Scroll all the way down to the bottom of the Lionel.com home page and the new shipping schedule is posted. Thanks to Dave Olson of Lionel getting this done for us!
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And there's the Christmas cluster wave we've been expecting. 
More time to save for that CV Mogul.......and more websites to scout out to order one when it shows up (and assuming it isn't a repeat of the Lionmaster A, 0-8-0, etc, etc, etc)
Where's David?!?!?!
SJC posted:More time to save for that CV Mogul.......and more websites to scout out to order one when it shows up (and assuming it isn't a repeat of the Lionmaster A, 0-8-0, etc, etc, etc)
The Moguls are already on the water with the AC-9, LC+ Mikado, and E8 along with a ton of rolling stock. I for one feel we're shipping stuff pretty well this year.
And no, the Mogul will not have the BEMC. As stated before, no O scale Legacy engine will again. Either the RCMC fits in or it won't be made.
Matt Makens posted:Where's David?!?!?!
I keep tell ya, Matt. I gave up awhile ago looking for Lionel shipping schedule updates. 
But it appears I was correct on one thing... Looks like ALL the 21" passenger cars are currently scheduled to ship from Lionel in the SAME month: December (which could imply Dec 32nd). 
Hope all the 21" passenger car fans have been filling their piggy banks, 'cause it'll be time to break those banks in one fell whoop. 
David
Rocky Mountaineer posted:I keep tell ya, Matt. I gave up awhile ago looking for Lionel shipping schedule updates.
David
If you ordered them and didn't save up by now, shame on you.
Dave Warburton posted:Scroll all the way down to the bottom of the Lionel.com home page and the new shipping schedule is posted. Thanks to Dave Olson of Lionel getting this done for us!
Oh thank God. Thanks for posting. Mogul mid September and milk cars in November
"And no, the Mogul will not have the BEMC. As stated before, no O scale Legacy engine will again. Either the RCMC fits in or it won't be made."
Yeah, I know that this is not the "Controls" Forum, but, quick and dirty, what do BEMC and RCMC mean? And why is it important? I'm still in TMCC-world, mostly...
D500 posted:"And no, the Mogul will not have the BEMC. As stated before, no O scale Legacy engine will again. Either the RCMC fits in or it won't be made."
Yeah, I know that this is not the "Controls" Forum, but, quick and dirty, what do BEMC and RCMC mean? And why is it important? I'm still in TMCC-world, mostly...
Long story short.... The 0-8-0 switcher locomotives that were produced last year didn't have the "full" Legacy electronics on-board. The BEMC turned out to be a half-@$$ed short-cut that caused lots of grief for folks expecting (rightly so) silky smooth slow-speed operation... something that's ideal for switching operations. As a result, dealers are largely stuck with a bunch of ala-carte 0-8-0 locomotives once the word spread about the BEMC short-cut. Unfortunately, this also affected the Bethlehem Steel "Steel City Switcher" set, which I had my eye on... but was waiting for a super-sale to grab one. Once I heard about the slow-speed operation problems though, I RAN from that set as fast as I could. 
David
Rocky Mountaineer posted:D500 posted:"And no, the Mogul will not have the BEMC. As stated before, no O scale Legacy engine will again. Either the RCMC fits in or it won't be made."
Yeah, I know that this is not the "Controls" Forum, but, quick and dirty, what do BEMC and RCMC mean? And why is it important? I'm still in TMCC-world, mostly...
Long story short.... The 0-8-0 switcher locomotives that were produced last year didn't have the "full" Legacy electronics on-board. The BEMC turned out to be a half-@$$ed short-cut that caused lots of grief for folks expecting (rightly so) silky smooth slow-speed operation... something that's ideal for switching operations. As a result, dealers are largely stuck with a bunch of ala-carte 0-8-0 locomotives once the word spread about the BEMC short-cut. Unfortunately, this also affected the Bethlehem Steel "Steel City Switcher" set, which I had my eye on... but was waiting for a super-sale to grab one. Once I heard about the slow-speed operation problems though, I RAN from that set as fast as I could.
David
You have a point Dave, I have a friend who purchased the latest 0-8-0 in the hopes of lashing it up with the earlier 0-8-0 switcher that had the early modular legacy. The new switcher has no slow capability at all let alone lashing it up to anything.
i think it was Jon at Lionel who apologized for the firmware not giving better slower speed performance with those AF boards but that doesn't make up fo the fact Lionel cataloging these engines as legacy and not delivering as advertised. Also for not having some kind of recall program to fix the issue. These engine in my opinion are defective. Big black eye on Lionel for this, not making it right.
this is something I wish Notch 6 would ask Lionel in his next pod cast, ask what the heck were you thinking.
