Midwestern Modelworks - surpasses all models to date!

Butch   GK has not had Mr lee as a builder for at least 2 years, and will never have him again.this is where all the BS started with George and his builders or lack of a builder.

My Challenger (last steam loco GK imported) was the first and last KOH's purchase for me. The model is stunning, but I don't like having a "deposit" and "progression payments" tied up in a model that took 7 years to deliver.  Too much can happen in 7 years. 

I heard rumors about this parting, but also heard rumors only half the Challenger order was paid for and delivered. I've never seen a word about that anywhere on the internet and can't imagine any customer who didn't get his Challenger not going viral....I would.  Also, I've never seen a KOH's Challenger offered  for sale on the secondary market.....where did they go?  

I can say, I accepted a substitute road number (after waiting 7 years) when GK informed me my chosen number wasn't in the correct box that arrived from Korea in the fall of 2013. During the conversation he told me only half the order was coming before Christmas 2013 and the other half in early 2014 due to Christmas merchandise shipments consuming the traffic from the orient. When I mentioned this to some other importers they laughed and said models of this value are shipped via air freight and the only hassle with shipments from the orient during the holidays had to do with ocean containers. So, armed with this information, I accepted the model GK offered and closed the book on that life experience.....I won't go through that again. 

Butch

I am currently putting the finishing touches on three "doorstop" Challengers.  I hope someday to be able to study one of these elusive Kohs Challengers - not that I would ever pursue details to that extent.  Does it run well?

up148 posted:

Butch   GK has not had Mr lee as a builder for at least 2 years, and will never have him again.this is where all the BS started with George and his builders or lack of a builder.

My Challenger (last steam loco GK imported) was the first and last KOH's purchase for me. The model is stunning, but I don't like having a "deposit" and "progression payments" tied up in a model that took 7 years to deliver.  Too much can happen in 7 years. 

I heard rumors about this parting, but also heard rumors only half the Challenger order was paid for and delivered. I've never seen a word about that anywhere on the internet and can't imagine any customer who didn't get his Challenger not going viral....I would.  Also, I've never seen a KOH's Challenger offered  for sale on the secondary market.....where did they go?  

I can say, I accepted a substitute road number (after waiting 7 years) when GK informed me my chosen number wasn't in the correct box that arrived from Korea in the fall of 2013. During the conversation he told me only half the order was coming before Christmas 2013 and the other half in early 2014 due to Christmas merchandise shipments consuming the traffic from the orient. When I mentioned this to some other importers they laughed and said models of this value are shipped via air freight and the only hassle with shipments from the orient during the holidays had to do with ocean containers. So, armed with this information, I accepted the model GK offered and closed the book on that life experience.....I won't go through that again. 

 

Butch

Butch  thanks you for posting this.  I have been telling people for many years how he works and they simply will not listen to fact. You still have your dia hards that will wait, and stress GK has always come thru.

Years ago there was another Kohs model company importing models. Any one remember Fine Art Models that was GK brother in crime. High end models next to no delivery and always excuses. I was at O scale west last year. Had tables right across the isle from GK,

I have never herd so much hog wash coming out of someones mouth while trying to promote"The Finest in O scale". It was 3 days of in credible denial.

All other major players in brass imports really know whats going on with him and his builders, reason all the builders talk to each other and will not touch him. This is why he continually has to keep searching to find a new one. And then its back to the same old dadadadadadadadadadadada. from GK.

Bill

Ive been emailing Eric back and forth today and he seems like a real solid guy. He may pull me into the 2 rail side. I was wrong in my price point. The models are $2700 each and the deposit is $950. Now he has me wanting one. Ive always loved the SD45 and since im a CNW fan they are pretty interesting without the dynamic brake blisters

Nicely done Matt.  2-rail is calling your name... 

As I understand it the next 1/3 of the payment will be due when the models go into production.  Erik is still reviewing all the drawings for all the details of the different variations and is behind his own schedule.  I think he said when all is said and done there will something like 50+ individual versions when including all the different details.  Those of us with reservations are probably looking forward to that request because that means that milestone has been reached.

Matt.  CNW with or without the winterization hatch? 

Maybe, I thought he was insane building a $10,000 model. We both got a good chuckle out of that one. I may attend the March Meet in Chicago and see whats what with the 2 rail rivet counters. I may be pulled to the dark side

March Meet is a great way to see what's out there in 2-rail. I missed it last year but I'm booked up for this year. If you can make it, try to take in some of the layout tours as well. You'll know pretty quickly if you're going to get hooked...  

Well, it gets cold in MN and I'm a big fan of winter, but I like fall scenery so no hatch

The title of this thread still bugs me

Matt Makens posted:

The title of this thread still bugs me

Same here!

Matt Makens posted:

Well, it gets cold in MN and I'm a big fan of winter, but I like fall scenery so no hatch

I agree, so if you decide to reserve one just make sure it is the one without the hatch.  The chance that there will be a correct one available after the wrong one is received is right around nil.

It will be less than nil since only one guy ordered the CNW version

Matt Makens posted:

It will be less than nil since only one guy ordered the CNW version

I believe the minimum per rd name/model was relatively low if he is talking 50+ versions to be built perhaps one more reservation would be sufficient to get your version built.just saying!

The minimum order per road name is 3 to be produced. If  the road does not appear on the current list it will not be available. Only orders for current models will be taken. I wish Matt you could have been on the dark side a little earlier.

