friend of mine here in Australia and he scooped it up to pass along to me , never seen one for sale here in Aus so I am grateful he found it , no big news to those of you in the USA , but the fact everyone in the USA knows what it is and how much money to charge means they are seldom a "bargain" and the super expensive post by most USA based sellers tips the desirable scale a fair bit ...

So I had to let a few moths out of the wallet , but it crosses it off the list !

( stock pic but exact to the one I have now)

Now all I need is a Lionelcraft boat to complete the ad LOL!

Edit ...darn you IMBB  photos re added !

@WindupGuy posted:

I group the cast iron locos in with tinplate - they typically came with tinplate cars and ran on tinplate rails.  But, I digress...

My best guess is that your loco is a Hafner "Century of Progress" type engine - they are actually stamped tin bodies instead of cast iron.  I zoomed in on your picture and this seems to be the closest loco I can find to it.  Here is a picture of one of mine from about the same angle as your picture.  This one has a red smokebox door, but they also came in an all black version.

Thanks, the photo is of my father-in-law, Dr. John D.Antrim PE. He passed away in November. My wife came across this photo of him. I am going to have the photo enlarged, framed and hung in our train room. Sure would be nice to find a train and shadow box below the photo.

Thanks and a very Merry Christmas to the hole lot of Yas. Best wishes to your family and friends.

Micheal and Erica

This time of the year is the time for..... a new train of course so I made myself a little Christmas gift. A little HORNBY loco French market in the colors of the EST company, dates from around 1931-32.

Finding an AF loco as Don would have been nice but unfortunately there is none for sale on my side of the pond.....

To all tinplate nuts from all over the world, have a nice Christmas and Happy New Year,

All my best wishes,  Daniel

@FRENCHTRAINS_- Hey with my loco and your cars we could make a wonderful train...the smaller cars would do the trick I think as these cast iron loco's seem small.  The loco that you showed in your current post is a French Hornby  right?  Its beautiful and in superb condition.

@Lionelski - That is a beautiful set, Fandor so it must be German (Hence not Dorfan) and the transformer with the voltage knocked down by a light bulb sets it at a quite early age.  Although if you run it with that set up...you are indeed braver than I .

@Fatman - Your pictures did not transmit, all we got were 2 large blue squares...so I remain curious about what you were talking about...can you repost.

@WindupGuy / @Michael Roth -  I agree the Hafner century of progress type seems to be the answer to the photo .  The key is also a potential strong clue.  Michael, what a treasure for sure.

Well everyone, I wish you all a very Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.  I will see you here on the forum in 2025.  All the best to you and your families

Best Regards

Don

Hey Don - Just thought I would respond, here is a pic of my 515 tank cars.  Have a nice Terra cotta, ivory & silver Sunoco.  Trainz had a yellow/orangeShell on ok condition a bit back, but I was in the middle of a big job & on a budget.  I’ll keep my eye out, you never know, would be cool to score a nice one.

I only have 2 - 514Rs.  The white one with the blue roof is def on my list to close out my collection of 500 freights.  Not even sure if the green roof guy is an original but it is a nice car so he’s in the fleet to stay.

Ok, this last pic is a goof up I discovered today.  The first car has a dent in the roof from a tv that i sheepishly admit fell on my Floor Layout Central off a stand it was duct taped to.  Ok, that was stupid…  So I bought myself a Xmas present with a new model with a good roof, which I picked up today from the post office.  Then I get home, decide to start digging thru my 500 freight boxes and discover I already bought a nice one to replace the dented one.  Oops, didn’t need that, it was $62 shipped so I’m ok with it, still a great model, but I would have much preferred a white 514R with a blue roof  haha

Just rambling I guess.  Fun hobby.

Merry Xmas!

@Don McErlean posted:

@FRENCHTRAINS_- Hey with my loco and your cars we could make a wonderful train...the smaller cars would do the trick I think as these cast iron loco's seem small.  The loco that you showed in your current post is a French Hornby  right?  Its beautiful and in superb condition.

Hello Don,  yes we could make a nice train, Your loco is really nice and my cars are not bad at all, I really enjoy those nice little cars, I just hope to find a correct loco to match with them.

