Multiple manufacturers on the same layout - does it work?

Atlas, Lionel, and MTH cars work well together. I'm a Lionel guy, but I do have one piece of MTH rolling stock. Atlas uses Lionel TMCC in their 3 rail locos. The only locos you would not be able to run in command mode with Legacy/TMCC are MTH DCS locos. ERR upgrades are expensive, but it is possible to switch an older MTH or older conventional loco to TMCC. I would not recommend putting ERR boards in MTH PS2/PS3 DCS-equipped locos unless you want to spend a lot more money. I'm no expert. Maybe someone else knows.

True 1:48 scale items from different manufacturers will look OK together.  They may have different level of details, but if they are truly scale and they are models of the same thing (for example a 40 foot box car) they will look more or less the same.  But many O gauge items are not true 1:48 scale so you need to know what you are getting.  Even within the same manufacturer, rolling stock may not look good together.  For example, a Railking TOFC does not look good with a Premier TOFC.

As for engines, you asked if it’s practical to convert engines.  It depends on how much you want it.  I have a few Williams scale GG1s that were converted to DCS.  Not really practical, but I wanted something that would run on O42 curves and MTH GG1s require O72.  If you are looking at getting more than one MTH engine, it might be more practical (cost wise) to get the DCS system instead of converting them all to run on the Lionel system.

@Dylan the Train Man posted:

Atlas, Lionel, and MTH cars work well together. I'm a Lionel guy, but I do have one piece of MTH rolling stock. Atlas uses Lionel TMCC in their 3 rail locos.

@Lehigh74 posted:

True 1:48 scale items from different manufacturers will look OK together.  They may have different level of details, but if they are truly scale and they are models of the same thing (for example a 40 foot box car) they will look more or less the same.  But many O gauge items are not true 1:48 scale so you need to know what you are getting.  Even within the same manufacturer, rolling stock may not look good together.

I had no idea Atlas used TMCC - that is great to know, thank you! I had a feeling 1:48 scale items should work together, but sometimes shortcuts get taken for one reason or another. Great to know scale items should blend well. And I know about not buying things in 1:48 - learned that the hard way!

@Dylan the Train Man posted:

ERR upgrades are expensive, but it is possible to switch an older MTH or older conventional loco to TMCC. I would not recommend putting ERR boards in MTH PS2/PS3 DCS-equipped locos unless you want to spend a lot more money. I'm no expert. Maybe someone else knows.

@Lehigh74 posted:

As for engines, you asked if it’s practical to convert engines.  It depends on how much you want it.  I have a few Williams scale GG1s that were converted to DCS.  Not really practical, but I wanted something that would run on O42 curves and MTH GG1s require O72.  If you are looking at getting more than one MTH engine, it might be more practical (cost wise) to get the DCS system instead of converting them all to run on the Lionel system.

It sounds like ERR upgrades are more of an undertaking than I originally estimated. I'll keep that in mind as I shop around. Thanks so much for the info!

All of the major manufacturers have made items that are in slightly different scales.  They'll all couple together and run on the same track, but they'll look goofy when they're next to each other.

Choosing among control systems is tough - so many to choose from, and changes are occurring rapidly - battery/dead rail/radio control is coming.  I'm not a gloom-and-doomer about DCS, but getting started in it right now would be a challenge due to the availability (or lack) of components.  The idea of buying a loco from one manufacturer and converting it to another's control system requires deep pockets, especially if it's being done to a whole fleet.

Are there TCA / LCCA / LOTS members or an O-gauge club in your area?  It's a challenge right now to make contact with folks, but this can be a source of help.  If you're lucky enough to have a local hobby shop with an operating layout, this can also be an opportunity to see equipment from different manufacturers in action. 

You'll also find that there is a wide range of opinions regarding scale and control systems. 

When TMCC (Lionel, TrainMaster Command Control) became available,  early 1990's, the SAW group emerged. Sunset (Thirdrail), Atlas, and Weaver. There was a license agreement for generic TMCC electronic board components, that were installed in the SAW group locomotives/units.   Weaver is gone, but there is still a lot of second-hand Weaver product.  I always liked Weaver.  One of my best Weaver imports, Canadian Pacific  Hudson.

Atlas O scale, a little different, only ever did one steam locomotive, with limited success.  Most of their diesels, work well.  Sunset, more of a high end market.

Enjoy the hobby.   Mike CT.

  I'm going through this issue as well.  MTH has made many more products in my layout's road names than Lionel, but I use Lionel's command system.  

