And I know a retailer who has two or three affected JLC GG-1's in for repair where zinc rot is one problem to sort. I don't know what they might pay and I certainly don't speak on their behalf, but I suspect if they can offer a solution to their customers they may order enough to fix the ones currently in house and pass along the cost.
Plastic is fine. $100 a pair is acceptable. I need several pairs.
I am in for $100 approx price for plastic
Yes. $100.00 for a pair. Harry 
Here is a picture of a Lionel GG1 JLC with a pair of our new truck frames. We will be putting them through their paces over the next week. So far they look great and nothing seems to be binding.
HENNING'S TRAINS
That's really cool, I have to take a peek at those next time I'm in. Is that Walt's GG-1? If so, I'll bet he's glad to see it looking like that! 
Harry,
When you say $100 per pair, does that “pair” mean pair of sideframes (enough for one truck), or does it mean pair of trucks (enough for one loco)?
Bill
One truck does both sides, it's one piece. The quoted price is for one locomotive.
Very interested in this.
I'd pay $150 for metal, if that were an option.
Dave
I have at least three that need help.
I'm in for a $100 plastic pair.
However, is there any hope a brass pair might still get developed? Metal would be my preferred replacement.
I've been in for three pair since I started this whole thread. Here's hoping and here's also a big thanks for doing this. 
I have one of these for sale if anyone is interested. I took it out of the box once and it had the truck issue as we know. I am giving up on doing the fix. Make a reasonable offer and its yours. Thx
While my 2 engines currently seem OK (knock wood!), I'd probably be interested in a pair (maybe even 2 pair to cover the bases for both engines) as a backup in case one of them decides to start crumbling one day. (you know, buy the part when it's available, not look for it after it's not available when you are more desperate for it 
)
Of course with the limited production numbers described, I would not try to buy one before all the folks with truly crumbled trucks get a chance to buy theirs. At 4 sets per month, I'm assuming there is enough demand that could take years to fill. While I personally seem lucky so far with mine, there seem to be far more people who have not been when they opened their boxes after years of storage.
But if the production can be ramped up, I'd go for at least one set at $100. From the picture, those look really good. Hopefully if it is established that there is enough interest the processes can be learned by more than just that one science person to make these.
-Dave
My thought's? Not on price or material... I had known of the problem from the first report, and possibly that a group was working on a solution. Then for forgotten reasons, I'd concentrated on other things. Now, less than a week ago, I made a rare foray into "3-rail Scale" looking to find any concern about curve easements-- I had discovered that 21" Lionel passenger cars (O-54" capable so labelled) could actually be towed around the 39+" diameter of 0-27 style 42" curves. By towed, I refer the fixed coupler on the rear of a postwar F3A-B set, and proved it on the family room rug with a few pieces of track and a B-unit. (Watch this forum...)
So I saw the set of posts here ending in a great silence in June of 2018, and realized whatever else had happened (new thread?) I must have surely missed the boat. Tonight, I noticed the old thread title in the sidebar-- turned out the boat had not left and I was only 12 hours in learning that. As we used to say in the engineering office-- if you can't be good, it sure helps to be lucky.
So, it is easy to say that $100 for a pair, for my one engine, looks like a really good solution to me. It's been run, just to make sure it did. and one pantograph locked in a position just not touching (5-1/8"?) at the generally agreed best pantograph height of 5-1/4" (21 scale feet). The PRR usual height is 22 feet. Since then it has been under its display cover (compresses the pantograph slightly, there being about 1/4" spring play below locked position) about 7 feet off the 1st floor of the house. Here the thermostat is set for 78-degrees cooling, 68 degrees heating, less of both at night. Humidity is higher in summer-- don't recall the figures, but cellar temps were about 5 degrees less, and 2d floor at least 5 degrees more, which would modify the humidity accordingly. Right now, AC not run today (but yesterday) indoor !st floor is 70F and humidity 60%. My TMCC GG1 (tuscan) is not showing any disintegration, but it is hard to get a close look at it for lesser damage.
