Lionel Lionmaster Big Boy Locomotive #4011 defective DCDS-J board

ERR Cruise M modular- is a tachless DCDS. http://www.3rdrail.com/err-3rd...ruiseCommanderM.html

I don't think that will work with Legacy will it? this is a Legacy Engine. I don't know what you mean by tachless.

@Vernon Barry posted:

ERR Cruise M modular- is a tachless DCDS. http://www.3rdrail.com/err-3rd...ruiseCommanderM.html

Tachless- back EMF tachometer speed sensing meaning it works without having to worry about the encoder ring and tach sensor from the failed OEM system.

To my knowledge, Legacy is backwards compatible to TMCC commands (accepts and follows them). So given that engine, and going down the feature list- what exactly is lost using TMCC mode?  Again, the radio receiver for Legacy/TMCC in that engine understands the higher level format and sends the higher level format down the serial data bus. However, it's also backwards TMCC compatible- as is the sound card, smoke unit controller (whistle steam). Granted, I have not personally wired up ERR Cruise M to an RCDR style receiver, but again it's just serial data and can be backwards compatible TMCC mode.

As I see it, you have a few options:

• Send it back at your cost for missing the detail
• Repair it using and ERR Cruise M- and maybe have to use TMCC format commands
• Beg for someone to part out  an engine or happens to have that exact Legacy DCDS-J and sell it to you for less than the cost of an ERR Cruise M
• Go full bore, rip everything out, switch to newer Legacy platform electronics at considerable expense all while rewiring much of the loco

Thanks for the reply... I'll consider my options! It's a rare loco and my layout can't handle larger engine tequirements. I'd like to make it work if I can. I'll just have to think things through...

The ERR CC-M will NOT work with this locomotive!  The board will not recognize the serial data from the R4LC.  There is a Legacy back-EMF board that does recognize the Legacy serial data, basically the CC-M programmed for Legacy.

CC-M definitely won’t work. And if you go TMCC you’ll most likely loose Whistle Steam. Also this locomotive has the RCDR not a R4LC

@Dank0 posted:

Hey all,

I just bought this from Trainz and neglected to see where they said that the driver board was defective. They'll take it back at my expense, but I thought I'd see if there is a way to fix it. You can't get that board currently. Are there any alternatives?

https://www.trainz.com/product...riant=43529348939898

I admire your positive attitude. Also, after reading the description, I can see why and how you missed reading that the driver board was defective.  The description is deceptive because it goes into great detail on all the wonderful features on the engine, but buries the MOST IMPORTANT CONSIDERATION THAT THE ENGINE DOES NOT RUN.

Further, they include TCA grades for the visual appeal of the engine and box, but leave out the Operational Standards, which would be O-2:  None of the operational components of the piece function properly; might be relegated to “parts only”

Condition and Grading Standards, Paper and Box Standards, Restored / Refinished Items Standards, Operational Standards - Train Collectors Association (tcatrains.org)

I think you have a good case to get a full refund, including shipping.   Trainz needs to implement the full TCA grading standards.   The operational component was added by the TCA because of the increased complexity of modern equipment.   

This parts compatibility was discussed in this related discussion about Lionel parts situation.

https://ogrforum.com/...7#164024807790838637

Hopefully, @gunrunnerjohn or someone else can assist you with a Legacy compatible DCDS.

@Former Member posted:

I admire your positive attitude. Also, after reading the description, I can see why and how you missed reading that the driver board was defective.  The description is deceptive because it goes into great detail on all the wonderful features on the engine, but buries the MOST IMPORTANT CONSIDERATION THAT THE ENGINE DOES NOT RUN.

Further, they include TCA grades for the visual appeal of the engine and box, but leave out the Operational Standards, which would be O-2:  None of the operational components of the piece function properly; might be relegated to “parts only”

Condition and Grading Standards, Paper and Box Standards, Restored / Refinished Items Standards, Operational Standards - Train Collectors Association (tcatrains.org)

I think you have a good case to get a full refund, including shipping.   Trainz needs to implement the full TCA grading standards.   The operational component was added by the TCA because of the increased complexity of modern equipment.   

Oh, I'm ****ed. I just have to manage the situation for the best outcome. I don't think Trainz cares. I can either have a 10% discount or pay the shipping to return it. I recently bought an LCP2 engine from them during their Memorial day sale. They realized that they screwed up 4 days after it was marked shipped and refunded my money. (inventory screw up) I could have bought the same engine from Trainworld for the same price with the same competing sale. They refused to give me any compensation for the incident but hoped I'd get over it and come back again some day. All I wanted was a 10% off my next order and they refused. Not confident that they're going to do me any favors. The only reason I jumped at this one is that it's rare and I can't run full scale big boys on my layout. Oops!

Thanks for the moral support!

Have you checked to see if the DCDS-J board is repairable?  There are some components that can be replaced.

By the way, are you able to get any of the other functions of the engine working (except for the motor control)?  Does the engine communicate with the tender?  Does the whistle steam work?  Do the lights on the engine function correctly?  Just some thoughts and depending on what results you get, might guide you to the possible component failure on the DCDS-J that has failed.

@DaveGG posted:

Have you checked to see if the DCDS-J board is repairable?  There are some components that can be replaced.

By the way, are you able to get any of the other functions of the engine working (except for the motor control)?  Does the engine communicate with the tender?  Does the whistle steam work?  Do the lights on the engine function correctly?  Just some thoughts and depending on what results you get, might guide you to the possible component failure on the DCDS-J that has failed.

I made a quick video to illustrate it current state. Not sure if smoke is not working due to other problems but none that I can see. Sounds work, but there is strange behavior. The 60 cycle hum is inaudible in the video. headlight/marker lights and taillights work. no cab light.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCjGhGzH2gQ

I don't have a Legacy or TMCC command system, so I'm stuck on conventional for now. I'm fairly new to the hobby and I'm waiting for the base 3. I think the 990 system is around $1,500 used now! No thanks...

Any progress on this repair?

No, sadly it's going to get returned. No way to get parts for it, no easy way to upgrade it to latest legacy. No possible way of getting any support from Lionel. Let the buyer beware. If you spend $3,000 on a modern Lionel vision line locomotive, you could be in this very same position within 5 to 10 years. It isn't just lionmaster engines that got left behind. There is no forward thinking about backwards compatibility. From what I've seen, there is no regard for the longevity of anything they make with a PCB in it.