  Through asking here I've learned that MTH products run just fine using a Lionel Powermaster to operate them conventionally.  You'll have access to the most commonly used features- speed, direction, couplers, horn, bell etc.       If it's a PS2/3 locomotive, you'll have its constant speed control too  (Odyssey in Lionel vernacular)  

  I'm waiting to see what happens with new DCS production,  or the current prices on stock that's available to descend out of the upper stratosphere before purchasing any MTH command products.  

Tom

I run the gambit of everything. I have bought from all the manufacturers. Engines and rolling stock. Early on I decided to use TMCC then I added DCS. When Legacy came out I added that. With my layouts I made sure that I could run conventional, TMCC, DCS and Legacy. As to rolling stock I have bought Lionel, KLine, Weaver, MTH, Atlas and Menards. I have had no problems running all these together...............Paul 2

Beyond the electronics, I feel like 3rd rail is kind of on its own, while they make beautiful products, the minimum radius of O72 for many of their products is not really correct out of the box and will require larger.  I have not experienced that with any other 3 rail o gauge manufacture where their engine would not run reliably on O-72 minimum radius.

For the electronics, I use the DCS system interfaced to the Lionel TMCC command base.  It allows me to run any 3 rail engine with DCS or TMCC/legacy.   Mth sells a cable to connect together.  As stated above, many of engines from atlas/weaver/Kline/3rdRail run on TMCC.  The TMCC base can be had for significant amount cheaper then a Legacy base, but you would loose access to some of the Legacy features.  The issue with this approach now is the recent announcement on MTH closing up leaveing MTH DCS community waiting to see what the future of DCS will be.  

Not all Atlas/ Weaver/ Kline/ 3rdRail /MTH-Railking have the ability to be controlled through a remote, as many of their initial offerings did not have this functionality and were only run by varying the voltage to the track.

Let's see, at one time I've had Legacy, TMCC, MTH DCS, and LionChief + all running at once, I guess you can mix and match.  I have a variety of manufacturers stuff, and I'm a 98% command kind of guy.

It seems from your original post that you are getting started and already know and like Lionel and LC+/LC+2.0. I think you can't go wrong with sticking with that for a while until you determine what you truly love about your trains and layout.

I've been involved with the hobby for over 65 years, grew up with Lionel Postwar, had a ZW in my hands by the age of three, and now am enamoured with LC+/LC+2.0 and MTH, as well as Lionel Postwar.

After all these years, yesterday I bought the MTH DCS Remote Control Set and the DCS Explorer because I want to be able to run my MTH Ptoto 2 and 3 engines like my LC+/LC+2.0  engines, and I didn't want to lose the ability to do that because those DCS systems may not be available in the near future due to the fact that MTH may be going out of business.

So, it all depends on what really turns you on about the hobby and your perspective.

One more thing, my friend: IMO, you are now in the best place in the World, which is this Forum, for asking questions and getting information about The Greatest Hobby in the World. Arnold

I have most all the makes from conventional to command. Seem to look good. Like  someone said the detail on some more detailed.  I'm running Atlas right now. Be very careful handling them high detail can be broken off,my big hands! It's what you like. William's seem to run forever never replaced traction tire. I've run 30- 40 car trains with 2 William's powered just less detailing.

1:48 is 1:48, and all the importers' scale models are just that - scale, and compatible. Lionel, MTH and Williams have offered "sub-scale" items that are not intended to be 1:48. These can - but do not always - look odd next to the O scale (1:48) items. Lionel calls them "Traditional" and MTH called them RailKing.

Theoretically all the 3RO stuff works with all the other 3RO stuff, of course. Wouldn't make much sales sense otherwise. There are cases where certain tolerances at certain times can lead to a bad combo, but that's bound to happen. These things are made to go together.

I am not a brand-loyal kind of guy. I use TMCC because I prefer it, but not because it's Lionel. I have several converted-to-TMCC MTH (and others) locos. Every brand is on my layout, plus numerous old 2RO cars that I have converted to 3RO trucks and/or wheels and couplers.

@0-Gauge CJ posted:

I had no idea Atlas used TMCC - that is great to know, thank you! I had a feeling 1:48 scale items should work together, but sometimes shortcuts get taken for one reason or another. Great to know scale items should blend well. And I know about not buying things in 1:48 - learned that the hard way!

It sounds like ERR upgrades are more of an undertaking than I originally estimated. I'll keep that in mind as I shop around. Thanks so much for the info!

