Legacy SD70ACe Acts Up

Trainlover9943 posted:

I have this legacy SD70ACe (6-28281) that starts up presumably in command but then starts making sound and acting like it's in conventional, hitting the direction key doesn't make it move, it just does the sequence over again. Any ideas? I haven't ran this engine it about 4 months. https://youtu.be/YE_AfgBJWBI

Could be a signal issue or it needs a reset.

Are you trying to run it in command or conventional?   The video is a little hard to tell.

MartyE posted:

Are you trying to run it in command or conventional?   The video is a little hard to tell.

Command with legacy 

Using the direction button or changing the throttle on the transformer will not do anything if it's seeing the Legacy base signal.  I never seen you try to use the Cab 2 to get it to move.

MartyE posted:

Using the direction button or changing the throttle on the transformer will not do anything if it's seeing the Legacy base signal.  I never seen you try to use the Cab 2 to get it to move.

I tried off camera. It won't do anything command or conventional. No movement. However I do get horn and bell using the buttons on my transformer.

Run/Program switch is in Run?

MrMoe50 posted:

Run/Program switch is in Run?

Yes 

https://youtu.be/BVDqgpmV6e0 heres trying to run it on legacy. 

One think I noticed was the engine started up and made sounds before you even got over to the remote.  If the engine is receiving the command signal it will remain  silent until you address the engine on the remote and press the start up button.  I might suggest checking to be sure that there is a ground wire  connected from the base to either the common on the transformer or the outer rail.

JFC454 posted:

One think I noticed was the engine started up and made sounds before you even got over to the remote.  If the engine is receiving the command signal it will remain  silent until you address the engine on the remote and press the start up button.  I might suggest checking to be sure that there is a ground wire  connected from the base to either the common on the transformer or the outer rail.

I checked. All my other engines run in command as there supposed to. Something is wrong with this one, what, I'm not sure. 

Another thing of note was the last time I ran this engine it worked as it should. Now I get the issue I'm having here. 

Maybe you weren't really trying to reprogram the engine in real time on the video, but the directions for reprogramming Legacy engines involve more than just switch to PGM and  press SET.  

Try removing the ground wire from the command base, unplug the base and see if the engine will run in conventional mode.

JFC454 posted:

Maybe you weren't really trying to reprogram the engine in real time on the video, but the directions for reprogramming Legacy engines involve more than just switch to PGM and  press SET.  

I know that. I just wanted to try anything I could to show that it won't do anything in command. I wasn't really trying to reprogram it. Which yes, I've tried and no change. I've done all the basic troubleshooting things. I haven't opened it up yet because I don't know what I'm looking for as in what might need to be replaced. @gunrunnerjohn any ideas on this? 

JFC454 posted:

Try removing the ground wire from the command base, unplug the base and see if the engine will run in conventional mode.

No change. 

Unplug the power to the Legacy base and see if it will move.  WARNING remove all other engines from the track before you do so.

MartyE posted:

Unplug the power to the Legacy base and see if it will move.  WARNING remove all other engines from the track before you do so.

Already tried. Does the same thing.

The fact that the whistle/bell buttons generate the sounds suggests that the RS board is not seeing serial data.  My guess is the R4LC is either loose or out of the connector.  If not, then it's likely it's failed if it won't run in conventional mode.

I don't see the headlights, they should come on in conventional mode.

Did you shake the engine to see if the R4LC is rattling around inside?

gunrunnerjohn posted:

The fact that the whistle/bell buttons generate the sounds suggests that the RS board is not seeing serial data.  My guess is the R4LC is either loose or out of the connector.  If not, then it's likely it's failed if it won't run in conventional mode.

I don't see the headlights, they should come on in conventional mode.

Did you shake the engine to see if the R4LC is rattling around inside?

No I didn't. I can open it up and see if its loose. 

If you open it up, remove and reseat the boards on the motherboard, that fixes a lot of ills with older equipment.  This engine is over ten years old, plenty of time for contacts to start oxidizing.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

If you open it up, remove and reseat the boards on the motherboard, that fixes a lot of ills with older equipment.  This engine is over ten years old, plenty of time for contacts to start oxidizing.

Will do. The engine has just been sitting in my engine yard for the past few months not sure how the boards got unseated. I'll open it, reseat everything and report back. 

I have seen this same behavior on a Lionel SD-70ACe when the antenna was disconnected.  So when you open it up check the antenna wire (solder and board connector) as well as the R4LC board that GRJ pointed you to.

Opened it up. I reseated everything and no change. i also checked the antenna wire and for continuity between the wire and the board and I have it. I have no idea what to do now. I also tried a different R4LC and it was shorting something. I could smell that burning electric smell. I replaced with the original R4 and no change. 

Are you SURE you didn't get the replacement R4LC misaligned?  If you get them in one row off, you get smoke.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

Are you SURE you didn't get the replacement R4LC misaligned?  If you get them in one row off, you get smoke.

Yes I'm sure, I double checked before I turned on power. I didn't see smoke I just smelled that smell and turned it off. The replacement R4LC has a bad triac for the headlight so I pulled it out of an engine and kept it for testing. 

Well, if you smell smoke, it's time to have someone look it over, I suspect that's a bad sign.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

Well, if you smell smoke, it's time to have someone look it over, I suspect that's a bad sign.

True. Only the replacement R4LC smelled of smoke. The original gives me the issue I'm having here. I have an R2LC but I suppose I can't use that in a legacy engine since it's made for TMCC. 

Nope, you need a Legacy R4LC, don't mistake the ERR supplied R4LC for a Legacy board, it's also programmed for TMCC.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

Nope, you need a Legacy R4LC, don't mistake the ERR supplied R4LC for a Legacy board, it's also programmed for TMCC.

Ah alright. I think I'm just going to take it for service somewhere. 

So its definitely an R4LC issue. I replaced it and it responded in command although I didn't test motion but I'm sure that worked. The rear truck still buzzes when on though. When I tried the replacement R4LC I took the truck off and used a small box to balance the engine. So were getting somewhere. Just need to figure out that rear truck. 

The rear coupler buzzing when you have power sounds like a wiring issue or the R4LC has a coupler issue.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

The rear coupler buzzing when you have power sounds like a wiring issue or the R4LC has a coupler issue.

I'm not sure if it was the coupler. The truck was buzzing not really sure where it was coming from. I don't remember where the R4LC came from. I think I have one more spare from an RS6 engine. I'd imagine there compatible? 

There are a number of R4LC's for Legacy, I know of S1, S2, S3, and S5 at least.  I don't think there was an S4, at least I never saw one.  Not sure what changed between versions, but I know there were differences that would affect some operational characteristics.

Perhaps I should just order the Sx version R4LC listed on the parts page for the engine?