Durability of MTH Wireless Drawbar

Neither myself, nor any of the other guys in our Independent Hi-Railers, Midwest Division modular group, have had any problems with the MTH "wire-less" drawbar" system. One of the nicer features is being able to close the distance between the engine and tender just by replacing the stock drawbar, with a shorter one. But then, I have no curves smaller than 072.

THanks for the news. Glad to hear they hold up pretty well. I've got limited experience with them but it always seems a little fragile to me. Regardless, I appreciate the responses. 

No need to run steamer with wireless tethers on just O72. It depends on the engine not the tethers. 

Best way to hook them up is to turn the engine and tender upside down on a soft service hook them up and go, very easy.

I plan to run on 0-42 curves and below. 

Havent had any trouble with my mohawk tether on the *truly fantastic* tracker trackwork. The engine side of the tether is mounted on a spring pin, so there's quite a bit of motion allowance in it.

Only thing that I dont like is I feel like i'm going to break it when it needs to be unplugged.

I have 1 wireless drawbar on a premier Berk. It is supposed to be O-54. Runs great forward. In reverse a corner in the tender platform caught and snapped off a vertical handrail. I'd just watch it forward and backwards through a turn. If it makes it through, life is good.

Well, I only have one. The Imperial RK Northern that just arrived last month.

I have some tweaks in the trackwork and I've noticed the Northern will stall if going slower than 10 SMPH in those dips or across some switches.

However, I have no problem with it on curves or through well leveled switches. It has even backed (with a consist) into it's storage siding through an O-31 switch a number of times with no problems.

One point tho:

I have never disconnected the drawbar since initially connecting it. Thus it's as tight a connection as there will ever be.

Once I get the new layout trackwork done I'll be adding a shorter drawbar as I'm getting rid of everything under O-54 on the main layout. All the smaller stuff will go on a layout for kids to play with.

So far, so good. Have two Hudsons with the drawbars. Replaced the original on the CNW E4 with the shortest one from the replacement kit since it's only run on 36" radius (O-72) or larger, The apprentice made a replacement deck plate for it as an experiment. The ATSF Blue Goose Hudson has a deck plate that's curved so it doesn't bind on the tender. I'm planning to replace the stock drawbar with a shorter one when I get some time. Here again, I'd like to see the shorter bars included and just add $20 to the MSRP to save the hassle of having to order replacements.

Unfortunately, I have experienced nothing but troubles with the MTH wireless draw bar on the recent Rail King Santa Fe Northern (no. 2929).  I was looking forward to the model after MTH did excellent work with Santa Fe Northern no. 2927 (their best Rail King northern to date in my opinion).  I will soon post some photos showing the differences in these models.  The wireless draw bar MTH uses is not an infrared system like Lionel's.  MTH's wireless drawbar is more along the line of what I have seen in N Gauge and relies on a metal wire running along the drawbar from the locomotive to a metal post on the tender.  This makes the tender more difficult to connect to the locomotive.  Also, it seems that if the metal wire on the drawbar doesn't remain in contact with the tender post the locomotive shuts off.  My Rail King Santa Fe Northern has come to a sudden halt so many times while pulling the Chief that I relegated it to engine facility maintenance area decoration.  Since I have only had it beginning in November and purchased it new, I anticipate returning it to MTH to see if there is anything they can do to make it run more reliably.  I never had any of these problems with the old wired tether.  Even stationary in the engine repair area of the layout, no. 2929 will sometimes not turn on to DCS command.  When this happens, I will touch my finger to the metal wire to position it against the center post or cinch up the electronics to bring it to life.  The electronics connection also seems problematic.  Rather than a side to side connection like the old wired tether, it is top to bottom.  The old wired tether seemed to have ends constructed of rubber which appeared to give some degree of grip.  The new connection appears to have ends made of plastic and my experience has been that the connection can drop out while the locomotive is running around the layout or while stationary.

Hi guys. Don't post much here but do a lot of reading.

I have had a lot of trouble with the draw bar.

I have 2 tin plate steamers that have gone bad. One is the Christmas tin. On the 4th time getting it fixed.

I just got a 262 Bluestar in December, just messed up yesterday. Going to have to go back.

I have a PRR 686 steam turbine that I got in Aug and it is starting to stop on the curves.

I would not buy another one until they get the problem fixed. I run them on 042 curves so that should not be the problem. Too much twisting of the wires.

Hope this helps somebody that wants to buy one.

Steve

Thanks for continued posts. It seems like the majority have been problem free but I've seen issues myself so I know where the guys with issues are coming from. Thats again. 