This GG1 has been my favorite among the several choices, because of its correct scale length, height, and correct shape of the shell. I was actually able to see that its overhangs on curves required only 1/2" added clearance per degree of curvature, rather than the usual 1". The model does require the usual 1", but that is because the frame being replaced carries the pivot point of the drivers, while in the model the pivot point is of necessity located at the maintenance-free motor.
I would be interested in the test of how the new frame works pulling cars, but since I am beginning to see that my compressed PRR mainline layout could use compression of train length, I would get your frame regardless. (I'm going to compress the 4-track main line to two tracks-- there is actually a long stretch of this on the NYC-DC route.) Finally, thanks for all the effort you put into this. --Frank M
I will be in for 2 pairs no problem. Just say where and when you need the funds. Love to get my two congressional GG1’s going:
When and where can we start to order the metal or plastic type frames?
Really appreciate your efforts Harry. I prefer metal. If plastic is the only option, then plastic will do. How much longer to complete the project in metal?
I agree with the last comment in that I'd prefer a metal truck frame, but plastic would work if it's what's available and proves itself to be sturdy enough in your testing. A plastic truck frame beats the heck out of an expensive paperweight.
I just looked over one of the plastic frames at the shop. Conveniently, they're molded in black, so you don't have to paint them. The plastic "seems" pretty solid, the pull test will be the proof I guess. The GG-1 runs fine with them, that's the first hurdle.
I have three of these I've never opened - 18354, 18355, 18371. I am waiting for the right time to take the plunge and find out if they have the problem. I would certainly want the fix for any that do.
I've got an 18371 tuscan and would definitely pay $100 for an insurance policy! I'm in.
Any details yet on when and where to send a check?
Thank you for all of your inputs. If testing goes well this weekend we will start the 'S-L-O-O-O-W' casting process. I will post here when ready to accept orders etc. , probably not before mid September. Harry
When you get things rolling I'll order a set for my 4866. Never thought it would run again.
Thanks harry for all your hard work. I'll sent a check when the official order line starts forming.
My son Harry !!! ran the GG-1 w/ 30 freight cars Sunday w/ no problems. Tonight he will be pulling a string of Freedom Train cars , about 17 cars. My science teacher is going ahead w/ making a 2nd. mold. A new vacumn chamber & pump has been ordered, and should be able to pour, cast and trim about 4-8 pieces a week. Harry 
So Harry, are these made from casting resin? That is strong, but is it brittle also?
I need a set of these. My JLC GG1 was a victim of the zinc rot.
Harry,
Thanks for your efforts! I also have the JLC GG1 (green 5 stripe).
As a mechanical Engineer, I would like to point out that plastic may only be a temporary fix. Some quick info that's written about plastics:
"Plastics age by a combination of things, such as temperature, exposure to ultraviolet light, visible light, atmospheric components, humidity, or liquids/chemicals/oils. The polymer aging processes can be further separated into physical aging, chemical aging, thermal aging, etc. Most polymers are amorphous and undergo physical relaxation and other structural changes with time. Generally speaking, the softer a polymer is, the more flexible its polymer chains will be, and the more prone it will be to time-related changes. The chemical composition of the polymer, the presence and concentration of oxidation-prone groups, and the amount of plasticizers or additives can also have a strong effect on the process."
Then, when you consider that oil will get on these trucks however plastic friendly, consider how heavy the GG1 model is (as well as the load path thru the trucks), we may still get trucks that bow or crack over time. If you remember the Weaver boxcars with plastic trucks, they were also very lightly weighted. Many of us converted them to metal especially since the coupling forces went thru them. Can you imagine how the coupling load and towing load affects the plastic trucks on the GG1? Imagine looking forward to that nice solid thunk sound when you go to couple it to your Congressional cars only to watch the rear truck drop it's wheels and break free of the coupler.
Sorry if this is not what you want to hear. I am only pointing it out to prevent another disappointment later in the hopes that we decide to go with a metal truck instead. I prefer metal trucks for all of these reasons.
Thanks!