D500 posted:"And no, the Mogul will not have the BEMC. As stated before, no O scale Legacy engine will again. Either the RCMC fits in or it won't be made."
Yeah, I know that this is not the "Controls" Forum, but, quick and dirty, what do BEMC and RCMC mean? And why is it important? I'm still in TMCC-world, mostly...
The BEMC is the Legacy board for the American Flyer Legacy engines. It doesn't have the ability to speed match other Legacy engines (I.E. it cannot be put into a lash-up) and the speed control also cannot be tuned as finely. The RCMC has everything.
this is something I wish Notch 6 would ask Lionel in his next pod cast, ask what the heck were you thinking.
Well you'd have to ask a former employee why the decision was made. Jon may have taken the blame, but he highly advised against it before it was done. The advise was not heeded. This is all I'll say about it. It is something that really bothers me.
Rocky Mountaineer posted:Looks like ALL the 21" passenger cars are currently scheduled to ship from Lionel in the SAME month: December
They will all be put in the same container. Not very economical to ship partial containers.
David, you're late!!!
Rocky Mountaineer posted:... Looks like ALL the 21" passenger cars are currently scheduled to ship from Lionel in the SAME month: December...
David
Yeah...we'll see...
Dave Olson posted:SJC posted:More time to save for that CV Mogul.......and more websites to scout out to order one when it shows up (and assuming it isn't a repeat of the Lionmaster A, 0-8-0, etc, etc, etc)
The Moguls are already on the water with the AC-9, LC+ Mikado, and E8 along with a ton of rolling stock. I for one feel we're shipping stuff pretty well this year.
And no, the Mogul will not have the BEMC. As stated before, no O scale Legacy engine will again. Either the RCMC fits in or it won't be made.
Thank you, Dave. Glad to see the manufacturers here giving us the latest info.
Would September, per the shipping schedule, be reasonable to expect dealers to have them? Theoretically, I could have one in my hands in Mid-September? This would be my first Legacy engine purchase.
Thanks!
And freedom cars show 21 inch not 18 as stated they would be made at.
Dave Olson posted:D500 posted:"And no, the Mogul will not have the BEMC. As stated before, no O scale Legacy engine will again. Either the RCMC fits in or it won't be made."
Yeah, I know that this is not the "Controls" Forum, but, quick and dirty, what do BEMC and RCMC mean? And why is it important? I'm still in TMCC-world, mostly...
The BEMC is the Legacy board for the American Flyer Legacy engines. It doesn't have the ability to speed match other Legacy engines (I.E. it cannot be put into a lash-up) and the speed control also cannot be tuned as finely. The RCMC has everything.
this is something I wish Notch 6 would ask Lionel in his next pod cast, ask what the heck were you thinking.
Well you'd have to ask a former employee why the decision was made. Jon may have taken the blame, but he highly advised against it before it was done. The advise was not heeded. This is all I'll say about it. It is something that really bothers me.
Rocky Mountaineer posted:Looks like ALL the 21" passenger cars are currently scheduled to ship from Lionel in the SAME month: DecemberThey will all be put in the same container. Not very economical to ship partial containers.
Thanks for your candor Dave 
Any updates on the USRA Mikes?
OK I am confused about the 0-8-0 switchers using the BEMC board. I have the Legacy B6 0-6-0 switcher which can crawl around our club layout at speed step 1 for hours without stalling. The B6 in my opinion is probably the best switcher ever produced in 3 rail. So I am guessing it has a RCMC board. Here is my question how can the RCMC fit in a 0-6-0 and not fit in a 0-8-0? I am assuming the 0-6-0 is smaller.
JohnB
Peter Araujo posted:Any updates on the USRA Mikes?
They're on the updated shipping list. October I think
JohnB posted:OK I am confused about the 0-8-0 switchers using the BEMC board. I have the Legacy B6 0-6-0 switcher which can crawl around our club layout at speed step 1 for hours without stalling. The B6 in my opinion is probably the best switcher ever produced in 3 rail. So I am guessing it has a RCMC board. Here is my question how can the RCMC fit in a 0-6-0 and not fit in a 0-8-0? I am assuming the 0-6-0 is smaller.
JohnB
Exactly. I don't think it was purely a decision based on real estate, because the PRIOR production run of 0-8-0's had the RCMC board if I'm not mistaken. That's precisely why folks were so caught off guard by last year's version of 0-8-0's. The use of the BEMC board turned out to be a very unpopular decision for a locomotive that came with such a premium price tag.
By the way, those Legacy B6's are GREAT locomotives... so great that I bought an extra one and decided I'll redecorate it in Bethlehem Steel livery rather than buy one of last year's handicapped 0-8-0's.