I have one MTH Premier latest run PS2 cab forward (2008) with wireless drawbar. An MTH tech mentioned to me that the original drawbar had a barely adequate ground trace and it would be a good idea to get a newer drawbar. I have one on order. I have an older first run MTH cab forward (converted to TMCC) which has a tether. I modified the tether's outer skin tubing by very carefully cutting a slit at the bend where the tether comes out of the plug to allow more flexibility. So far this has worked OK - 5 yrs. Periodically the tether plug gets a bit loose and I have to reseat it. Another solution is to buy a ten pin tether whose wiring comes straight out of the plug instead of having a 90 deg. bend/loop; a straight tether such as 3rd Rail uses. Maybe Frank Timko or Weaver could supply this style.

mtnhi7, I wonder what is considered to be a newer drawbar that eliminates the barely adequate ground trace problem?  The Rail King Santa Fe Northern I have was just shipped last month and is in need of a fix for sporadic operating issues related to the locomotive-tender connection.  When did the new drawbar become available or has it shipped out yet?

Portland Rose, I don't know when the newer wireless drawbar came out. My information came from several emails I had with MTH. Last week I received a new drawbar, but it was too long, so MTH said to send it back to exchange for a 40mm drawbar (which is the length of the original drawbar). I hope the new one has the better ground trace. The MTH tech told me that the metal wire isn't a ground connection; this metal wire came out of its tiny plastic retainer on the original drawbar and is not now in use on my PS2 engine. I haven't noticed any adverse effects of not having this metal wire.

Thanks for the information, Mtnhi7!  I'm glad to hear the metal wire running along the top side of the drawbar has nothing to do with the operational problems or is even necessary to the locomotive.  I find myself questioning the design of the new drawbar with a top to bottom (vertical) connect and plastic connection ends (as opposed to rubber connection ends that may provide a more secure grip and a horizontal connect).  The older tethered connect was horizontal going into the back side of the locomotive cab rather than the underside of the tender.  In my opinion, it was less susceptible to being dislodged by forces resulting from the operation of the train and it was much easier to connect the ends together.  Once the old tether was connected, it was sometime difficult to get disconnected.  The connection prongs on the new tether appear smaller than those on the old tether causing me to question whether there is less wiggle room for a secure connection.  Some of the above comments seem to indicate there have been no problems where the track is smooth but I suppose our track conditions can sometimes be like those of real railroads - level is some places and not in others.  My recollection of my operating experience with Santa Fe northern no. 2929 was that it performed better at lower speeds, below 50 mph.

SJC,

   I have had absolutely no problems, maybe I am just lucky and my large layout ran trains most every day for years.  Still no problems even now on the smaller Christmas layouts.  I have to admit I have no children left at home to play with our trains however.

PCRR/Dave

Hi Guys,

It's my understanding that one must pay particular attention when coupling the engine to the tender with these drawbars.  I use two fingers, one on each side of the drawbar and place my thumbs on something firm on top of the tender and squeeze uniformly until I feel it snap into place.  Now I know the the drawbar connection on the engine is suppose to be already in place but do the same thing on that side;  firmly squeeze the drawbar up into its socket on the engine side.  

I was having some intermittent glitches until I squeezed up on drawbar on the engine side.  DON'T ASSUME THAT THAT SIDE OF THE DRAWBAR IS PROPERLY SEATED.

Steve

Good post, Steam Guy. Excellent advice.  Phil

I apologize for not getting back here sooner. I do appreciate the responses and, in some cases, tips for proper operation. Very helpful. Per my LHS, the drawbar was changed (perhaps with the switch to PS3) from a 10 pin to 6 pin and the drawbar itself slightly redesigned and strengthened. Not having an old one (or a new one) to compare I can't verify this. 

Good thread with interesting info. Thanks. I only have one locomotive with the wireless tether and I haven't had any problems yet. I hope it stays that way.

No problems here. I have had the 4-6-0 from the Union Pacific RTR set since late June which is great. I run it on O-31 Realtrax with no problem. Smokes well, works with DCS, always has a number 10 signal strength. The headlight is a very bright blue L.E.D which sends out a nice beam of light 

I too am having drawbar problems. I have a relatively new (still under warranty), RK Imperial SF Northern. It periodically stops on the layout and the problem is the tether on the tender side does not "click" solidly. I squeeze it as much as possible and it works for awhile, but inevitably loosens and stops. Going to call MTH tomorrow and see if they'll send me a new tether under warranty to avoid having to ship the whole thing in. 

I have had repeated drawbar problems with the Imperial S2 Turbine. It's back for repairs for the second time. Seems to be more of a twisting wires problem than the drawbar itself. 

My B6 0-6-0 is back at my dealer for drawbar issues. My less than perfect track work works the drawbar slightly loose while running bringing things to a halt. Hopefully this will fix it permanently. 

My trouble with the drawbar is connecting it. I gave up connecting it as advertised, upright on the tracks, instead I turn the locomotive on its side with protective soft pads. This is difficult with it is a massive engine like the DM&IR Yellowstone. Now

all of my large articulated locomotives I  put in a plastic rain gutters cut to length with felt glued to the sides and I push them on and off the tracks. Perhaps MTH should make a tool for assisting in connecting the drawbar. The smaller the engine the easier the connecting.

