Postwar #362 Barrel loader help with problems

I use 6-8 volts only, adjusting the setting as needed on the 1033 that powers my accessories for best operation.

ADCX Rob posted:

I use 6-8 volts only, adjusting the setting as needed on the 1033 that powers my accessories for best operation.

I did cut the voltage, guess I can try to cut it more, however, my car is hooked up to the same voltage and when I cut the voltage down the first time, the car's vibration is cut down where it hardly moves the barrels along the car.

It can be fussy, for sure.

There's a note in my repair manual regarding this accessory...

"Because the vibration depends on the relative motion between the ramp and the base the loader's performance may vary considerably depending on whether the accessory is simply held to the track by means of the track clips provided, or is screwed down to the train board or platform.  Rigid mounting of the Barrel Loader to the train platform should be avoided."

Perhaps there's a clue therein?....

There's another adjustment that can be made...the air gap between the armature  (attached to the ramp) and the vibrator coil (attached to the base), but unless you know that this has been tampered with since its manufacture, I'd try some changes to the mounting rigidity and using different voltages to find an acceptable motion of the barrels.  Adjusting the gap between the armature and coil is not a simple turn of a screw, and (voice of experience) you may consume more beer than originally planned to cope with finding the 'sweet spot' for this gap.

FWIW, of course...

KD

Yes, I read that too, and so the base was not screwed down. The track clips are screwed down, but the base just inserts into the clips, so it is easy to pull up on the loader and take it off the board.  I wonder how the re-issued ones work??

Jeff B. Haertlein posted:

...my car is hooked up to the same voltage and when I cut the voltage down the first time, the car's vibration is cut down where it hardly moves the barrels along the car.

I use a 1019 for the car at track voltage. There's no way they have ever worked well at the same voltage setting.

I wonder if the rectifier is bad. You could put a diode in line and see if that changes anything. 

ADCX Rob posted:

Jeff B. Haertlein posted:

...my car is hooked up to the same voltage and when I cut the voltage down the first time, the car's vibration is cut down where it hardly moves the barrels along the car.

I use a 1019 for the car at track voltage. There's no way they have ever worked well at the same voltage setting.

Yes, I agree. But I already insulated the track sections so the whole operation runs separate from the rest of the siding it is on. I guess I can always re-wire it all and put the trackage live with the rest of the siding. You see, like I did with my coaling station set up, I didn't want to interfere with different transformers and their respective grounds.

David Johnston posted:

I wonder if the rectifier is bad. You could put a diode in line and see if that changes anything. 

There's a rectifier in there somewhere??

I have found depending where on the layout the loader is located the need to place small shims underneath two of the feet improves operation.  This is really a trial and error method.  I use sheet styrene cut in small squares large enough for one of the mounting points to sit on.  Put a hole in the center for the screw holding the loader to the layout to pass through to keep it in place.  Mostly I have had to shim the end where the barrels are I loaded to - near the workman.  You can also tape the styrene to the layout with friction tape, double sided tape etc if the 362 is held in place with the track clips.

i just moved my 362 to another area of the layout this evening.  In the old location a shim definitely was needed.  In the new location it did not need one.

I have found this accessory to be particularity sensitive and sometimes a challenge to get working consistently and smoothly.

Luther

My secret? Well, not really a secret but I took 4 wood screws and inserted into the base holes. Give them a couple of  turns until they grab the top of your layout.  Now start backing off on the screws and playing around until find the optimal setting so to speak. It's all trial and error so give it a shot. This worked well for me.

My 362 has worked perfectly for years.

And as noted above, variable voltage is key. Again, trial and error.

Luther Stanton posted:

I have found depending where on the layout the loader is located the need to place small shims underneath two of the feet improves operation.  This is really a trial and error method.  I use sheet styrene cut in small squares large enough for one of the mounting points to sit on.  Put a hole in the center for the screw holding the loader to the layout to pass through to keep it in place.  Mostly I have had to shim the end where the barrels are I loaded to - near the workman.  You can also tape the styrene to the layout with friction tape, double sided tape etc if the 362 is held in place with the track clips.

i just moved my 362 to another area of the layout this evening.  In the old location a shim definitely was needed.  In the new location it did not need one.

I have found this accessory to be particularity sensitive and sometimes a challenge to get working consistently and smoothly.

Luther

Funny you should mention shims. Last night before I gave up, I placed a wood shim under the end with the man/barrel platform. It sort of worked better, maybe I am going in the right direction. Thanks.

johnstrains posted:

My secret? Well, not really a secret but I took 4 wood screws and inserted into the base holes. Give them a couple of  turns until they grab the top of your layout.  Now start backing off on the screws and playing around until find the optimal setting so to speak. It's all trial and error so give it a shot. This worked well for me.

My 362 has worked perfectly for years.

And as noted above, variable voltage is key. Again, trial and error.

 

 

OK, I'll try these methods and see. I know the old directions say not to screw it down, but what you are suggesting is not screwing it down tight. Time will tell. Thanks to all.

The barrel loader runs on half wave dc.  This to reduce the vibrations in half from 120 per second to 60 per second.  If you are getting to much vibration checking the rectifier is one thing to look at. 

Jeff B. Haertlein posted:

johnstrains posted:

My secret? Well, not really a secret but I took 4 wood screws and inserted into the base holes. Give them a couple of  turns until they grab the top of your layout.  Now start backing off on the screws and playing around until find the optimal setting so to speak. It's all trial and error so give it a shot. This worked well for me.

My 362 has worked perfectly for years.

And as noted above, variable voltage is key. Again, trial and error.

 

 

OK, I'll try these methods and see. I know the old directions say not to screw it down, but what you are suggesting is not screwing it down tight. Time will tell. Thanks to all.

Exactly. Not tight. I'd say my screws are at most a turn or two into the wood of my layout top.

David Johnston posted:

The barrel loader runs on half wave dc.  This to reduce the vibrations in half from 120 per second to 60 per second.  If you are getting to much vibration checking the rectifier is one thing to look at. 

Oh, OK....but what do I actually look for? How do I know it is faulty? Or just assume it is because it is vibrating too much? Since this unit is from 1952, maybe it is bad. And are these available??

Just put a diode in the power circuit to the ramp.  If the ramp will not work, your diode is in backward and the one in the ramp is working.  If the ramp still vibrates without any change, you got the diode in the right direction and the one in the ramp is good.  It the vibration slows down, the rectifier in the ramp is bad and the one you put in the circuit is working as a replacement.