MTH 260E VS 263E Clearance Issues

Not sure what the Atlas switches are like, but prewar trains in general do not do well on modern switches (in particular the wheel flanges going through the frogs).  My first layout used Gargraves track with Ross switches, which did not work out with all of my prewar engines due to the thickness of the wheel flanges.  I eventually got rid of all of the switches on my layout and after 25 years, got rid of the Gargraves track and went back to tubular track. 

I have a mix of tube rail and gargraves both track and switches.   I haven't had the issues you are talking about but the switches are o72.  However in general,  yes 260e and 263e locomotives are huge!

Is it possible that the 260e and 263e have different size drivers?  Or, is it possible that the Atlas O switches have different depth at the frog depending on the switch size. Now that I think about it, it seems to be localized on an O36 switch.

When designing my layout, my "yardstick" for clearance was a 260E. Those steam chests are very wide!

As for switches, if you're having trouble with Atlas, I'd stay away from every brand except for the old K Line Super snap. I have over 30 of them on my layout and tinplate locos like the 260 and 263 roll right through them. I suppose the other option might be to see if you can find a machine shop to reduce the flange depth.

Supersnap or Ross plate seem to have the least amount of trouble.

I tried a pair of "Rossplate" #4 switches and everything--I mean everything--modern and prewar--derailed going through them, so I returned them. It was disappointing as I really wanted #4s to form my crossovers and wanted to buy American and support a forum sponsor, but no such luck.

I ended up trying to modify Supersnap O72 switches to tighten-up the center-rail distance between mainlines when using them for crossovers. It involves cutting and a little soldering, but the end result is worth it as the track distance is almost as tight as it is using #4s, and it didn't affect performance at all. At some point I'll post a thread showing what I did. It has worked really well.

Double checked, and my 263E driver flanges are definately larger than that on the 260E.  They bottom out on the Atlas switch at the frog.  Why, oh why, would MTH make two different size drivers for these VERY similar tinplate reproductions.  Ok, maybe they were trying to be true to the original, but you'd think the QC guys would have checked if they would successfully navigate one of the most popular track systems in the hobby.  I'm left with; replacing the wheels, grinding them down, replacing the switches, or grinding the frog deeper.  Any other ideas while I pull out what little hair I have left?

Finally got a good micrometer.  The 263 drivers are 41.09 mm diameter (measured from edge of flange).  The 260 is 38.08 mm.  As I don't see pulling all my Atlas switches off the layout as a viable option, I'm seriously thinking of breaking out the Dremel and grinding the flanges on the 263.  Somebody stop me!  Better idea?

@Al H. posted:

Finally got a good micrometer.  The 263 drivers are 41.09 mm diameter (measured from edge of flange).  The 260 is 38.08 mm.  As I don't see pulling all my Atlas switches off the layout as a viable option, I'm seriously thinking of breaking out the Dremel and grinding the flanges on the 263.  Somebody stop me!  Better idea?

I would stop.  I am not sure but I believe the tinplate wheel construction is basically stamped metal over a hub, not solid.  If you try to remove a millimeter and a half per side you may end up splitting the rims.

John Z.

I have a PS3 260e and a PS2 256 electric. I also use Atlas track and switches. The 260e rides through the Atlas switches perfectly but the 256 clatters through the switch frogs. No derailments but a pretty rough ride. The 256 definitely has deeper flanges than the 260e so its my guess that around the time MTH upgraded to PS3 electronics they also reduced the driver flange diameter. Short of replacing the drivers with newer versions I doubt if there is much that can be done.

Ken

kanawha,

I'd be willing to bet you have 41.09 mm drivers, as that is the exact symptom I have.  My 263 will navigate the atlas switches, but visibly rumbles through them.

I am amazed MTH would allow this to happen.  As someone with "Quality" in my title for more years than I'd like to mention, I can assure you that this is a clean miss.  Quality = fitness for use; and the only one entitled to put that word on a product is the one who pays for it.

End of Rant.  Still love MTH products.