Most of the problems with wireless drawbars is the owner. Schumann is doing it right by putting the locomotive and tender on their side, connecting the tender and then putting it on the track. 

I have explained this simple procedure 4 or 5 times on prior threads. I have used on it on my wireless drawbar engines and have never had a problem as with my friends it has been the same. 

One of our "Youth Group" has the SF 4-8-4 with the wireless tether and the past couple of sessions it has demonstrated many of the issues mentioned above. Yesterday thru "trial & error" we discovered what the problem was. Unfortunately when he brought it with him for either a club session or a holiday fun run he only used the styro packing & box but not the wraps or ribbons. Consequently one of the little styro pills had come off the tray and was lodged/crushed in the pins causing bad connections and performance. Cleaned out the debris and it ran fine before wrapping in paper towels for him to take it home, hopefully he or his mother can find the wraps and repack it.

David,

I saw your posts before I got my engine and do the connection that way. It did not make a difference with this engine as it never "clicked" in right out of the box. My B-6 has a significant click. This one is loose and always has been. I chalk this up to QC.

I've had a nagging issue with the drawbar connections and/or contacts, or possibly with a twisted wire as Jeff mentioned.

I've repeatedly used the 'laying the engine on its side' method for making the connection and still have experienced problems.  My little 4-6-0 Pennsy steamer from an RTR set has already been back to MTH, where they reportedly found nothing wrong.

If there is a particular 'trick', resolution, or tips to using the integrated tether/drawbar, it would be nice if MTH could post a service bulletin regarding it.

Currently the engine is working fine, but I've not moved it from the current oval I had set up to test it upon return. It had intermittent issues immediately upon return from service.  Gently manipulating the drawbar got it working properly, but frankly has made me reluctant to move the engine and tender around much.

Robert

Robert,

I have the same issue. My engines are on racks next to my layout and I move them on and off the layout regularly. This engine will ALWAYS give me a problem the minute I move it. I think there should be a much more secure anchor on that harness to hold it together. 

I bought my first PS3 Pennsy Turbine which has the drawbar in Dec. By April it as sent back t MTH for work as the train would not move. At that point I never had it out of the box as I just completed my track work and wanted a test run. Well, obviously I did not get to far. After 3wks at MTH I got it back with the work ticket where the connection on the drawbar was damaged. Received it back after the repairs and have since had additional problems getting it t go on the DCS System. At this point I am not sure if its a DCS problem or another drawbar issue. Currently waiting a call back from MTH. Haven't had the train long enough to form a solid opinion on the drawbar but I am hoping MTH can help me out. Best of Luck

When 'manipulating' the drawbar I tried to make sure the bare wire lead was making contact with the tender's metal post.  I read above where MTH told mtnhi7 that this bare wire had nothing to do with ground, but others have stated it does

It could be that was the trick.  I've had the shell off of the engine and am now aware there is a plug or jack on that side as well.  Maybe this will make a difference on yours, but I'm glad you brought this thread back up, as I'm fairly convinced this is an ongoing issue for some.

Robert

Robert,

I had the shell off the engine the day I got it to repack the smoke unit and saw the clip. Made sure it was secure (and on the tender side as well), but the fact that it hardly has any "click" bothers me. As for the "bare wire".....I haven't looked at that as a possibility. But I definitely want to replace the drawbar and also the tender clip that it attaches to. If either one is loose, there will obviously be a bad connection. It's easy to do and I'm hoping  they'll send me the parts so I can avoid shipping it. 

It is not a "wireless drawbar" Only Lionel offers that.

Dale H

Really!!!

Well, since the leads are printed into the drawbar and invisible, it's as effective as the Lionel one.  In some ways, more so, there isn't that bulky IR sender/receiver hanging off the drawbar.

Really?  I have the DM&IR Yellowstone engine and unless you have three hands, it is almost impossible to move the engine with the front set of drivers flopping around and the tender and not stress the connections or unplug them. 

I have about 5 hours run time on this engine and in the past several weeks, it has begun to stop on the layout and go through the shut down sequence.  In each instance, re-seating the plug on the engine end will allow it to start up again and run about 15 or 20 minutes before it does it again.  It is currently parked on a siding because some of the points on my layout are hard to reach.

This is a great engine and I like MTH's drawbar but it does make me cautious toward any additional MTH steamers.

Happy railroading,

Don

Don,

i have the same engine and yes it can be a bear to handle but by putting it on its side and connecting the drawbar is the best way to hook them up. 

Check the teeth on the drawbar, if any are loose or broken means the drawbar will not stay together, you then must replace the drawbar. 

I stand by my statement of most problems are by the user. If you don't line up the drawbar ends then there is a good chance of breaking the drawbar.