Cab 2 serial addon to run lionmaster

But the bridge isn't for those who only have LC+.  The bridge is for those that already have the Legacy control system and want to buy a LC+ locomotive and control it with their Cab-2.  So it's not burdening anyone, only giving more options to the buyers.

I'm confused.

are we talking about lionmaster

or

lionchief/lionchief+

or

something else?

and if it is not lionmaster can the title of the thread be changed by the Original Poster?

It's about Lionchief+, and like a fair number around here, the OP might not realize/doesn't know you can edit the thread title after you've posted it.

---PCJ

"So it's not burdening anyone, only giving more options to the buyers."

The possible adaptor device is not the burden I was referring to.  It is the suggestion that Lion Chief/Lion Chief Plus should not have been developed, but rather the more expensive (both loco and control technologies) Legacy should have been incorporated in these locos.  That would have imposed a cost burden and would, in my view, have been a marketing mistake.

Shawn, I am calm, it is just your discussion is changing direction....

Did a little research on Lionel's website.  Obviously 1999 thru 2004 was the glory days of TMCC. If you look at that period you can get Semi Scale TMCC Pacifics and Hudsons for $349 to $499 MSRP.  TMCC/RS.   After that period Legacy was in swing, and TMCC price also rose.  The available engines were also changing including the features.  Fan driven smoke units and Speed control, and wireless tethers.  So jump to 2014.

Currently the LC+ are listed on the product page, but the instructions and parts list don't seem to be.

The LC+ have fan driven smoke units, but they must be turned on and off by switch.

They do have ODY II speed control, which is interesting, that means it has a tach motor and complex motor drive circuit.

Volume is only controlled remotely (not by a manual pot for conventional ops), and sounds can be turned on or off by switch.

Sounds are called LC RailSounds

I looked at the details of the picture and the shell is no different than my 2000 engines. 

So if you step up to a later 2004 and beyond TMCC you get the same features or slightly more, with more control.  Cost is higher. 

As far as backwards compatible, it doesn't replace Legacy or TMCC engines so I guess Lionel doesn't feel it needs to be.  It was meant to be different.

Frankly,  I think the price difference on TMCC is based on what the market will bear, not the cost to make it.  The engine frame and shell are the same.  TMCC has been being made since 1995, Modular since about 97.  You think the cost of the TMCC guts would be cheaper.  Every other electronic device gets cheaper with age (other than minor inflation), or you get more features at the same cost.

The Train market has always been driven by market demands.  That is why MTH was getting $1K for conventional engine in the late 90's and early 00s.  No one else was offering premier engines like that.  Today you can get those same engine with Command for the same price or less.

The real question should be why is a TMCC engine so expensive when the same engine in LC+ with new electronics (that had to have a design cost) cost so much less.  G

I'm impressed with lionchief plus. But I do think lionel could have taken it a step further. Add a button on the remote control to control the command control switches that lionel makes. Put a chip in the lionchief engines, and as the engine gets closer to the switch, you activate the switch remotely. No engines to program, no switches to program. Easy to use, period. The set up is easy, and you're having fun running trains. It's not as involved as tmcc or legacy. Lionel is on the right track with lionchief plus, and it won't surprise me if more upgrades are in the near future.

I think the LionChief Plus engines look pretty cool.  Simple remote, good control.

As far as controlling switches, I don't think it is needed on the LC remote.  If you add that function, it would seem to be a can of worms and soon you just end up with the legacy remote?

Also, I think their LCS system was designed to handle controlling switches and accessories.  The LCS WIFI box works with or without legacy.  That means you could have a conventional layout but still use an iPad to control all switches and accessories. Later if you upgrade LionChief/LCPlus you can still use the iPad to control your layout.  And if you decide to upgrade farther to Legacy the iPad LCS system still works to control your Layout and now that you've upgraded that far it will also control you trains.

Where did you get this idea?  AFAIK, the Legacy system is the base for all of these products, and the WiFi module will be useless without the Legacy system.

From the LCS page at Lionel.

To run LCS using only CAB remotes, you need a Lionel command base. This could be either the Cab/Base-1L, or for full functionality, the LEGACY 990 base with Cab-2 remote. Then, when you’re ready to combine the power of your hand-held remotes with the flexibility of the LCS App, add the LCS WiFi module and download the free LCS App for your iPad™.

I believe that John is 100% correct. The LCS WiFi module exchanges information with the Legacy base, which then sends commands to the Legacy/TMCC devices.

You don't need the CAB2 to operate it, but you do need the command base, either the Legacy base or the BASE1-L.  The BASE1-L will have reduced functionality in the system over the full Legacy base.

Not that my thoughts on this will matter, But Lionmaster was a 0-27 gauge model built for smaller layouts period. 

Now Lionel has taken their 0-27 sized loco's and added a new control system to them called Lion-Chief and Lion-Chief Plus Which can be run on a TMCC layout with it's own remote.  

Now if I had grandchildren that enjoy my layout,I would buy them a Lionchief set and they could run trains with me. (GREAT) 

Now going back when I was a kid and got trains for Christmas, I ran them and ran them until it got old and then came up with ways to wreck them,it was cool.

Well anyways if this is about Lionel droping the LIONMASTER line of trains to explore different options with that line with LIONCHIEF or LIONCHIEF PLUS and bring more younger generations into the hobby I say have at it!!!!

I'm sure you could always as with any engine upgrade it with ERR.

Doug

Actually, to pick a small nit, Lionmaster locomotives were meant to run on O31 curves. 

Lionmaster was a whole different concept then the Lionchief, they were reasonably high end locomotives that were selectively compressed to allow operation on smaller layouts.  For instance, I have the Legacy Lionmaster T1 Duplex, it's a locomotive with an MSRP of $800, whistle smoke, and lots of detailing.  However, it was designed to run on O31 or larger.