Color Change- passenger car truck

I think the problem is with your paint. I have repainted many trucks black to silver, silver to black, silver to maroon. Black and silver is typically Tamiya lacquer. Use light coats.

Pete

I put one coat light SEM on and that was the result,  SEM normally works good.

Bead blasting might prep the surface better if Pete's suggestion doesn't work.

I've never painted silver passenger car trucks black. But I have painted black ones silver. However, I've always used a soft bristle paint brush for that. I'm not that great of a paint sprayer, either with rattle cans or an air brush. I'd always get too much paint inside the little nooks and crannies. So, a brush works better for me on smaller parts.

Below is a Union Pacific Pullman car on the left, that was brush-painted silver from the stock black. On the right is a newer UP diner that came with stock silver trucks. There is some difference with the stock silver ones looking a little better. With spraying, you have to be careful using the correct consistency of paint and applying just the right amount. Otherwise, you'll have to clean up the truck and start all over again. But then, I'm sure many of you are better at spraying than I am.

Nice job Vern.

@Wood posted:

Nice job Vern.

Thank you, Wood. 👍

Your paint is going on too wet. The condition you describe is bunching & gathering. The conditions in which you spray makes a huge difference. Temperature the biggest factor. What Pete says rings true. Light coats are key. Allowing flash time between coats. Spray one very light coat, and walk away for 5-10 minutes, …..check the light coat for complete flash before the next.

Pat

Ditto on Pat's advice. The dried initial light coat gives the subsequent coats something to grab onto.  Also, if the paint is going on too wet, increase the pressure and/or spray from further away.  I assume that you are using an airbrush.  It would be very difficult to put on a light coat with a spray can.

Bob

Also Gray, ….back up!!……if you’re spraying too close, that will also cause the paint not to atomize, and land on the workpiece too wet, & retard the flash time.

Pat

@RRDOC posted:

Ditto on Pat's advice. The dried initial light coat gives the subsequent coats something to grab onto.  Also, if the paint is going on too wet, increase the pressure and/or spray from further away.  I assume that you are using an airbrush.  It would be very difficult to put on a light coat with a spray can.

Bob

I see we both chimed in at the same time Bob, …..I know the product he’s using, and it’s a higher end rattle can product. He can get light coats out of it……but 100% agree with you!….BACK UP!…….😄

Pat

Thanks all, I'll give it another shot tomorrow.

@Yellowstone Special posted:

Below is a Union Pacific Pullman car on the left, that was brush-painted silver from the stock black. On the right is a newer UP diner that came with stock silver trucks. There is some difference with the stock silver ones looking a little better.

It's a bit hard to compare them, because the trucks are different castings. To me, though, the one on the left that was painted looks a little more detailed than the one on the right. A little more glossy looking, though (might be better if not so much), but the lighting may well have an effect here. Overall, the paint job looks very good. Are there any brush marks, or did it dry smooth? What kind of paint did you use?

@breezinup posted:

It's a bit hard to compare them, because the trucks are different castings. To me, though, the one on the left that was painted looks a little more detailed than the one on the right. A little more glossy looking, though (might be better if not so much), but the lighting may well have an effect here. Overall, the paint job looks very good. Are there any brush marks, or did it dry smooth? What kind of paint did you use?

Thanks, breeze. There are slight brush marks when you look up close, but the overall coverage of the truck isn't too bad. The Pullman trucks on the left, the Ocean Sunset car from the 1984 Lionel set, were painted using Model Master Chrome Silver, which is why it looks a little brighter and more glossy than the dining car on the right with Lionel's factory-painted stock silver.

I have Lionel's Union Pacific 4-car set and separate 2-car set which all came with factory painted silver trucks. I obtained the 2 older Pullmans later, the Placid Bay and Ocean Sunset cars, which came with black trucks. The Pullmans needed silver trucks to match the rest of the train which make up my UP Yellowstone Special, also my handle.

Ideally, the black trucks should have been spray painted regular silver, but I just used what I had with a brush.

@NHVRYGray posted:

I put one coat light SEM on and that was the result,  SEM normally works good.

What in the wide wide world of sports is SEM?

@Big Jim posted:

What in the wide wide world of sports is SEM?

SEM is an automotive refinishing system. They have a variety of products, including a host of rattle can products. SEM’s automotive Satin Trim black is a fantastic high hide urethane finish …..from a rattle can!!…..The sheen is often a dead match to what we find used by the big manufacturers……A can of SEM automotive trim black is pricey, but the can lasts a long time, and the finish is superior to anything rattle can I’ve ever used,…..plus, being a true urethane product, the durability & longevity are far superior to big box store rattle cans …ie; rustoleum, Krylon, etc,….

Pat

@harmonyards posted:

SEM is an automotive refinishing system. They have a variety of products, including a host of rattle can products. SEM’s automotive Satin Trim black is a fantastic high hide urethane finish …..from a rattle can!!…..The sheen is often a dead match to what we find used by the big manufacturers……A can of SEM automotive trim black is pricey, but the can lasts a long time, and the finish is superior to anything rattle can I’ve ever used,…..plus, being a true urethane product, the durability & longevity are far superior to big box store rattle cans …ie; rustoleum, Krylon, etc,….