The Hornby model is a French Hornby model, I look at the dates and it seems that it is a 1928-29 model, first year Hornby made EST models.

Have a great Christmas time and all my best wishes for the new year, Daniel

Don wrote: "@Lionelski - That is a beautiful set, Fandor so it must be German (Hence not Dorfan) and the transformer with the voltage knocked down by a light bulb sets it at a quite early age.  Although if you run it with that set up...you are indeed braver than I ."

Thanks Don. I ran them with a pre-war Lionel transformer.

For my research on the set, go here: A Fandor Pre-War tin Train Set - Something New for me!

@Lionelski - I read your article on the Fandor set and enjoyed it, especially liked the pictures showing details of the set.  That set was indeed an incredible find.  There is a good and quite complete history of Dorfan (the American company that continued the Fandor line ) in  "Greenbergs Guide to Early American Toy Trains - Carlisle & Finch, Hafner, and Dorfan"  The Dorfan section is written by Carlton Norris McKenney.  According to this source, the key players were the Forchhiemer brothers who left Fandor in Nuremberg , Germany in 1923 and came to America and started Dorfan in 1924.  Indeed it was their mothers, sisters Fanny and Dora who were the source of the name Fandor and subsequently Dorfan.  The American company closed in 1936 due to the economic conditions of the Depression, although sales of existing stock continued until 1937 -1938.

Glad you didn't try the "light bulb" voltage reduction idea I have seen that before and I can't believe that we thought children could play with it, especially in Europe where line current was often 240 volts!

Happy Holidays and Happy New Year

Don

@Don McErlean

Thanks for the heads up .. it showed they loaded ok here .. then obviously didnt lol!

Corrected !

But Spoiler ... Micky Mouse Handcar from 1934 lol

@Don McErlean posted:

@Lionelski - I read your article on the Fandor set and enjoyed it, especially liked the pictures showing details of the set.  That set was indeed an incredible find.  There is a good and quite complete history of Dorfan (the American company that continued the Fandor line ) in  "Greenbergs Guide to Early American Toy Trains - Carlisle & Finch, Hafner, and Dorfan"  The Dorfan section is written by Carlton Norris McKenney.  According to this source, the key players were the Forchhiemer brothers who left Fandor in Nuremberg , Germany in 1923 and came to America and started Dorfan in 1924.  Indeed it was their mothers, sisters Fanny and Dora who were the source of the name Fandor and subsequently Dorfan.  The American company closed in 1936 due to the economic conditions of the Depression, although sales of existing stock continued until 1937 -1938.

Glad you didn't try the "light bulb" voltage reduction idea I have seen that before and I can't believe that we thought children could play with it, especially in Europe where line current was often 240 volts!

Happy Holidays and Happy New Year

Don

Thanks for the kind words and the info, Don

Taking down the Christmas tree today and dismantling the under-tree display...thought I'd take a break and give the 290E set a spin around the basement layout before packing it up:

We didn't have too many holiday visitors this year due to illnesses and inclement weather. Hopefully things will be better in 2025!

PD

Not much new in the collection.

A Bing train for UK, uncataloged but possibly around 1925.

A tunnel, made by Karl Bub around 1931 - 1933 for train sets.

Arne

@Arne- Well that train is really nice but the scenes on the tunnel are just wonderful.  Thanks for sharing!!

Best Wishes

Don

On a cold day in France, time to run a train, here a restored LIONEL 42 with a set of original cars

Have a nice weekend,  Daniel

@FRENCHTRAINS - That is a great looking set Daniel !  What are the product numbers for the cars? are they also Lionel?

Best Wishes for a wonderful New Year

Don

Nice new set into the collection ... a Kraus Fandor clockwork from around 1937-

I don't know where you find these "little gems" Fatman, but this one is something else!!!

Congratulations on your new addition to the wind-up railroad empire.

Peter.......Buco Australia

Lovely little "carpet layout" Daniel @FRENCHTRAINS.

I must admit I have nothing as old as that in the Lionel brand of tinplate.

There wasn't a lot of Lionel imported into Australia in the early days due to the difference in voltage supply and their transformers.......we run 240V here in Australia (enough to kill you in a heart beat) and America only runs 110V (whimps!!!)

