Polar Express Disappearing Hobo Car w/Flickering Wood Fire

Nicely done!!!

Big Jim,

It looks great!  That is something I would like to do someday, but it is so far down on the to-do list, it will probably wait until I retire!

Nice, Jim! Does the led light when the coach interior lights are on or does it only light when the hobo appears on the roof?

Very nice, Jim!

Nice job Jim. Could you give us a few hints on how you did that?

ogaugeguy posted:

Nice, Jim! Does the led light when the coach interior lights are on or does it only light when the hobo appears on the roof?

Thank you all.
No, the fire is unlit until the hobo/fire side swings into place and makes contact with the power contacts.

Big Jim posted:

I finally got around to building a fire under my butt and then putting it on top of the "Disappearing Hobo Car" like Lionel should have done in the first place. I used a flickering LED kit that I got from Berkshire Junction a number of years ago when this car first came out. Amazingly, everything fit and worked as planned. The flame is one of those little ornaments that you see on ceramic Christmas trees and the round base is made from Legos. I still need to finish off the looks of the fire bed with some logs around the base, but, I wanted you to see what could be (and what should have been) done with this car. 

 

Sorry but the video shows only a black screen to me...but I'll take you word on it..

A creative project, the results are really nice. 

Dougie fresh posted:

Sorry but the video shows only a black screen to me...but I'll take you word on it..

Doug,
Try this one:

How did you do the wiring and switch?

Really cool - thanks for sharing!

peter

BWRR posted:

How did you do the wiring and switch?

There is no switch, only contacts. There are metal fingers on either side of the rotating roof piece that contact a piece of sheet brass on each side inside of the roof section. These in turn are wired to the PC board mounted on the floor of the car body and the PC board is wired to the lighting system. These brass pieces are held in place by the same screws that hold the pieces that hold the rotating roof in place.

Here is the initial diagram that I drew showing the original idea. This IS NOT a detailed drawing of exactly the way things were made, but, you should be able to get the basic idea of how it works. The fire/light is actually located on the other end of the roof section. Also, wiring from the roof sides to the PC board was done with a mini-connector set so that the entire roof/window piece could be separated from the car body, so, disregard the bottom left sketch.

The tricky part was separating the two halves of the rotating roof section without damaging it in any way! I have looked and have yet to find replacement parts for this roof section, so, beware if you try to attempt this!

good idea, thanks for the info

Waiting for the glue to set up on the firewood, I passed by as the sun was shinning through and lighting up the fire's embers. I used a piece of red foil from a Cella's Chocolate Covered Cherry to try and replicate the fire's embers. The sparkle of the embers got lost in the photo's translation.

I noticed in the new catalog that the PE passenger cars will come with snow on the roofs. They should have done that from the beginning too!

Looks good!!  I agree on the snow!!

Jim,

I recall the thread where we discussed this. I purchased the parts also and didn't do the mod. I liked your contact idea, but got lost in what would work. You certainly have that covered.

Did you cover the wiring and such with styrene or just paint it?

Thanks for bringing this back to life.

I did not cover any of the wiring other than heat-shrink over solder connections. You can't see any wires inside because of the opaque windows. I did tape some wires to the floor just to neaten things up and the PC board was attached with Scotch Mounting Tape. 

One thing to keep in mind is the placement of the PC board. Room inside the car is at a premium because of the rotational arc of the roof section. The PC board would only fit between the two interior light posts, right smack dab in the "Arc's" "No Fly Zone".  In order to avoid a clearance problem,  and due to a tall component on the board, that end of the board had to be mounted as close as possible to one of the light posts. There was also an ugly plastic molding in the center of the car floor that had to be ground flat. Actually, I was thanking my lucky stars that it all worked out.

Thanks, Jim. I should have been more specific...I am asking about the roof section that the hobo is on. The wires to the led from the contacts.

I purchased one of the circuit pens, that paints a conductive line. I haven't tried it yet, but my thinking was that I could paint black over it.