Stephen

Welcome Matt.

I have been blown away by folks who are demanding MMW quality (or Key, or GK) for models that run on tinplate track.  I have always been semi-baffled by the fact that we have the wrong track gauge, and if I was any good at track laying I would probably give up 17/64 and go Proto-48.

You might want to start with something inexpensive and a loop of 2-rail track.  Tread widths of .115 are not for toy trains - they require serious modeling skills.

I'm not going to run these on my layout, I've got a 15 X 58 3 rail layout and that's not going anywhere. I'm thinking I'll run it on the museum/club layout when it gets rebuilt

Matt Makens posted:

It will be less than nil since only one guy ordered the CNW version

 

Matt Makens posted:

Well, it gets cold in MN and I'm a big fan of winter, but I like fall scenery so no hatch

So one person must have ordered one of each of 3 different numbers to meet the 3 minimum.  He'd probably be happy to find out he is not the only person interested in CNW.  Or maybe, like me, he ordered the minimum of 3 to get them done and will put one or more up for sale when they arrive.

And they are available in .145 OW5 and .115 OW5 and P48, same price.  The biggest visual difference is between the .145 and the .115 treadwidth.  The P48 and OW5 .115 wheels have the same width between the side frames; between 1/8 and 1/4" narrower than the .145. 

That to me would be one giant advantage of Proto-48 - the sideframes would be inset by more than a sixteenth of an inch compared to a 5' gauge truck with .115 wheelsets.  My 1 1/8" gauge railroad has the sideframes inboard a full 1/8" from their O Scale cousins on the next loop.

The big difference - going to correct track gauge - is the look of the track with respect to the model.  You really can see it.

For me, the advantages of P48 or S7 here is scale wheel and tire profile along with great looking point work or switches. You are right in that narrower trucks look way better too.

I can't wait to see these models released... So he can move on to the next one, and the next one, until he gets to something small enough that I would be interested in

bob2 posted:

...

The big difference - going to correct track gauge - is the look of the track with respect to the model.  You really can see it.

You're right there.  That ~1/16" makes a huge difference to me.

It is amazing just how much compromise has been made to accommodate that small gauge difference.  Pushing the sideframes out itself has brought us raised frames and to a small extent even swinging pilots are a result of pushed out truck sideframes interfering with pilots.

Being a 3 rail guy I'm sick of the crappy pilots and the weird height between the frame and the trucks. They look ridiculous, but I never thought the 1/16 of an inch would matter that much. I'm gonna have to see it.

A sixteenth is giant when you are trying to go around curves.  The trailing truck might hit the tailbeam sooner on a Proto-48 model.  The big grabber is appearance - 3-railers would not put up with a sixteenth difference in car height; i personally do not put up with it when I build models.

A steam model drivers stick way out.  MTH solves part of that by drilling piston holes well off center.

It is too bad we got off to a bad start.  I cannot believe that Q Gauge did not gain favor in the beginning.  It had to do with inertia, I guess, and G Gauge has pretty much the same problem.

Bump since Erik was in Indy and a pleasure to chat with.

Of course I asked again about the L-window Demos and he said that the L-window cab will be made but the demo will not be offered since there was a lack of interest.

Anybody else interested in a demo?  

Hot Water posted:

Matt Makens posted:

The title of this thread still bugs me

Same here!

Make it three of us! The models may very well be superb (I hope they are), but until the first model is delivered, I think it is a bit premature to hold a coronation.

I'm from Missouri!

Simon

You have to admit it is one of the most interesting.

Maybe the "surpasses all models to date" simply means these locomotives will have high speed gearing and will run faster than other models.

Opinion.

bob2 posted:

You have to admit it is one of the most interesting.

and provides endless entertainment value......

Hey now, dont poke the bear

Matt Makens posted:

Hey now, dont poke the bear

Good times! 

The seriousness of brass trains is no joking matter

bob2 posted:

You have to admit it is one of the most interesting.

I liken this to all the threads regarding the approach of the York TCA show.......and speaking of shows, I don't see much scuttlebutt regarding the recent "Brass Expo"

Simon

I do not believe it was that well attended although the promoters may have been satisfied with attendance, and a majority of those who were there are not likely to be on this forum. Only a few importers are still "talking" potential models in O scale. JMO

Matt Makens posted:

The seriousness of brass trains is no joking matter

Point taken,

hibar posted:

I do not believe it was that well attended although the promoters may have been satisfied with attendance, and a majority of those who were there are not likely to be on this forum. Only a few importers are still "talking" potential models in O scale. JMO

I'm guessing there might be a bit more discussion out there in HO land. The real tale will be told if there is another one next year.

As for Importers talking potential models, I obviously DON'T understand the market what with two different Big Boys in the works. After you get past the size, I think they're boring.

Simon

Simon Winter posted:

....I obviously DON'T understand the market what with two different Big Boys in the works. After you get past the size....

I would have though it pretty obvious - they are popular with older folks compensating for other inadequacies......

Down here we all float!!!!

Matt Makens posted:

Down here we all float!!!!

Everyone's full of hot air??  Interesting.

Ive always wanted full scale O big boy since I was a little kid. Now that I am a little kid with the means I got one, I dont need any more. I'm happy I got my big boy but wouldn't get another.