Lionel Base3

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

Well, patience for many folks here wore thin after a few years of waiting.

As for the swipe, not everyone has the manual dexterity to manipulate the screen interface, just because it's easy for you doesn't mean it's easy for everyone.  If this were easy and intuitive for everyone, we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Well John I am offering some advice of how to swipe that works for me.  I didn't say it was easy I said it was effective.

And yes, patience.  There was no doubt things would arise once released.  I have no doubt Dave and his team are working to tackle the issues.

Touch screen devices are sensitive to a person's hands. If you have dry hands,  touch screens don't always read your touch.  I talked to Dave Olson about this awhile back as a reason to go with a physical remote. This could be the reason why some are having a hard time with swiping. If this is the case,  there is nothing Lionel can do to make the screen read better.  Eliminating swiping would help as touching is more reliable than a swipe.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

As for the swipe, not everyone has the manual dexterity to manipulate the screen interface, just because it's easy for you doesn't mean it's easy for everyone.  If this were easy and intuitive for everyone, we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Ditto! 

Bottom line to all this drama is this device is not ready for prime time. How many years in development 3, 4?  Maybe in two more years all the bugs will be worked out. I’ll wait

I would urge everyone that has issues to turn them in to TalkToUs@lionel.com   Put CAB3 or BASE3 in the title depending on what you are reporting.   I worked with software for years and the more that report an issue, the better chance of getting a fix.  If you have a problem with something, REPORT IT.  Your report may be the "last straw on the camels back" that gets the issue fixed.  1 issue per email to keep confusion down.

1. At the start write a note explaining the problem in every day terms.  List the time wasted, trains crashed, unrunable or why it is important.   Show the need for a change/fix.   This is for the decision maker, the person who decides if the resources will be allocated to fix the problem.   They may or may not know the difference between a golf ball and a train so write accordingly. 

2.  Then write the problem for the software person, this includes details of the problem and any suggested fixes.

It only takes a few minutes. 

@MartyE posted:

Well John I am offering some advice of how to swipe that works for me.  I didn't say it was easy I said it was effective.

And yes, patience.  There was no doubt things would arise once released.  I have no doubt Dave and his team are working to tackle the issues.

Marty, I think sometimes the “upgrade” is just for an “upgrade” Lionel might have been better off taking a simple route more in the line of incremental upgrades and not sweeping. I hope this all works out, but they also could have came out with a new cab 2A hand held. This would have smoothed out the larger upgrade.

That said, can all the cab 2 programming be transferred to the cab 3 yet? If not what is your  thought on the time line.? I am asking about a direct transfer from 2 to 3?

@ThatGuy posted:

Marty, I think sometimes the “upgrade” is just for an “upgrade” Lionel might have been better off taking a simple route more in the line of incremental upgrades and not sweeping. I hope this all works out, but they also could have came out with a new cab 2A hand held. This would have smoothed out the larger upgrade.

That said, can all the cab 2 programming be transferred to the cab 3 yet? If not what is your  thought on the time line.? I am asking about a direct transfer from 2 to 3?

As soon as the B3SU comes out this will be possible.  In order to use that the 1.26 firmware needs to be installed.  Currently you can only do that from the app.  Android users can update now, Apple user have a small wait.  I suspect with in a week.

Bug reports .... help the software guys.  Running on iOS or Android, Cab3 fails in different ways.

Include the platform info - model, OS version.

If you can repeat the problem, describe how.  I can trigger strange behavior using different swipes.  I'm planning to record a video of the issue when I get back to testing.

@ThatGuy posted:

That said, can all the cab 2 programming be transferred to the cab 3 yet? If not what is your  thought on the time line.? I am asking about a direct transfer from 2 to 3?

I transferred most of the Base2/Cab2 data to the Base3 via the module.  With a few engines I entered the data into the Base3 via my computer using LSU v2.0.  I have not noticed any functional/operational deficiencies running the trains using the Base3 with Cab2 or Cab1-L.