Pat

Yes, but do we really need “a fantastic high hide urethane finish” on O scale passenger car truck sides? 🤔

@Yellowstone Special posted:

Yes, but do we really need “a fantastic high hide urethane finish” on O scale passenger car truck sides? 🤔

Vern, you missed the point. Gray is the one who used SEM. Pat is just trying to point out how best to use it.
I always thought painting something a different color you want the  object to be that color, not a mix of both. We apparently have different expectations.

Pete

I see, now. Thanks for the enlightenment. 👍

@Yellowstone Special posted:

Yes, but do we really need “a fantastic high hide urethane finish” on O scale passenger car truck sides? 🤔

You’d have to understand the whole story before making a comment like that, ….but I know, so I’ll explain, …..Gray bought the SEM product to paint the roofs on some high end diesels, ….a job well suited for that product. I’m sure he’s using the leftovers to apply to the truck side frames of another project……..hope that makes sense, ….waste not, want not, ….yes??…..I certainly wouldn’t advocate a 30 dollar can of paint for truck side frames….

Pat

A rather interesting and complex history behind the painting of the truck sides. Thanks for that, Pete and Pat. 😊

I use the SEM for it's color rendition.  Pat put the list on it well over a year ago.

The trim black matches steam engine black dead on, so when filling holes after detail moves you don't have to paint the entire engine and tender.  Also matches the black on MTH and Atlas Southern Railway diesels perfect (never tried on Lionel).

I bought it to correct the error of the non black roof of the Aberdeen Carolina and Western E9s.

Not quite $30 at the automotive supply store I use,  but what is a high end paint can vs a set of Legacy E9s.

@NHVRYGray posted:

I use the SEM for it's color rendition.  Pat put the list on it well over a year ago.

The trim black matches steam engine black dead on, so when filling holes after detail moves you don't have to paint the entire engine and tender.  Also matches the black on MTH and Atlas Southern Railway diesels perfect (never tried on Lionel).

I bought it to correct the error of the non black roof of the Aberdeen Carolina and Western E9s.

Not quite $30 at the automotive supply store I use,  but what is a high end paint can vs a set of Legacy E9s.

Thanks, Gray. Those are beautiful E9s, by the way. 👍

Light coats, and try primer beforehand. 

Mitch

@Yellowstone Special posted:

I've never painted silver passenger car trucks black. But I have painted black ones silver. However, I've always used a soft bristle paint brush for that. I'm not that great of a paint sprayer, either with rattle cans or an air brush. I'd always get too much paint inside the little nooks and crannies. So, a brush works better for me on smaller parts.

Below is a Union Pacific Pullman car on the left, that was brush-painted silver from the stock black. On the right is a newer UP diner that came with stock silver trucks. There is some difference with the stock silver ones looking a little better. With spraying, you have to be careful using the correct consistency of paint and applying just the right amount. Otherwise, you'll have to clean up the truck and start all over again. But then, I'm sure many of you are better at spraying than I am.

Very nice, I too use a brush the key is patience,

@harmonyards posted:

SEM is an automotive refinishing system. They have a variety of products, including a host of rattle can products. SEM’s automotive Satin Trim black is a fantastic high hide urethane finish …..from a rattle can!!…..The sheen is often a dead match to what we find used by the big manufacturers……A can of SEM automotive trim black is pricey, but the can lasts a long time, and the finish is superior to anything rattle can I’ve ever used,…..plus, being a true urethane product, the durability & longevity are far superior to big box store rattle cans …ie; rustoleum, Krylon, etc,….

Pat

Thank you for the explanation.
Not that I am about to change what works for me, but, can it be decanted for use in an air brush?

@Big Jim posted:

Thank you for the explanation.
Not that I am about to change what works for me, but, can it be decanted for use in an air brush?

Actually, SEM offers that product on the refinish side in qt. cans. Under the Hot Rod Black label,…..but hold on to your ankles for price!……I stock it at my shop, so stealing a taste isn’t a problem for me!……it actually flows beautifully from an air brush, …..but I’m sure you could capture some of the rattle can product to pass through an airbrush,……but the rattle can sprays so well, not sure it’d be worth the bother,……the unique quality of the SEM product is it’s a near dead on match in sheen & finish to what the big dogs use in manufacturing…….if you get the hang of it, even the rattle can leaves zero orange peel, and the sheen dries evenly and beautifully….I know my buddies Pete & Lou use the rattle can product, and I spray it from a HVLP gun, ….I have some pics in progress on some brass locomotives I use it on, I’ll find them this evening after work,…..can’t do it now, the boss is watching me 👀

Pat

SEM trim black will spray smoothly out of the rattle can packaging. The nozzle is so good they only way you could possibly get a better finish is to buy a quart can, thin it, and spray it from an automotive spray gun, which is overkill for most hobbyists. Here's what it looks like out of the rattle can:

https://ogrforum.com/...c/169374064469330137