Upgrading to Command Control

at $ 299 a Railking with sound and electo couplers is hard to beat 

I don't think it would be cheaper to buy a new engine and pay to have it upgraded than a new engine with command. Electric RR cruise commander and railsounds kit will run around 200.00 plus the engine and labor to do it. You could buy some used command engines and that would get you started. If you're looking for a Legacy engine you would have to buy used or new as there are no upgrade kits available. There are several Legacy diesel engines on the market for 300-400.

Ron

The only way upgrading is an economically viable proposition is for a more expensive engine, say an old Big Boy with Proto-1, or a Williams brass engine or something like that. For cheaper engines, it's almost invariably a better deal just to buy a command engine, especially used. In fact, I've bought several used command engines solely to strip for the electronics and then resell as dummies or downgraded to conventional. 

I've upgraded a couple of Williams locos to TMCC. Both were Amtrak Genesis. They weren't too hard to do, but there was a lot of room once I got the horn out. The wiring was the easy part. The tricky part is mounting the board and especially the programming switch. 

 

For me it's all about what I have to pay for an engine plus the cost of the board. The ones I did didn't have smoke, sound, couplers or lights, though the basic board had outputs for lights and couplers. Those were actually old Digital Dynamics boards, but I think the new ERR boards are almost the same. 

It's like buying a car with a 4 cyl engine, but you want to put a 6 cyl engine in it. Better off just buying the upgraded model.

I don't agree with that. Why would they make and sell boards to convert engines to command?

 

In my case, Atlas, Lionel and Weaver don't make a model of the Genesis, and I refuse to buy any engine with DCS. I'm sure there are a lot of other similar situations out there. What about the billion pre TMCC conventional engines out there?

It really depends.  If the engine you want is made as conventional but not command, then an upgrade is your only option.  But I'd look around.  I got a Legacy U-Boat on sale (brand new with warranty) for $275 earlier this year.  Second hand engines in good condition are another way to get started for less money.

 

I have only upgraded one engine and it was a PS-1 that I had someone upgrade to PS-2.  It was worth it to me because the engine has a great deal of sentimental value.  I also wanted to run the engine and have the functionality that the upgrade would give me.  I did not take this path because it was "cheaper".

I have upgraded engines that I already owned (Weaver mostly, some Williams brass). I also added cruise to my older TMCC engines without cruise, and was adding TAS EOB to my older 2-chuffs/revolution TMCC steam engines to get four chuffs. Upgrading engines you already own makes sense to me.

The couple of times I purchased a conventional engine to upgrade turned out to be too costly for the end result (chuffs not synchronized, smoke unit not quite right, jerky). Like others, I would not recommend buying an engine with the idea of upgrading it unless it is an engine that you really want and it has not been produced with a command system.

 

Ron

I have had several engines upgraded from PS-1 to PS-2 for about $300 bucks.  That seems well worth it but not sure what you want to do is unless there is no other way to get the engine you want.  It seems you could buy a Railking engine with everything already in it for what you would pay for a Williams and then upgrade it to DCS.

.....

Dennis

Or a lionel, Atlas, Weaver. Not any savings unless as stated on post above, it's an older engine that you want to upgrade.

Most Rail King engines now have PS-2 by MTH installed in them. You used to be able to buy non/DCS equipped engines but paying the same price for either one you were better off buying the PS-2 equipped engine.

So you don't need to update a Rail King engine unless it is very old.

 

FYI; Weaver Model Trains will install command control for you, email them or call by phone first.

 

Lee F.

I'm about 3/4 of the way through my first DCS upgrade of a Premier Greenbrier. The toughest part so far (aside from my sleep-deprived state when I started) was drilling  holes in the sheet metal tender frame to mount the mainboard, and only a little less tedious than making the hole for the charging jack, (since that one is rectangular and I chose to file that one to shape after drilling the hole).

 

At this point all the tender wiring is done--I'm just waiting for some more free time to neatly bundle up the wiring (moreso than the included wire ties will allow), and start on the locomotive half. Following this will be a diesel upgrade, and later some TMCC upgrades (once I get hold of some of those kits).

 

Much of what I eventually plan to do won't really be cost effective (and at least one or two of them will be so non-economical that they qualify as stunts more than anything else) 

 

---PCJ

I think it depends on the engine you want to purchase and upgrade. For instance: Trainworld has been selling a lot of Williams by Bachmann scale diesels and scale GG1 Electrics for tremendous prices.

 

At York they had scale GG1's for $150-170, plus a 10% additional discount, depending on the version. Add the cost of upgrading to TMCC/RS4 and ERR cruise at about $200, if you do the install yourself, and you have a scale GG1, which will operate on minimum 042 curves, for about half the cost of others on the market.

 

I did just that and had a Williams scale GG1 upgraded to TMCC/RS5.0 and ERR cruise a couple of years ago and could not be happier with the result. In addition you can sell off the Williams electronic reverse board and sound boards to help offset the cost.

 

This also bodes well for some of the other Williams engines as well. So it really depends on what engines you are thinking about.

Trainman9, how did you get RS5 for that conversion?  AFAIK, that's not for sale, only as part of a complete engine.

As was mentioned previously, it's not cheaper, if that is your criteria.  The boards and electrocouplers will set you back right around $ 200- that's from Boxcar Bill- plus the engine.  That being said, it is an easy and fun project to convert a conventional engine to TMCC.  Kind of like bringing it to life.  My only beef would be there is not much diversity in sound boards.  Putting a sound board entitled, for example, ''Generic Steam' or 'Diesel GP7/9' and it's sound package in more than one engine doesn't make much sense to me.  I like different engines to sound different. 

I can see that it is not worth the time or money to upgrade an engine that has no command control. There may be a few exceptions to this but not too many. I thank all of you for your imput. I think factory installed is worth the extra $$$ because they know what they are doing and give a warranty. Paul

FYI, Lionel has some other sound boards for sale, you can check the RS4 listings for their parts.

A few years ago when I decided to adopt command control I went for TMCC. It was the most economical. I didn't want to sell my conventional locos and begin searching for viable replacements. Just wanted to keep what I already had. A basic ERR command upgrade is only $70 with no sounds. My trains didn't have sounds and I had little interest in adding any. I've also found severally TMCC parts for sale here and on eBay that I have used for upgrades. Yes it's more work doing all my own upgrades and modifications but I enjoy doing it and I believe it saves me money. I also bought 2 used CAB1s and a command base on eBay for a $100 all together. That made the decision process a lot easier.

I picked up a Command Ready Lionel engine at yourk, cost me about $125.00 to convert it using Lionel's parts

Best price I've found on a TMCC conversion was right here in the sale forum, the TAS board with the Lionel boards for $15!  I stuck it into a nice Williams GP-9, and for little more than the price of the locomotive, I had a command engine with sound.

 

I keep my eye out for stuff like that an do upgrades when I find them.

 

You just need to know the right people. If you ever come to my house to pick up the Lexan sheets you can hear it for yourself.

I do have to get down there for those, I actually think I had a use for some.

 

I think I'll wait a couple of days...