Lionel Empire State Express Coaches - Prototype length and width?

Lionel's 21" cars are scale length and I assume width but don't know what prototype width is. They are actually more accurate than The GGD cars in finish and have the proper full width diaphragms which GGD cars don't.

Lionel did two runs of 21" cars but changed the trucks on the 2nd run so the cars would sit lower so you might have height variations as well as color variations if you tried to mix them with GGD cars. 

Pete

If they are the old aluminum extrusions just cut longer, they are of prototype cross section.  The older cars had a flat section below the windows that killed them for accurate Budd cars.  Check out K-Line?

The Lionel ESE observation car was totally incorrect for the ESE.  Not sure about the prototypical accuracy of the other cars.  You may consider looking for a set of K-Line 21" ESE cars, although not 100% accurate either they are the closest.  Nothing in O scale comes close to the accuracy and beauty of the MTH cars in HO scale of a few years back.

The 21" cars are plastic, not extrusions. Most of the cars are actually very close with the exception of the Observation. These were the first 21" cars Lionel did and most were based on the ESE.  I would have preferred these even over the GGD but didn't need another Hudson and you had to buy the engine to get 4 of the cars.

Pete

I have only one Lionel car, the Station Sounds Diner. Compared to the GGD ESE Diner.

Actual Budd Diner. GGD gets points for window size.

ESE car as built with full width diaphragms. These were replaced with more common diaphragms in the mid '50s.

Pete

I’m with JR Junction on this one; seeing all three sets side-by-side and the K-Line gets my vote.  Every time.