Carl,
I removed the rotating section from the roof and then separated the rotating roof section (be careful and go slow when doing this to avoid damaging the parts) and put the wiring and LED inside. The LED comes up from under and is inside the firebed. I cut small slits in either side on the opposite end from the fire in order for the contacts to come out. These were the phosphor bronze wires that I had mentioned earlier and they had a small loop on one end. This is what contacts the brass plate that I formed on the inside of the roof. I found them on an electrical part display at the hobby shop.

Good luck with that conductive paint. I have an old article showing it was used to light a lantern in a scale figures hand. I'm sure it can used for a lot of other neat things.

Now that is a cool mod.  Nicely done!  BigRail

Thanks, BigJim. It's enough to make me actually use the car. I don't have much faith in the conductive paint.

Hey Big Jim.  Looking to make this conversion myself.  Can you share any more information regarding the flickering LED kit that you got from the “Berkshire junction” and the pc board.  I am a engineer and tinkerer but admittedly am newbie to modifying O’s.  
I have og polar express.  My concern is the voltage coming from the transformer to the led for the fire.  I am assuming it would be 18 vac.  However, I thought most led’s were normal powered by low voltage DC. So I am not sure what I need from an LED and board wise to be safe and also have a long lasting bulb.
Love the diagram by the way.

Trace,

The BJ flickering fire kit was a simple hook up to the track power coming in for the lights. The PC board takes care of everything.

Sorry for the added question did the PC board come with the BJ flickering fire kit or was this a separate item?  If the PC board was separate do you have any info. On it?

I have used these Evans Designs fire kits around my layout.  They are simple to install and can run on AC, DC or DCC 7-19 volts.  This would seem like an ideal hook up for the Hobo Car.

Fire LED Lights | Buy LED Fire Lights & Kits for Models Online – Evan Designs

Great idea and very nice this was resurrected. On my to do list also!

@Trace posted:

Sorry for the added question did the PC board come with the BJ flickering fire kit or was this a separate item?  If the PC board was separate do you have any info. On it?

It is a complete kit ready to install.

I will add that this kit uses only one LED, so, it is no problem fitting it inside.

Thanks for all the input Big Jim and Ron.  I contacted both companies and just based on timing and specific callouts that it works with 18v I ended up ordering fire kits from Evans Design to experiment with.  I ordered the nano, pico, and 1.8mm since I am not sure what will work best.   May try something a bit different.  Thinking of using a small dremel to machine a small area out of the bottom of the existing plastic fire 🔥. Then placing the LED’s in this area and bonding in place.  Hopefully this will keep a bit of the OG design while adding some character.  Concerns are keeping it clean looking and not having it be to bright.  Won’t know until I start experimenting…lol.  Happy Holidays.

Hey Big Jim.  In full build mode now thanks to your valuable info.  Went a bit of a different route.  I found an original Lionel fire 🔥 online.  I took it and poured liquid silicone around it to create a mold.  Once cured I will pull the OF fire 🔥 out. Then I will pour in a 2 part clear resin in the mold and submerge the Evans fire pit nano 3 led in it to cure.

This should make a crystal clear replica of the original fire that will glow with a flicker.  Then I will paint the logs and start the wiring.  
Trace

That sounds great Trace. Keep us posted please.

Latest update …made two clear flames with my mold.  One with nano LEDs and one with 1.8mm LEDs.  Going with the 1.8’s because they give a better glow and flicker.

pictures and video of progress included.  Next up …paint logs, dismantle car/hobo and creating contacts and wiring.

Do you have any tunnels or bridges on your layout?

she’s finished…..logs 🪵 of Translucent fire painted, fire 🔥 mounted, wires run, contacts working….hobo flips and fire lights up on command.  Thx again Big Jim for the concept and Ron for the led source.

Nice job Lad!

Good work on these cars.

It seems funny that Lionel enabled this feature on the RTR hobo car, but not the scale PE car. And, they used the same oversized hobo figure on each. The head of the hobo figure was so high I had to raise my coal tipple to accommodate the bum