Aldo keep in mind regardless of tmcc/dcs,/ legacy equipped locos, everything runs conventionally. You may not have all the command features such as activating crew talk, turning on/ of lights, etc. But the locos will respond to conventional control of turning up or down the transformer and hitting the whistle button.

@Hump Yard Mike posted:

Beyond the electronics, I feel like 3rd rail is kind of on its own, while they make beautiful products, the minimum radius of O72 for many of their products is not really correct out of the box and will require larger.  I have not experienced that with any other 3 rail o gauge manufacture where their engine would not run reliably on O-72 minimum radius.

For the electronics, I use the DCS system interfaced to the Lionel TMCC command base.  It allows me to run any 3 rail engine with DCS or TMCC/legacy.   Mth sells a cable to connect together.  As stated above, many of engines from atlas/weaver/Kline/3rdRail run on TMCC.  The TMCC base can be had for significant amount cheaper then a Legacy base, but you would loose access to some of the Legacy features.  The issue with this approach now is the recent announcement on MTH closing up leaveing MTH DCS community waiting to see what the future of DCS will be.  

That is a real shame about 3rd rail - I was looking at some of the products they've made and they're gorgeous.

I read that DCS and TMCC/Legacy can interface with each other but forgot they could do that. If someone picks up the DCS systems I'd be open to trying to run them together, but I'll hold off until then. I don't want to invest heavily in an unsupported system. Heard good things about it though.

@Arnold D. Cribari posted:

It seems from your original post that you are getting started and already know and like Lionel and LC+/LC+2.0. I think you can't go wrong with sticking with that for a while until you determine what you truly love about your trains and layout.

When I jumped back into the hobby last year, I had bought a few older conventional locos and a LionChief starter set. Once I got batteries in the remote, I was hooked. The freedom to walk around my layout and turn on the bell, whistle, etc. is infinitely preferable leaving myself anchored at a transformer (the location of which is right now at the mercy of wherever a wall outlet is). I have both LC+ and 2.0 engines but strongly prefer 2.0 for it's compatibility with a legacy remote. Also the nicer sounds, 4 chuffs per revolution, and fan-driven smoke are nice My only real problem with LionChief is that the Universal remote only holds three engines. Juggling multiple remotes gets frustrating for me - my brain will forget which hand is controlling which loco, and it is a recipe for switching nightmare. Recently I asked about traditional vs scale collecting and someone said that if I was eyeing scale, I would probably keep looking at and thinking about it. Finally purchased one of Lionel's scale legacy+bluetooth offerings and some 060 track and absolutely love it. I am planning to pick up scale locos for a few roadnames and look at traditional/lionmaster for the others.

@D500 posted:

1:48 is 1:48, and all the importers' scale models are just that - scale, and compatible.

...

There are cases where certain tolerances at certain times can lead to a bad combo, but that's bound to happen. These things are made to go together.

That was my main concern, that a brand might call something scale and then make certain compromises which make it look odd next to other rolling stock that doesn't have the same compromises. It sounds like with true scale items that's not an issue.

Thanks all for your help. I've started looking at Atlas, MTH, and Williams products now. We'll have to see what happens to DCS now. Thanks again for everyone's insight!

@Hump Yard Mike posted:

Beyond the electronics, I feel like 3rd rail is kind of on its own, while they make beautiful products, the minimum radius of O72 for many of their products is not really correct out of the box and will require larger. 

Mike,

Which of your 3rd Rail/Sunset engines require larger than 0-72?

Thank you, John

The classic one I have is a passenger train with a pair of Lionel AAs, and MTH B unit, and Weaver passenger cars. Everything runs harmoniously, with the additional benefit of the paint matching perfectly. (Paint matching is not always the case!)

Chris

LVHR

Certainly it works.

All 3 rail O gauge cars from any manufacturer are compatible. The main difference is in the SCALE  of the car.  Some cars and engines  were deliberately made under sized for use with O-27 sets. I solely buy 1/4 inch scale cars because they look better behind O SCALE engines.  But they will all couple with each other but not look good together based on size difference.

On my home layout I have both DCS  and a Legacy Cab 1L system.  By tethering the Cab 1L to the TIU,  I can run both MTH DCS and TMCC/Legacy  through the DCS handheld. Unfortunately the system does not work in reverse  (DCS through Cab 1L ). I can run any conventional locomotive from any manufacturer through either handheld so long as I make sure the track is set up for conventional running.

Because Lionchief + works off radio control and only needs constant track power you should be able to run both LC+ and DCS on the same track .