Peter.......Buco Australia.

@Don McErlean posted:

@FRENCHTRAINS - That is a great looking set Daniel !  What are the product numbers for the cars? are they also Lionel?

Best Wishes for a wonderful New Year

Don

Thanks Don,  the passenger cars are the most common 18 19 and 190, there is some older ones that I would enjoy to have as I have another 42 loco which is a little older.

All my best Wishes,  Daniel

@Buco posted:

Lovely little "carpet layout" Daniel @FRENCHTRAINS.

I must admit I have nothing as old as that in the Lionel brand of tinplate.

There wasn't a lot of Lionel imported into Australia in the early days due to the difference in voltage supply and their transformers.......we run 240V here in Australia (enough to kill you in a heart beat) and America only runs 110V (whimps!!!)

Peter.......Buco Australia.

Hello Peter,

Those Lionel trains have never been imported in France in their time.  From this set the loco came from Germany some years ago and I bought the cars on eBay in the USA.

Very best, Daniel

@Fatman posted:

Nice new set into the collection ... a Kraus Fandor clockwork from around 1937-

Hello Simon,

Congratulations, a really lovely set.  2025 has a great beginning so I wait to see more......

All my best wishes,  Daniel

Thanks Chaps ... Apparently my decision to slow down collecting a little has been blown out of the water lately lol

I really suck at self control

@Fatman - I am definitely slowing down in 2025...Oh wait a minute, there is something I don't have on e-bay...oh well so much for New Year's Resolutions !

Don

After a long time I had built table train cars again. Resizing 0 gauge to 00 gauge. These now even have functional sliding doors.

Arne

@Arne posted:

After a long time I had built table train cars again. Resizing 0 gauge to 00 gauge. These now even have functional sliding doors.

Arne

Great work - home made lithography is interesting.  Have you ever posted information regarding your process for doing this?

The design is drawn on the computer. It is then printed onto transfer paper using a laser printer.

The sheet metal was previously primed white. Then the color from the transfer paper is applied to the sheet using a laminator

Arne

@Fatman - I just realized that I had not commented on your beautiful Kraus Fandor set from around 1937.  It's interesting as the Forchheimer brothers came to the US in 1924 hoping to make up for lost sales due to the embargo on German products caused by WW I .  Their US company was called Dorfan (Fandor in reverse).  They went out of business in the US in 1936. So the Fandor name continued in Germany and they made your beautiful train.

@Arne - What can I say your craftsmanship is superb.  The 00 cars are beautiful and are a perfect match to the 0 scale ones you made before.  Beautiful Work!

My offering today that I did post on "Rolling Stock Monday" is this Ives #65 Livestock Transport Car.  This type of car was made by Ives between 1910 and 1925 in a bewildering number of variations.  My Ives book devotes over 2 pages of pictures just to capture those changes.  This specific car with its open slatted sides, yellow orange lithography, and 8 wheels was made between 1918 and 1925.  It is marked the New York Central and Harlem River RR as can be seen on the end view.  The diagonal braces on the side say:  "Live Stock" to the left of the door and "Transportation" to the right side.

Best Wishes everyone

Don

Well we have not been posting on this thread very much this month, I noted that my last post was over a month ago.  However at a train show yesterday, I encountered this little item which was sort of fascinating.  This is a "circuit breaker" designed to go between the power supply and the trains to protect them in case of a short circuit (like from a derailment).  These were almost exclusively pre war items as in the post war period, the circuit breaker was most often included in the transformer.  So here is a  Marx circuit breaker that I first noted in the Marx 1938 catalog as a "type 420" circuit breaker.  It was advertised as a safety device.  It is about 4 1/2 " high and the circular part at the top is about 1 1/2 " in diameter.  When it detects a short circuit it disconnects the circuit and the top lights up and sayes "Short Circuit" inside the red center piece.  That by the way is how the operation is described, I have no intention of creating a short circuit to see if it still works !

Best Wishes

Don

I have one of these that I use on my Christmas layout every year .  Works great!

@Pete in Kansas:  Thsnks Pete good to know. Best wishes. Don