David
Dave Olson posted:....Rocky Mountaineer posted:Looks like ALL the 21" passenger cars are currently scheduled to ship from Lionel in the SAME month: DecemberThey will all be put in the same container. Not very economical to ship partial containers.
Oh I don't doubt that, Dave. But it's still somewhat crazy (i.e., ironic, humorous, fill in whatever choice of adjective strikes you) to think that over 2+ years worth of 21" passenger cars (featured in multiple catalogs) are ALL being shipped at the same time. 
I wasn't suggesting that Lionel ship partial containers. There's PLENTY of "other" product that needs to ship by year-end 2017, so I'm sure Lionel could have filled a container with other SKU's if push-came-to-shove.
But it was predictable!
David
Dave Olson - I don't see the 82726 Lionel Lines Alco FA Passenger Set (Postwar remake) on the shipping list. Is it still a viable product?
Thanks.
jUst looked at Lionel Shipping Schedule.Looks like the U. P. StationSounds diner car will be a Christmas present from me to me!! Scheduled to ship in December, but we will see.
If it shows in December, it will most likely find its way to you after New Years. It's happened time and time again, but never fear having a new toy in January isn't all bad! Gives you a 2nd round after Christmas....
Jim
Dave Warburton posted:Dave Olson - I don't see the 82726 Lionel Lines Alco FA Passenger Set (Postwar remake) on the shipping list. Is it still a viable product?
Thanks.
dave I saw that also,,,wonder whats up with that?
Jim Sandman posted:If it shows in December, it will most likely find its way to you after New Years. It's happened time and time again, ...
Most likely scenario, but ya never know. Lionel has been known to receive multiple Chinese shipments in Nov/Dec. And keep in mind, those items typically have a DOM date of August/September. So we're getting very close to the point where Lionel should know very soon what's REALLY gonna get here by year-end 2017. If it's not made by the end of next month, we probably won't see it in 2017 unless shipping is expedited.
Then again, ya can't help but wonder how many of these shipping schedule dates are just placeholders. With just a few months remaining, Lionel stateside should already have a decent handle on those items that are gonna arrive this year vs. those that are goona slip into 2018. In particular, we were told the cool Theatre Cars probably wouldn't make it this year, and yet now they're showing up with a Dec 2017 date on the latest list. Is that realistic? Or just wishful thinking? My bet is still 2018 for those puppies.
David
Looks like Lionel is getting caught up going into next year...also appears the last few engines were received well..hoping that trend continues and looking forward to the next catalog
I hope some of you end of the year gloom and doom folks budget your necessity finances better than your train purchases. I've said it before these cars are overdue. Not really a surprise. You should already have the funds for these. If you don't, as much as you want to, you can't blame Lionel for your poor train budgeting.
dk122trains posted:And freedom cars show 21 inch not 18 as stated they would be made at.
They will be the correct length based on car. 21" Passenger Car is just the category these fall under.
Peter Araujo posted:Any updates on the USRA Mikes?
These are on the water.
Dave Warburton posted:Dave Olson - I don't see the 82726 Lionel Lines Alco FA Passenger Set (Postwar remake) on the shipping list. Is it still a viable product?
Thanks.
These will probably be very close to end of year if they make the year. Might actually be January. We ran into a few issues with the LC+ FA that's delaying it.
Rocky Mountaineer posted:In particular, we were told the cool Theatre Cars probably wouldn't make it this year, and yet now they're showing up with a Dec 2017 date on the latest list. Is that realistic? Or just wishful thinking? My bet is still 2018 for those puppies.
Not sure where the December date came from. I can guarantee it won't be until next year due to FCC testing.
The new full dome car will be 2018 as well. The tooling on that is massive. All other 21" should make the year.
Phew... keeping me on my toes! 
MartyE posted:I hope some of you end of the year gloom and doom folks budget your necessity finances better than your train purchases. ... If you don't, as much as you want to, you can't blame Lionel for your poor train budgeting.
Who's "blaming" Lionel? It's not their fault. The Chinese factory pretty much produces this stuff when they want to. I was just using the 21" cars as a prime example of the "disconnect" that sometimes occurs between importer's catalog cycles and manufacturer's production schedules. There's no doom-and-gloom about it. Stuff like this happens every year, and folks get whalloped in December. We should be accustomed to it by now.
Personally, I don't have a dog in this race regarding 21" passenger cars, per se. I only have the AFT pre-ordered, and most of that train should consist of 18" cars anyway -- despite what's listed on the latest shipping schedule -- since the display cars were reportedly built on baggage car dimensions. I might purchase the Penn Central 21" set if it's as colorful as depicted in the catalog, but we'll see what's actually delivered. Aside from those two sets, the 21" car-lengths are not my preference. But I do know a few folks who have 3 or 4 of these 21" sets pre-ordered, so December will be a big month for them.