-Matt
@Catenary Matt posted:Sorry if this is not what you want to hear. I am only pointing it out to prevent another disappointment later in the hopes that we decide to go with a metal truck instead. I prefer metal trucks for all of these reasons.
However, as has been discussed, the cost for a small run of metal sideframes is considerably more, probably price prohibitive for many of the folks that would like to get their GG1 back on the rails. If a set in metal was $250-300 vs $100 for the plastic, how many people here would still be interested in getting the parts?
@gunrunnerjohn If the metal would be a more permanent fix I would be willing to spend the extra $100 on the trucks.
Plastic vs metal - no doubt factually correct points raised.
But I'd prefer to have a solution than not.
Because my GG1 currently has no truck frames at all. They turned to dust. So much for metal.
And who's to say, though subject to aging, etc, as pointed out, plastic frames might not last years?
Anyway, that this effort is all volunteer and yet produced a reasonable solution shows dedication and deserves more applause than second guessing.
I'll happily write a check for new frames regardless of the material they're made from.
Please don't be a buzzkill!
But would you be willing to spend another $150-200 on them? Tooling for metal seems lot more expensive than for the plastic, and I suspect Harry is not willing to spend that much money up front. Several were cast in metal, and the shrinkage was too much to use them, though they looked great. There comes a point of diminishing returns on something like this.
While I have no doubt that the proper metal could be more robust, remember that we're replacing metal sideframes that didn't make the grade! While it's possible that plastic will degrade over time, that's by no means a foregone conclusion. It really depends on the composition of the plastic.
Could the molds made for the initial metal castings be slightly enlarged to account for the final shrinkage?
Hard to say, but my read is that was very difficult. The issue is, how do you start? You either fire up your CAD controlled CNC machine and create the mold from a block of steel or make a mold from an existing piece. The CNC route is very expensive, and clearly Harry opted for the create the mold from an existing piece. The question is, how do you size up the mold a couple percent without a pattern?
It would be great if Lionel would share any CAD files that they might have on these die-cast GG-1 trucks. Not a CAD expert here, but that would most likely help a CNC guru in scaling up a mold to allow for the shrinkage.
Well, while I'm not an expert, it will depend on the type of (co-) polymer system used. Any thermoplastic will fail over time. Some epoxy resins (cross linked) systems are very brittle and others not so much. Some examples; epoxy resins are being used for "welding" metal (automobile car frame) or used in carbon fiber applications. Not sure what type of system is being used here. There are also additives that can be added to enhance the desired effect, carbon black for example could be added for strength.
Couple of other examples where plastics are successfully used under stress conditions -
Overhead valve cover on car/truck motors (high temp and oil contact)
Transmission pan/filter combo units
All that said, there are protocols that could be used to stress or age the plastic at an accelerated rate. For example a UV light box, high sustained temperatures (oven), etc. Testing then could be completed. I am sure this solution could work, but the "right" cross-linked system should/has to be used.
A good polymer that's used on handguns would be good to use. You would need that formula.
Yep, the frame of my Glock 17 hasn't failed, and it's certainly beat up a lot more than the GG-1 will ever be! I've had it for about 25 years, and it's still like new. The slide shows a lot more wear than the frame...
All die-cast will eventually turn to dust. But some plastics will remain in landfills for thousands of years! Major shout-out to Harry Henning, whose efforts have probably put more crumbling toy trains in O and Standard Gauge back on the rails than anyone I know!!
That being said, has anyone reached out to Dennis Mashburn (KD Castings, Abilene, TX) ? He's a 2-rail O Scaler and does small-run brass castings with a foundry on his property. I've been to his house and he told us all about shrinkage, lost wax and plastic masters, etc. If you have a good part, even if it's plastic, he might be a guy who can do it in brass. And in multiples! (I've seen some of his stuff fresh on the sprues.) Brass is very permanent. It doesn't disintegrate like die-cast so you won't have a repeat of this problem. Of course it would have to be painted.
I can't speak for Dennis, I don't know what his current workload is like or what he would charge. Just trying to take some of the repetitive production load off of Harry and give people a metal option if they really want one.
