Upgrading a K-Line Hudson to TMCC? PICTURES ADDED

About the only game in town anymore is Electric Railroad products. I think you will find the best deals here as well as a very knowledgeable dealer.

Pete

You need the exact model number, and it wouldn't hurt to open up the units and snap pictures. Some units marked as "upgradable" seemed to mean that the electronics fit in the shell, others actually had some of the required components and just required the addition of an upgrade kit. Hopefully, the "upgradable" is in the latter category. While you're looking, check to see if the locomotive has the handrails insulated from the case, since they're usually the antenna for the TMCC steamers.

quote:

You need the exact model number, and it wouldn't hurt to open up the units and snap pictures. Some units marked as "upgradable" seemed to mean that the electronics fit in the shell, others actually had some of the required components and just required the addition of an upgrade kit. Hopefully, the "upgradable" is in the latter category. While you're looking, check to see if the locomotive has the handrails insulated from the case, since they're usually the antenna for the TMCC steamers.

So it sounds like it may not be a slam dunk affair.

I'll have to wait until I have the engine in my hands to see what it already has. On the good side, the K-Line units I have seen and upgraded all had insulated handrails all set to hook up to the antenna wire. That should not be an issue.

Rod

There is an upgrade kit on e-bay for $50.00 buy it now. Everything you need to upgrade a TMCC ready engine. I did e-mail the original poster but he has decided to procrastinate. He who hesitates loses. Go for it!!

When they first came out I bought the upgradeable version. It wasn't so upgradeable. If I remember correctly there is a plug issue. The TMCC version is a 6 pin plug and the upgradeable version is four pins. I remember researching the issue and finally determined it was not going to work. traded it back for a factory installed TMCC and railsounds. I also seem to remember the tender motherboard was only for signal sounds, not railsounds. Also the chuff switch was an issue too. I seem to remember I talked to the K-line tech at the time.. I think his name was Sherman and we both came to the same conclusion. It probably can be worked around with considerable work, but be for warned!

The easiest way to upgrade would be a Cruise Commander and a Railsounds 4 setup installed in the tender. The 4 pin tether would be enough for track power in and DC motor power out. You need a magnet on a tender truck for chuff and the tender shell for the antenna once it is insulated from track ground. Ive done this on a 1990's Southern Mikado and it works well. The tricky part is fitting it all in the tender but the Hudson tender is huge.

Neil

I bought an upgradable K-Line GG-1, the only thing "upgradable" was it has the pantographs insulated and wired for the antenna! There was nothing else that lent itself to "upgrading", so that's why I say to open it up.

I wasn't aware of a conventional engine with Railsounds either. If it indeed does have Railsounds then you would only need a cruise commander, otherwise you would need cruise and Railsounds. You would think the conventional engine would at least have the cam on the axle so only a micro switch (cherry switch for the new guys ) for the chuff. It won't be a shake the box conversion but shouldn't be too bad with all the room available in there. The ERR Railsounds includes a Fat Boy speaker so sound should be improved if you get that.

Pete

There were Lionel "upgradable" locomotives that just required the R2LC and a bit of wiring, for one the antenna. However, "upgradables" come in a number of flavors, so you have to be specific as to what you have.

My Kline 2003 was delivered with TMCC but without cruise control. I eventually bit the bullet and had it converted to Proto2 for around $300 at the time ~ 2005. The installer indicated that it was not a simple installation and to get the smoke unit into the right spot he had to jury rig a bracket. Additionally for the proto2 conversion, the smph at 10 smph requires the dcs controller to read 16-17 smph. I think the ERR conversion would be easier and if I can have ERR control my SMR Tahoe, the Hudson should be a snap.

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Originally posted by gunrunnerjohn:
I bought an upgradable K-Line GG-1, the only thing "upgradable" was it has the pantographs insulated and wired for the antenna! There was nothing else that lent itself to "upgrading", so that's why I say to open it up.

I tried to upgrade one of those and found that the boards, etc. were long gone from availability. One other thing that was good though, was that the frame was drilled for the speaker. I ended up moving them along at a small loss and buying the version with the TMCC in them. They were offered in both "upgradable" and TMCC versions.

OK so I got the engine and took it apart to see what it has installed.
Here are a couple of pix of the inside of the tender. The boiler has no electronics at all; only the motor and the smoke unit. The latter is the standard old school K-Line plunger puffer unit.





So what do you TMCC upgrade gurus think?
Do I just need the TMCC upgrade kit as was suggested? Or more?
The sound system is signalsounds, not railsounds as I thought.

Thanks for any and all help,
Rod

quote:

OK so I got the engine and took it apart to see what it has installed.
Here are a couple of pix of the inside of the tender. The boiler has no electronics at all; only the motor and the smoke unit. The latter is the standard old school K-Line plunger puffer unit.

I would agree with what Neil suggested in post above, go with Cruise commander with Railsounds 4 from ERR. I got a Lionel "upgradable" baby hudson. If I had used the upgrade kit by Lionel I would have had to run it in CAB1 mode on my Legacy controller and sounds were not so good. I got the full TMCC Cruise Commander set of boards and it is great.

TEX
Steve

That looks like the sound only board, it handles both boards for RailSounds, and the single board for SignalSounds.

Given what you have, I agree with the above post, just replace everything with the ERR stuff.

Check with Boxcar Bill, he has discount packages on the Cruise Commander/RS Commander set, last time I bought it was $185 for both.

Steve, all the aftermarket TMCC is Railsounds 4 and not Legacy which means Cab 1 mode and less than state of the art sounds.
Rod, as pointed out in the second post above, Boxcar Bill's deal of Cruise Commander and Railsounds combo can't be beat. I'd suggest installing the Cruise Commander in the engine though where K-Line installed their TMCC. The location will be obvious plus it will require far fewer wires in the tether.

Pete

Is that a 3 wire tender harness to the engine? Back board looks like the reverse unit. Can you pull a stock number off the motherboard?

The ERR probably is the easiest, but if you had a 28000 series engine you didn't particularly like, it would have the guts to make this TMCC with RS. G

Rod , 

 

I just picked up a K-Line Mikado that look s like it just needs a board as well. Wondering what you did to get to TMCC railsounds and possibly cruise? 

 

If I could keep me existing electronic I would prefer that but if I can't pop a board in I will go ERR. 

 

Thanks

The tender in the picture has a Lionel Signal sounds setup and a K-line conventioal reverse board. A Railsounds upgrade kit (amp and sound chip boards) will plug in but you need a chuff switch. Factory TMCC Mikados have their electronics in the engine like Lionels but I think you would have to try and fit a ERR Cruise Commander board in the tender along with the RS upgrade boards.  Insulate the tender shell and use it as the antenna, put a magnet on a tender wheel for the chuff and you will be done.

Can you tell us the part numbers silk-screened on any boards and the motherboard?

We have a K-Line Hudson that came with TMCC but no cruise and sent it off to a 'well known' K-Line facility to have repaired and ERR Cruise added. After 5 months and two trips back n' forth, it now runs well. The RS4 is 'adequate' but dated and the puffer smoke is disappointing but the locomotive itself is beautiful. In retrospect I would like to have converted it to PS2 with a MTH smoke unit. How satisfactory is this conversion please?

In retrospect I would like to have converted it to PS2 with a MTH smoke unit. How satisfactory is this conversion please?

My Proto 2 Conversion of the Kline Hudson was difficult (indicated above); however, I am very pleased with the result and the engine runs well.  Because of the size, the smoke unit is the smaller MTH version, and Ron when he did the conversion, told me not to go above medium smoke which is quite adequate.