David
I stand by my statement. There are always folks who will try to blame Lionel or any manufacturer / importer for that matter on the fact they didn't prepare.
Dave W, thanks for starting this post! I Am looking forward to the 5 Star General, I probably wanted one when I was 5, should be a lot of fun. I will give it a big test when the UP 21 inch passenger cars come in.
Since the Mikados are on water, I don't know why the shipping schedule says "Oct. 2017".
Dave Olson posted:dk122trains posted:And freedom cars show 21 inch not 18 as stated they would be made at.
They will be the correct length based on car. 21" Passenger Car is just the category these fall under.
Peter Araujo posted:Any updates on the USRA Mikes?
These are on the water.
Dave Warburton posted:Dave Olson - I don't see the 82726 Lionel Lines Alco FA Passenger Set (Postwar remake) on the shipping list. Is it still a viable product?
Thanks.
These will probably be very close to end of year if they make the year. Might actually be January. We ran into a few issues with the LC+ FA that's delaying it.
Rocky Mountaineer posted:In particular, we were told the cool Theatre Cars probably wouldn't make it this year, and yet now they're showing up with a Dec 2017 date on the latest list. Is that realistic? Or just wishful thinking? My bet is still 2018 for those puppies.Not sure where the December date came from. I can guarantee it won't be until next year due to FCC testing.
The new full dome car will be 2018 as well. The tooling on that is massive. All other 21" should make the year.
Phew... keeping me on my toes!
Thanks for the update on the FA set, Dave. I appreciate it.
Dave,
I don't see 6-83801 (Hanukkah Box Car) on the list. Do you have a ship date for that boxcar?
Thanks in advance.
Peter Araujo posted:Since the Mikados are on water, I don't know why the shipping schedule says "Oct. 2017".
Think about it. Today is August 16th. There's a lot of ocean between Lionel's Chinese factory and Lionel's warehouse in North Carolina. And these ships don't exactly move at lightning speed. I've often noted over on Atlas-O's website that there's typically a 7-week lag between their "container ship dates" and the "Atlas-O ships to dealers dates". So if Lionel has a similar shipping/processing/distribution time, then 7 weeks could easily put us into October (especially if the container ship just left China).
Then there's the time it takes your dealer to receive inventory and turn it around for shipment to our homes. Figure another week for that.
It's amazing how 2 months just gets chewed up in shipping. That's why I commented earlier that we're probably pretty close (i.e., perhaps sometime in September or early October at the absolute latest) to the date by which stuff needs to be manufactured if we're gonna see it in our hands by year-end 2017.
David
Rocky Mountaineer posted:Then there's the time it takes your dealer to receive inventory and turn it around for shipment to our homes. Figure another week for that.
David
Or an afternoon at Nassau Hobby.
Rocky Mountaineer posted:JohnB posted:OK I am confused about the 0-8-0 switchers using the BEMC board. I have the Legacy B6 0-6-0 switcher which can crawl around our club layout at speed step 1 for hours without stalling. The B6 in my opinion is probably the best switcher ever produced in 3 rail. So I am guessing it has a RCMC board. Here is my question how can the RCMC fit in a 0-6-0 and not fit in a 0-8-0? I am assuming the 0-6-0 is smaller.
JohnB
Exactly. I don't think it was purely a decision based on real estate, because the PRIOR production run of 0-8-0's had the RCMC board if I'm not mistaken. That's precisely why folks were so caught off guard by last year's version of 0-8-0's. The use of the BEMC board turned out to be a very unpopular decision for a locomotive that came with such a premium price tag.
By the way, those Legacy B6's are GREAT locomotives... so great that I bought an extra one and decided I'll redecorate it in Bethlehem Steel livery rather than buy one of last year's handicapped 0-8-0's.
David
If you take the time to find the old thread where Jon talks about this he gave a reason for the BEMC being in the 0-8-0's. It was component availability, which was the same reason Legacy command sets were missing for a while. If you work in the consumer electronics world for any length of time you'll run into this issue. You design a board with what is there at the time, and it goes into production. After a while the electronics component manufacture discontinues an item you were using in your circuit. There isn't a direct replacement, or there is and it's a different pin out or size. So you have to redesign the PCBA to either use the different component or add circuity that does the same function that the one item did before, or that allows the new item to fit in. Now the PCBA is bigger and no longer fits where it is needed.
Did Lionel make a poor choice in using the BEMC without getting a feel of the market? I think they did, but as Dave has pointed out, Lionel learned from that poor choice. I am sad to see him say Lionel will never put it in a "Legacy" locomotive again. I think there is a market for putting it in LC+ locomotives so that they can have the great sounds and be able to be run by the Cab-2 handheld. I'd buy a bunch of non-scale "Legacy" steamers.
