I want to daisy chain 2 Lionel sensor tracks to my LCS SER2.

Yes.  That's the way the system was intended to be connected.  Jump from 1 device to the next and so on.

Thanks Marty,

I figured it would work, however I can't find any reference to a Sensor track being called a device.  I didn't want to run 2 long cables from the SER2 to the Sensor Tracks. 

Tom

Here is Lionel's example diagram.

A higher resolution look is available by clicking here.

Many Thanks Martye.  Just need to upgrade my Base & Cab 2. Can I skip from rev 1.4 and go right to rev 1.6 & 1.61 skipping the required 1.52?

how about daisy chaining direct without using any lcs modules?

Tom Williams posted:

Many Thanks Martye.  Just need to upgrade my Base & Cab 2. Can I skip from rev 1.4 and go right to rev 1.6 & 1.61 skipping the required 1.52?

Yes you can.

tangoman posted:

how about daisy chaining direct without using any lcs modules?

You'll need one of these... Available from Lionel.  You must call them.

thanks marty, talking to lionel now. evidently not an everyday part. its ordered. now to figure out how to use it!!!!!!!

Use it to join together two LCS cables if a single cable is not long enough to do the job.

I need a PDI Bus “splitter”. Anybody make such a thing?
My Base is in the middle of my large layout. I’ve extended to one side with PDI cable. I’d like to split off at the source to extend to the other side of my layout. Rather than backtrack with more cable and make an even longer run of PDI cable. HELP!!!

There is no LCS splitter. The new Legacy Base 3 will have 3 LCS outputs to allow wiring three separate LCS legs. All LCS systems have to be one string of cables and devices until the Base 3 ships. My LCS is 220' long because of this and requires 5 B00 Joiner/amplifiers to work.

AmFlyer is correct.  The LCS devices are daisy chained using PDI cables in a single long serial connection string.  When the string gets too long, the 12v provided by the PDI power supply cable is not sufficient to power the outermost LCS devices.   I recall that Lionel indicated that 40 to 80 feet total PDI cable length should be OK for the basic PDI power cable.  A longer PDI daisy chain should add more power.  That's where the PDI Bus Joiner is necessary to inject power.  Search AmFlyer's posts for lengthy discussions on the best way to power the bus joiners for a big layout.  I found that Sensor Tracks were the devices most likely to not operate at the end of a long PDI chain without extra power.

Until the new Base3 is shipped, the single daisy chain is a limitation on the topology of LCS devices.

If you have the LCS WiFi and a Windows PC, you can download the LCS Monitor software for a diagnostic display of all the active LCS devices on the PDI bus.  Available PDI voltage on each device is part of the info.

Note that there are two separate Joiner devices. The A00 pictured above is for joining two cables as Rudy states. The B00 is a powered amplifier that also joins two cables. The need for one or more B00’s is determined by cable length as mentioned above and by the total number of LCS devices in the string. As mentioned above I needed 5 B00’s for the LCS to work but my LCS is longer and has more devices than a typical LCS installation.

So I call Lionel to order the B00? It sounds like I’ll need the power boost to get back across the room. Maybe 2?

The Base 3 is a great way to get 3 PDI plugs. I just can’t justify that cost when I’ve got everything I need now. I’m just trying to send PDI communication to the other side of my layout.

You need to call Lionel to get the Join-B00. I recommend trying the LCS without it to see if it is in fact necessary. If the LCS devices do not work reliably then place an order for the B00. I have 46 LCS devices plus 5 amplifiers, so one after about 9 devices and 30’ of cable. Four might have been enough but the B000’s are not expensive and more power is always good. Three did not work. Note the B000 requires a 12V DC power supply and a compatible barrel connector.

Three reasons for PDI cable joiners in a layout:

1.  You have lots of LCS devices that need power; get the B00 for power injection,
2.  You have an LCS device located beyond the 20 ft. PDI max cable length; get either the A00 or B00 to join two PDI cables,
3.  You have sensor tracks built into a module where accessible PDI sockets underneath the module are provided by an A00 or B00.

Until your layout expands to the point where the above conditions arise, you don't need the PDI joiners.   They are pricey ordering Qty 1 + shipping from Lionel.

Great advice Tom & Tracker John. I’m gonna go ahead and extend back to the other side. See how things work and if I need a B00, CJack has one I can purchase from him. 👍🏻

Good info.

@AmFlyer posted:

Note that there are two separate Joiner devices. The A00 pictured above is for joining two cables as Rudy states. The B00 is a powered amplifier that also joins two cables. The need for one or more B00’s is determined by cable length as mentioned above and by the total number of LCS devices in the string. As mentioned above I needed 5 B00’s for the LCS to work but my LCS is longer and has more devices than a typical LCS installation.

I don't see an amplifier...just a way to add power to the buss. The board has two diodes and a resistor to limit current to the red LED. I didn't pin it out, but no (signal) amplifier. It would be nice if someone at Lionel wrote a few lines about this issue and the devices they manufactured to deal with it.

Edited

There were two issues in the LCS when powered up prior to receipt of the B000 Joiners. First was voltage drop on the long cable run. Second, the LCS devices required more current than the power supply could provide. Adding the powered Joiners provided additional current capacity and raised the voltage on the output side of the Joiner back to full voltage. I agree that is different than signal amplification. Poor choice of words on my part.

For info, The people who led the diagnosis of my LCS issues back in 2016 and provided the three prototype powered Joiners to solve the problems were Rudy Trubitt and Jon Zahornnacky. All the email correspondence was from Rudy. When we later expanded the LCS with more BPC2's we bought three more B000 Joiners and used two of them for reliable operation, so I have a spare should it ever be needed.

In order to provide accurate data and not rely on my memory I went back to the 2016 emails with Lionel, and data, to get the exact information. The LCS when initially powered up for testing had 38 devices and 229' of connecting cables. The LCS device nameplate amperage requirements totaled 2.2A and the power supply is rated for 1A. The measured voltage at the first LCS device was 11.2V and at the last device was 4.9V. Lionel first shipped one Joiner, that did not make the LCS operable. Two more were then assembled and sent. With some trial and error to determine the exact location to install each Joiner the LCS worked with the three powered Joiners.

There is no signal amplifier for the serial communications.  Each LCS device has a serial input and serial output that communicates only with the adjacent devices on the LCS chain.  Packets recieved by an LCS device are re-transmitted to the next device on the chain so the serial signal strength is always consistent as long as each LCS device has sufficient power.  Reliable comms depend on sufficient power to the device and inter-device cable length.

@AmFlyer posted:

Note that there are two separate Joiner devices. The A00 pictured above is for joining two cables as Rudy states. The B00 is a powered amplifier that also joins two cables. The need for one or more B00’s is determined by cable length as mentioned above and by the total number of LCS devices in the string. As mentioned above I needed 5 B00’s for the LCS to work but my LCS is longer and has more devices than a typical LCS installation.

What size is the coaxial power plug on that joiner? I get something like 3.5mm by 1.35mm. Is that what you used?

Its 3.5 mm.

Oh actually it’s the inside diameter I was not sure of. I think it’s for sure 1.35 mm now though. Thanks for the quick reply.

I cannot locate the part number for the plug. Here is a closeup of the receptacle on the B000 circuit board. As close as I can measure 3.5x1.35 is correct.

Thank you, I ordered some on Amazon.

There is power to the Joiner!