@Dennis-LaRock posted:

I transferred most of the Base2/Cab2 data to the Base3 via the module.  With a few engines I entered the data into the Base3 via my computer using LSU v2.0.  I have not noticed any functional/operational deficiencies running the trains using the Base3 with Cab2 or Cab1-L.

I can plug in the Subway modules and they will transfer?

I think you have to use the 'Black' Module... Marty may correct me on this.

@MartyE posted:

As soon as the B3SU comes out this will be possible.  In order to use that the 1.26 firmware needs to be installed.  Currently you can only do that from the app.  Android users can update now, Apple user have a small wait.  I suspect with in a week.

Just took a look online, thanks for the heads up

@ThatGuy posted:

I can plug in the Subway modules and they will transfer?

If you have the Orange Modules that came with your locomotives, you can use them to enter the locomotive's information just as you would with the Legacy system.  You can either use the Cab2 by plugging the module into it, or the App and put the module in Base3.  Just make sure you are using the TMCC ID assigned to the subway.

I’m having trouble with base 3 - cab 2 remote - TMCC

the app runs my century II Niagara, but the remote crashes when making horn, whistle or speed change. I’ve reset several times with the secret “74” code. Is there something I’m overthinking with the remote set up?

@Genoz posted:

I’m having trouble with base 3 - cab 2 remote - TMCC

the app runs my century II Niagara, but the remote crashes when making horn, whistle or speed change. I’ve reset several times with the secret “74” code. Is there something I’m overthinking with the remote set up?

What version software is on the Cab2 remote?  The Cab2 remote should have version 1.74 on it.

Ok I did update the remote and now it works, rtfm.  

@Genoz posted:

Ok I did update the remote and now it works, rtfm.  

Glad you got it going.

So... having had this Base3 and Cab3 for a few weeks now, I'm impressed/Not Impressed... let me preface this by saying I am pretty tech savvy, and I have been involved in App development for a large payroll company

I like the concept, BUT, as an Apple hardware/software user (iMac, MacBook Pro, iPhone) this kind of leaves me out of the capability of transferring and managing information through the Windows-based Base3 utility. And I'm not about to gunk up my hardware/software with a Windows emulator.

So, I've tried countless times to get the Base3 to join my home network (FiOS Gigabit) to no avail through my iPhone -  The swiping functionality is great on the Bluetooth side of the app, but I can't get the app to swipe into the Cab3/Base3 parameters page, the only 'swiping' I can do is accessing the engine roster or swiping the keypad portion of the Cab3/Base3 app. I deleted and reinstalled the app, and still the same, very limited swiping ability - and it has nothing to do with dry hands, etc. There is a definite need to have some type of access icon(s) at the bottom of the app to access a specific layer or page of information in the Cab3/Base3 side of the app. TheCab3 app UI/UX is functional to a degree, but leaves a lot to be desired, especially from an accessibility standpoint

Tried entering three different locomotives via the Cab3/Base3 - not an easy task. I had to 'reprogram' each engine - which, since I have no access to a LSU and download to a memory module, I had to fire up my Cab2 base, and scroll through, copying each locomotive number and enter that info.  I'm going to do the other 15 locomotives on a 'rainy day' when I have the fortitude to do so.

I did relay this info to Lionel...

It’s quite fitting that the Base 3 looks like a half melted bridge. This is a far cry from the simplicity and reliability of TMCC and Legacy. Right now this looks like a bridge to nowhere.

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

It’s quite fitting that the Base 3 looks like a half melted bridge. This is a far cry from the simplicity and reliability of TMCC and Legacy. Right now this looks like a bridge to nowhere.

The app definitely needs some work.  I'm confident it will get the issues resolved.  The Base is solid and works well with the current Cab2 and Cab1L.  The App will catch up.

Even if they fix the app, it looks like it will just be a semi-working CAB-2 emulator at best. Not sure I really want to disconnect my current setup for it when the app could have at least done more than just give me a roster history (its best feature so far). It’s very disappointing. I suppose if I was running a lot of the toy stuff I could go and make open mouth soyface YouTubes about it. Right now it’s a literal paperweight. I thought they’d at least fix the Powermaster issue after a whole month. This comes after a long string of really subpar Lionels I bought lately.

