Why might certain geographic areas have more model railroading enthusiasts/hobbyists than others?

I would venture to say that the reason is....in areas of the country that incomes and jobs are more plentiful, you will have folks that have the disposable income to enjoy the hobby.  In parts of the country that have less industry, fewer high paying jobs, then money has to be spent on things that are needed to survive.  Traditionally, urban areas...the east, midwest, and west coast....would be where you find more toy trains and hobbyists in general.

Alan

Perhaps it's because of the many railroads which ran in this general area.  The more folks were exposed to the real thing the more likely they were to embrace the hobby.

--Greg

I think part of it, besides the income thing, to be a matter of competition and domegraphics.  Competition:the golf capital of the world - Pinehurst is ust down the nearest highway a few miles and there are courses all over this part of NC.    I think a lot of people here in NC choose other pursuits like that or, nearer the coast, boating. Demographics also matter - not to offend anyone, but many in this hobby are older folkss, like me, so where there are alot of them, I think the hobby probably does better.  Two of my sons live in Austin, TX, and are of the appropriate age for that young-people's town.  They tell me there aren't a lot of model train stores or people there.

The northeast has always been a hotbed for model railroads, and Pennsylvania in particular seems to be the capitol. Maybe it has to do with the amount of railroading in this area, or the harsh winters we have. Areas with more pleasing year-round climates obviously wouldn't be model railroading hot spots. There's just too many other things to do outside.

I think climate is also a big factor.  O Gauge is an indoor hobby so it's more likely to be taken up in the northern states where we spend more time indoors during the winter.  Same reason basketball and hockey are more popular and more widely played in the north.

"I concur with what you're saying so I'm curious as to why areas in PA such as Philadelphia and Pittsburgh with higher income per capita and more job opportunities would lag behind this more rural section of PA the poster has mentioned."

Some of it has to do with the hobby shop business model.  Areas such as Phila and Pitt also have much higher overhead costs (space rental, utilities, taxes, etc.) than the more rural areas of PA.  Since the profit margin on many hobby lines is not huge, controlling overhead is key to a shop staying in business.

And just to take it one step further(one example), one of those areas with good weather most of the year(CA) has the situation where: a)most homes are not built with basements(earthquake concerns) and b)the land/homes are more expensive than lots of the rest of the country. 

So even if you have the financial resources, it's harder to have the space and you also might have a lot less disposable income, even if you do make a good deal of money.

The flip side of this is in less developed areas where folks have a lot of land and a train building for their hobby!

-Dave

There is another factor to this equation, where to put a layout. Areas of the country with no basements or other available space to support a layout do have a negative factor on whether someone has an interest in model railroading. We all know that you can take a good amount of real estate with a decent sized layout.

Ther used to be a handful of hobby shops here in the Austin area; now there is only one, and it's train section is nothing like it used to be.  One of the retail craft stores used to carry train stuff as well, but they also have eliminated their train section.  I enjoyed browsing the aisles of those shops, but their closure has left me no other choice but to buy online.

Fortunately, the model railroading community is not as dead as I thought.  I did begin attending operating sessions on one person's HO layout, so I have finally been able to mingle with other railroaders and to gain some experience that I can apply to both of my future layouts (O and HO).

There are also a few clubs here, including a modular O gauge one.

Aaron

I'd like to expand upon Greg's and Jumijo's correct answers:

Historically, Pennsylvania, was the "keystone state" in the original 13 states, and remained centrally-located in the states east of the Mississippi, even as population moved westward.

Pennsylvania was the state that was the corporate home for a majority of the first railroads. Pennsylvania was home to the first railroads, the first steam engine, most of the corporate headquarters, the most railroad locomotive design and manufacturing, many of the major inventions,  etc.

The TCA directory used to list, by state, what the club's population statistics were. I remember seeing the chart, a number of years ago, that showed 40% of the club's membership residing in Pennsylvania.  I think New York, and possibly the rest of the North Eastern states, having another 20% or so of the membership.  The hobby of toy trains seems to have followed in the footsteps (railsteps?) of the north-eastern real railroads that inspired them.

So, even though other states in the union hosted many fine railroads during their history, the population density vs the rail miles probably resulted, ultimately, in your inability to find a bunch of LHS in your locale.  Not fair, of course, but that's my theory.

Here in the Capitol Region, Albany, Schenectady&Troy, there is a lot of railroad history and it seems quite a few modelers.

One, if not the first, passenger railroads in the country operated between Albany and Schenectady. Alco and General electric were based here and employed many. The New York Central and the Delaware and Hudson also had a large presence here. The west Albany shops of the NYC built the Commodore Vanderbilt here.  The Alco Big Boys were built here too. The boilers of them were assembled in a vertical shaft in the floor of the factory. The ninth busiest passenger station in the country is here, also the most expensive one built in modern times.

I don't know why all the shops are in Pennsylvania. Fred

We don't have basements, houses cost a ton of money, we have sun and pleasant weather most of the year -  lots of competition for the hobby. When I was young we built models. Kids don't do that today.  When I was older we built our computers.  Kids don't do that today. I guess out here it kind of sucks in that there aren't many people to meet up with who are building train layouts.

