Will two different Legacy steam engines maintain separation

Legacy engines should maintain the same approximate speed (not exactly) with the momentum set the same.  You can do a test by separating the engines about 2 inches apart and run them for a while to test.  The the 2 engines into a TR (Train) in the Legacy remote so you are sure they both get the same commands. 

I did have a Legacy Big Boy in for repair that at the top 2 speeds wouldn't stay the same as other engines.

Give it a shot.

Jim

I don't have two different legacy steam engines to try. My only Legacy steam engines are two Pacifics. (blue Comet Southern Crescent) . They appear to be identical. And hold separation very closely. Just curious if they would and why.

I just sent the Legacy AT&SF 4-4-2 and the C&O 4-6-0 around a 50' loop following at about 2".  After two loops, they had opened the gap to about 4".  This was at speed setting 20.  At speeds 40 and 60, they were very evenly matched, not more than an inch difference after a couple of loops.  at step 80, the C&O was gradually catching up with the 4-4-2.  The difference is small, but there was a subtle difference in the speed curves.

Wouldn't the driver size affect it as well as motor type?

mikemike, No because the wheel size is factored into Legacy's speed settings on each engine. The speed at any step should be the same on every engine steam or diesel (with the exception of yard switchers in the yard mode)

When engines are put into an MU mode, the rear engine will run a bit slower (1 step) than the lead engine per Jon Z, this is by design and Jon could explain it better than I. That may be why most people say the rear engine falls behind when they try to match speed by setting them up as a TR and running both as a TR even though they are disconnected.

To test speed it might be best to use the 99 engine ID and then setting the speed, they might run closer to the same speed around the track.

One would assume that Lionel takes the driver size into account when they design the power train.  FWIW, the drivers on the 4-4-2 Atlantic are indeed larger then the 4-6-0 drivers, so it seems they did.

On a side note: Don't bother trying 2 TMCC engines or a TMCC with a Legacy engine.   It was good that Lionel fixed that in the Legacy series of engines.

Jim

Never entered my head Jim, with 32 speed steps, that would be a tall order!

Hi mikemike,

What Chris told you is spot on.  To test the engines you should use engine 99, rather than TR.  Every Legacy engine with Odyssey 2 speed control (there have been a few Legacy steamers without Odyssey 2) is capable of running with the same speed map.  A couple inches of drift over a hundred or more feet of running is well within the necessary tolerance to MU the engines without causing problems.

The one thing I would add is that you must be running the engines with either a Legacy remote in Legacy mode or TMCC 32 mode, or with a DCS remote in TMCC 32 mode.  In TMCC 100 mode (the only mode available from a Cab-1) the engines will have the same speed map, but the the speed step setting in each engine won't stay synced.  Usually a few speed commands are missed by one engine or the other.  In Legacy and TMCC 32 modes the speed steps are sent as an absolute value, so the engines will sync with each speed command.  In TMCC 100 mode the speed steps are relative and the engines only get a chance to sync speed when you come to a stop.

Most engines have a top speed that is limited by the mechanical characteristics of the drive train rather than the electronics.  Different models will top out at very different speeds.  You really shouldn't try to MU engines if you intend to run at full throttle.

Only the later locomotives respond to 99, not all Legacy locomotives recognize that universal address.  I have some that will run as 99, but the two I mentioned in this thread don't respond to address 99.  To test, I just get one running, run the other one up behind and slow down to the matching speed setting.

I was just trying to understand how the mechanics fit into the situation. Additionally, one thing I like to do is let several trains on both levels just run without a lot of attention. Mixing Legacy and TMCC simply doesn't work.  Thats a primary reason I am liking the Legacy system even though it appears much more sensitive to problems.(dirty track/ glitchy etc...). Legacy appears ideally suited for this type of operation. I have also noticed that Legacy maintains more even speeds thru 072 turn arounds than similar wheel arrangement TMCC engines.   The other thing I really like of course, is the SLOW SPEEDS. Very nice.

I bought a Yard Goat Legacy L&N 080 and was hoping that the speed steps would match up to my other Legacy engines. They are not even close. I called Lionel about this and they said it was due to a different size drive wheel.

Based on what everyone is posting above this is not the case. Am I doing something wrong?

There is a "switcher mode" for engines.  I know that my NS genset would certainly not match speeds with any of my other locomotives, but there's a setting to change it's step size.  I believe it's the switcher option, instead of steam switcher, change it to be a steam engine.

Good point John.  That too avoids the issue of the deliberately mis-matched speeds when running lashups.

Jeff, who ever told you that at Lionel was mistaken.  Your 0-8-0 runs at half the speed per speed step as your other Legacy engines.  This is by design for "yard" engines.  As Chris mentioned above, in "yard mode" these engines will run slower.  However, if you enter a Legacy yard engine into a lashup it automatically re-maps its speed to match standard Legacy engines.  It's a nice refinement that gives you "best of both worlds" operation.

Is there any way to switch the engine out of "yard" mode, other than a lashup?  Just curious, I think the only slow one I have is the NS genset, and it's fast enough.  There is a setting for either a diesel of steam switcher, but my genset is not on the tracks to test.

John, thanks for idea. I never really looked at all the options. I changed it from yard switcher to steam switcher.

I'm curious with the latest software verision what people find best to run TMCC K-Line steam engines on. I find TMCC works best but have played with setting it as R100 and Cab1 playing around. I just love the sound volume the K-Line steam engines whistle have. Incredible.

Chris, I just re read your post and now I understand you meant what John just said. Thank you. That has cleared up a problem I had running my switcher. It will get more track time now. The Yard Goat Legacy is a solid engine.

If you set the speed steps to 128, R100 works well and lets you have the additional steps but gives you the keypad icons and throttle graph.

Cab-1: DIR, BELL, AUX1, then either 1, 2 or 3. Each button should be held for one full second. This sets the number of steps between stopped and full speed. Press the BELL button again to turn off the bell.

Setting Speed Steps:
32 Steps: DIR, BELL, AUX1, 1 (factory setting)
128 Steps: DIR, BELL, AUX1, 2
256 Steps: DIR, BELL, AUX1, 3

I set my Yard Goat Switcher to steam as opposed to steam switcher, the speed steps still did not match up with any of my other Legacy engines; both steam and diesel.

I then tried setting a lash up with the Legacy Yard Goat and a Legacy R11 Diesel. The Yard Goat was set as the lead engine. A dialog box then came up that said " the engine will be set to road speed settings, clear lash up to go to switcher speed". These were not the exact words but I hope the meaning is clear. I had a blast running this lash up. Switcher chugging away with the diesel at medium RPM.

Thanks, your posts led me to something I did not know I could do. Legacy is quite an awesome set up. I must also state DCS is awesome also in different ways.

There may be no way to directly set that mode.  I wonder if perhaps you could change it in the LSU, I've never looked at that option.