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

Even if they fix the app, it looks like it will just be a semi-working CAB-2 emulator at best. Not sure I really want to disconnect my current setup for it when the app could have at least done more than just give me a roster history (its best feature so far). It’s very disappointing. I suppose if I was running a lot of the toy stuff I could go and make open mouth soyface YouTubes about it. Right now it’s a literal paperweight. I thought they’d at least fix the Powermaster issue after a whole month. This comes after a long string of really subpar Lionels I bought lately.

Well Norm your solution is simple.  Don't use Base3.  If you're happy with Cab2 and Legacy then that's where your should stay.  I certainly understand the frustrations.  Personally I'm pretty happy so far despite the App issues.  Lionel has a small staff working on this.  I'm sure that's not a good enough excuse but it is what it is.  While it may be not be the smooth roll out we all hoped for, enough folks here are willing to help and @Dave Olson is engaged to help navigate the problems and find resolutions.

On a side note I see those art lessons are coming along.  LOL!

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

Nice graphics Norm.

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

It’s quite fitting that the Base 3 looks like a half melted bridge. This is a far cry from the simplicity and reliability of TMCC and Legacy. Right now this looks like a bridge to nowhere.

Norm, on a positive note, I like the 765 hat!!!!!!

I thought the Base 3 base station was modeled after the **** Gate bridge. So far, I haven’t seen any riffing on that reference. It’s too easy, and apparently no one has taken the bait. It’s a pretty sophisticated crowd here on the O Gauge Forum.

'I thought the Base 3 base station was modeled after the **** Gate bridge. So far, I haven’t seen any riffing on that reference. It’s too easy, and apparently no one has taken the bait. It’s a pretty sophisticated crowd here on the O Gauge Forum.'

The*** you say!

After a few hours of exceptional patience this morning, I figured out how to 'swipe' into the Base3 settings page - you have to swipe from the center in the Cab3 app, hoping you don't accidentally hit a button. I was then able to got through the motions and get my Base3 to link up to my home FiOS WiFi network.

Then I tried to update the firmware and following the instructions - attempted to get the Base3 to go into update mode - no good. No slow indicator lights - just a quick green flash and the LIONEL lights on the side blinking. I was also unable to download the firmware through my Cab3 app  - I get a long error string and my app telling me the Base3 is not in update mode

I'm guessing the iPhone/Cab3 -->Base3 updating is not functional at this point or am I missing something?

@DaveP posted:

After a few hours of exceptional patience this morning, I figured out how to 'swipe' into the Base3 settings page - you have to swipe from the center in the Cab3 app, hoping you don't accidentally hit a button.

I'm guessing the iPhone/Cab3 -->Base3 updating is not functional at this point or am I missing something?

I always have success by swiping from the left hand side of the numeric keypad.

The iOS app is not capable yet of doing the firmware update.  I suspect we'll see an update this week.

@MartyE posted:

I always have success by swiping from the left hand side of the numeric keypad.

The iOS app is not capable yet of doing the firmware update.  I suspect we'll see an update this week.

Good to know! Thanks Marty!

So as a user of the Base 3 mostly using the Cab2 to run my trains I continue to read about some of the problems people are having with the new system.

I have no issues running my TMCC, Conventional, Legacy engines with the Cab2 through the new base 3.

Although it took a few moments to read through instructions for linking the Base 3 to my home network, I found it very easy after using the option to use the manual method to input my network name and password through the App.

I think it would be fair to ask is it really a problem the Base 3 or is it the Cab3 App?

Also, for the more advanced user that has expectations of what the Base 3 and Cab 3 were supposed to do, we need to keep a few things in mind. The Base 3 was designed to be the next system for Lionel users moving forward ie: the beginner Legacy user to the more advanced Legacy user.

As Lionel no longer produces the Cab2 and Legacy base the Base 3 becomes the only alternative for newer modelers to get into Lionel Legacy command control without spending a thousand dollars buying an older system.