Gentlemen,

   Historically we also have the Union Switch and Signal here in Western Pa,

which produced most of the hardware and electrical switches and relays for

the real railroads thru out the world, along with some prize Deisel Engines for the Northern Pacific RR.  The children of these engineers & floor workers were given

model railroading as part of their child hood Christmas presents each year.  Our fathers really knew how to build model railroading, they engineered & built the real thing all day long at work.  Even now there are at least 9 large train shops in short driving distance of my home, here in Churchill, Pa.  I wish I had more time to engineer layouts and attend the shows, private and public here in the Pittsburgh, Pa area each Christmas season.  They are simply fantastic and the people you meet

are great also. 

Merry Christmas everyone!

PCRR/Dave

While where I live, in Southeast PA, is a hotbed for trains...my other hobby, 3-D photography, is dead East of Ohio. The hotbed for that one is West Coast.

If it's any consolation, I can't get decent BBQ in New York...

Having lived around the country, Id nominate Pennsylvania, the Chicago-Milwaukee area, the West Coast..NY and NJ as I don't know if it's coincidental but these regions all did or do have a lot of prototype activty. NC is a dead zone where I currently live just outside of Charlotte..I get homesick often... especially for IRM..Milwaukee Trainfest ..etc. Spencer NC museum is just ok but it's a rather static, preserved in amber sort of thing, comparatively..

I have been selling on ebay for about 12 years. I would say out of the 50 states, PA is the state where I have sent more items then any other state in the union.

Well PA does have York and the Strasburg museum.

Some area's in some states (Oklahoma, Arkansas, Kansas, Texas and others) did not have electric power til after WWII to the late 1940's.  And the hobby shops are in the "Big Cities" in the west.  BUT the good news is that there is a train show almost every weekend within 500 miles of my home.

Obviously ya'll did not heed the "Go West, Young Man!"

I'm in North Central Texas. It's slim pickens. I have no idea how I would quench my train thirst if it weren't for the internet.

About the only time I even get to see a real train is if I happen to hit it just right going up to Oklahoma where they cross the Red River....and even that's 45 miles away...

I think it all has to do with exposure to trains - probably the real ones - that sustains the hobby up in the NorthEast. I'm envious by all measure.

If you a member of the TCA you are expected to be within driving range of York, PA.

That is why their Membership is so slanted that way.

The LCCA has a different convention location each year.

Andrew

I concur, I've lived in NY,PA, and now northern indiana, PA seems to be the hotspot.  LHS in our area lean more toward the HO scale. We have 3 within a 30mi radius. One carries a very good selection of O gauge equipment.  As mentioned in another thread, im in the process of designing a large basement layout.  First step will to be finding the basement again  

In a local newspaper article (see this thread for a link to the article), it was put out as a theory that the trains-under-the-tree tradition may have originated in PA as an evolution of a certain sect of German immigrants' tradition of setting up elaborate nativity scenes in their homes, which then gave way to miniature villages and that trains were added later as a representation of daily life (first non-animated trains and then later the animated ones).  To take it one step further, many hobbyists have mentioned that they grew into the hobby by way of the train-under-the-tree tradition (myself included).

This tradition, combined with the number of railroads that operated in the state (and the massive numbers they employed), and the economic status of the people (having the disposable income to spend on trains, and the space to set them up), firmly suggests PA is the origin point of sorts.

Pittsburgh, when you count the surrounding counties, has a very high number of train shops and shops that sell trains as a side line.  I can think of at least 16 shops within an easy drive from Pittsburgh, and there are probably a few more that I am missing.

Andy

I wonder if in Houston and other HOT areas of th3e nation model railroading is a SUMMER activity.  This time of the year you can go outside without worrying about getting heat stroke!

One other reason for a lack of model railway shops in many major cities could be the extremely high costs of running a shop there. Rents and taxes are very high in these areas, and parking for customers can also be an issue. Unless an LHS has a high turnover, and probably a thriving mail-order business too, the overheads of running a store in some areas can be prohibitive.

A lot of good points made here. The model train hobby is a mini culture. Every culture stems from environmnetal factors.

As was pointed out Pennsylvania has a lot of railroad history. The Chicago/Wisconsin area does as well. In Chicago we are the transportaion hub of the U.S. because we are the furthest point south of Lake Michigan.

It started with shipping. Chicago is the farthest point inland a ship from outside the U.S. can navigate to.

That lead into the railroad industry where goods shipped would then be transported by rail. Couple that with trains heading from the east coast to the west coast routed south of the lake to Chicago. Here trains rerouted their cars to points south and west. 

That lead into air transportation. Goods and people then took to the air. This is why O'Hare is the busiest airport in the world.

So in the Chicago area, just like Pennsylvania, many people had roots into railroads. My grandfather worked for the Milwaukee Road. My wifes family worked for the Rock Island. Heck my wife started her career working for TrailerTrain located in downtown Chicago.