As it stands now the investment is only in the Base 3 @ $500 and the App is free via your smart device. So total investment is half of what people are overcharging for their used Cab2 units.

I have run into a few issues myself with the app using it on my Iphone. I don't like the fact that you have to take a communication device and connect to the AP network and then receive an email that I answer which then disconnects me from the base unit. However the solution to this is to not use my phone to run trains. As I am still working in my profession and on my phone a good portion of the day the last thing I want to do is run trains from my Iphone.

The good news I think is that since most of the issues are with the software app and can eventually be resolved through revisions of the software controlling the App. I understand Lionel uses a third party for the App so Lionel must rely on the 3rd party to make the revisions to the software. I assume Lionel would prefer to get as much feedback as possible to convey to their consultant so as many of these issue can be resolved in the next software update.

Not trying to defend Lionel here as I have had many issues with them in the past, just trying to convey some points about the Base 3.

Thanks for your perspective. For people who want to begin using Legacy, the cost difference of $500 plus a free app that can be updated via software for Base 3 versus the more than a grand that some are asking for used Base 2 sets is compelling.

Dave P.

The online instructions saying the pipes will slowly flash is WRONG,  the side blue lights flash.  Lionel has been informed, but have not gotten around to correcting the online instructions yet.  Follow the instructions on the cab3 app, they have been corrected 'android' don't know about the iphones.

@Reading RR posted:

Dave P.

The online instructions saying the pipes will slowly flash is WRONG,  the side blue lights flash.  Lionel has been informed, but have not gotten around to correcting the online instructions yet.  Follow the instructions on the cab3 app, they have been corrected 'android' don't know about the iphones.

Makes sense - thanks for the info!

@macdaddy posted:

I have run into a few issues myself with the app using it on my Iphone. I don't like the fact that you have to take a communication device and connect to the AP network and then receive an email that I answer which then disconnects me from the base unit. However the solution to this is to not use my phone to run trains. As I am still working in my profession and on my phone a good portion of the day the last thing I want to do is run trains from my Iphone.

If you link the BASE3 to your home network, then you have seamless running without reconfiguration of the WiFi connection.  I've been using the Legacy WiFi as well as the MTH WiFi on my layout, both are connected to my network.  I can simply pick up the phone or tablet and have a connection to the WiFi controllers as well as not losing Internet connectivity on that device.

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

. It’s very disappointing. I suppose if I was running a lot of the toy stuff I could go and make open mouth soyface YouTubes about it.

Thank you for denigrating a whole bunch of us who run 'a lot of toy stuff'  on our train layouts, albeit with modern equipment, who also use Base 3.

You could try to be a little more insulting to those who take the time to make the videos to show how it all works, but I'm not sure you can.

OK guys....lets try to play nice.  The alternative is to close the thread.

Thanks GunrunnerJohn, I just tried to connect the app on the phone with the switch set to network rather than AP and it connected. Prior attempts had failed. Good to know that I can now multi-task while using the App.

Can someone post when the IOS App Base3 Firmware Update works successfully?  Thank you.

@eaaiii posted:

Can someone post when the IOS App Base3 Firmware Update works successfully?  Thank you.

I don't think you need to ask but yes.  I'm sure as soon as someone sees an update they'll be here like stink on a skunk.

It could be me, maybe one of those days where I should have stayed in bed.        I loaded all the engines I run into my base 3, including my two lash ups.        I run with the Base 3 on my ORBI network on Channel 1.     My 990 is on Channel 1 also.    Most of the time I run with the 990 powered off.   Only time I power up the 990 is when the Base 3 acts up…….  

Today the Base 3 would Power up a Legacy Steam Engine, sounds were activated, Whistle working but the throttle would not work.    What am I doing wrong?

in addition,  one lash up with three engines worked well, the other lash (that worked previously) would not even power up?   Thoughts?

using the 990 everything above worked well.

Joe

i wanted to post a video but the 40 second video was to large for this forum.