Both Chicago and Pennsylvania have large interests in this hobby. It's not a coincidence. I'm sure similar ties can be made in other areas as well.

Alvin Toffler in the book "The Third Wave" pointed out that if you wanted to know how people lived, you first had to look at how they worked. How people make a living has a huge influence on how they live their lives. 

I think this demographic also derives from our youth, specifically where Lionel was originally located and marketed, and why today we still like trains.   I've not seen such studies, but would guess that the hobby thrived in the Northeast, nearest the NJ Lionel factory and distributors.  Its therefore no secret that, today, the hobby thrives in those areas where many of us (particularly baby boomers) still live.  Further, while we can find enthusiasts all across the country, the population densities of those areas remain high.  If we measure enthusiasm by where stores and train businesses are located, I see may of the existing shops concentrated in those very same areas.  In my area (Philadelphia) some of the good hobby shops have been in business for 50 years or more, although the internet has made their location a moot point.  I'll bet its no coincidence that -- for example -- MTH is centrally located in Columbia MD, right in the heart of train "country"... and I'll bet they've done demographic marketing surveys that answer this very question.

Try Dinosaur Barbecue, very good, Troy, Harlem, Syracuse. Fred

If anybody watched the miniseries The Men Who Built American on the History Channel, there was a huge emphasis on railroads in the series.  Railroads enabled Rockefeller (based in Cleveland) to get kerosene to the masses and Carnegie (based in Pittsburgh) to get raw materials to his steel mills and his finished steel to markets like NYC. 

I grew up in Lewistown, PA, smack in the central part of the state and astride the former Middle Division of the PRR.  Given how heavy the train traffic was in the '50's and even into the 1960's, it would almost require some effort to not have at least been aware of the railroad, let alone have an interest in it.

As a kid, I can't think of a relative (or friend, for that matter) who didn't have a train around their tree at Christmas.  Additionally, there was and still are, quite a few local folks up there who spend parts of each day or evening hanging out at the former PRR station visitng with one another and watching trains.  When we head back north to PA each summer, I normally spend several hours during the week we are there visiting with folks at the station and doing a bit of railfanning.

I belong to a club here in the Atlanta area and a considerable number of our members grew up in PA and the northeastern U.S.  As a number of other posters have pointed out, I suspect there are numerous reasons why PA and the northeastern U.S. seem to generate an inordinate number of toy train hobbyists, not the least of which would be socioeconomic, weather and simply the prevalence of railroads in our lives when growing up.

Curt

I would tend to guess more model trains -especially o gauge - in NY,NJ and PA than anywhere else ...

Well since my comment was the reason for this thread, I figure I should reply. 

Scranton was at one time home to at least five railroads – the DL&W, D&H, the Erie, CNJ, and NYO&W.  I may have missed one, but five is quite a bit.  The first steam loco to run in the US was owned by the D&H and was first run in nearby Honesdale, Pa.  The first commercially successful trolley system in the country was the Scranton Railway Co.  And prior to all of them were the gravity railroads of the PCC and D&H. 

The comment about “in areas of the country that incomes and jobs are more plentiful, you will have folks that have the disposable income to enjoy the hobby. In parts of the country that have less industry, fewer high paying jobs, then money has to be spent on things that are needed to survive” is totally off base.  This is Northeast Pennsylvania.  We have no jobs, no income, and no industry.  Houses can easily be bought for 60k and the median household income is 45k a year.  Low income is actually what makes the industry thrive locally, as many cannot afford a summer home or a power boat, Lionel may be as high as they are going to reach in terms of a “substantial” hobby investment.  Scranton was on a high note in the 1930s, 40s and 50s, so there was disposable income then, and that is when many Lionel sets were gifted and the seeds were sown. 

What we do have, is history.  For those who have stayed many are living in their parent’s homes or only a few blocks away.  As coal and rail collapsed, there were no other industries to take their place as the local powers had held them at bay for fear of losing employees.  So the abandoned rail stations and lines, mines and culm piles remained and for many of us history stayed that much closer.  There is also a strong local cultural division that maintains traditions most areas abandoned over a hundred years ago; rather than the normal growth of towns, settlements sprang up around the coal breakers and most would be heavily manned by one ethnicity or another.  This is only starting to degrade now as people, who had maybe only one or two children instead of the requisite nine or ten a generation before, simply die off. 

And you can take this last bit with a grain of salt, but PA, NY, and NJ all have large Italian populations, and generationally they do seem to strongly support the hobby.  And with that, I say “Buon Natale” to you all   lol

Since there was a comment in the other thread about hobby shops v train shops, I wanted to address that

Grzyboski Trains - #1 Lionel dealer in PA, #5 nationally

Pittston Train Shop - great shop with new and used, will do repair work

Walter's Hardware - mostly scenery but great selection and prices

Scranton Hobby - mostly Atlas and MTH but some Lionel, lots of rolling stock and hard to find paint supplies

The Branchline - small shop with mostly regional road names in Atlas and Lionel, limited hours.