Powering steam locomotive upside down?

I'm going to say should be OK.

I tune mine upside down to check things out and never had a problem, just have not run it, other then by hand.

But wait until someone else checks in.

Locomotives with a wireless tether run fine without the tender, they don't even know it's gone.

Thank you, John!

I was worried about damaging the loco if it did not have its tender.

You stipulated 'wireless tether' as indeed is the case here. What about locos with wired or PCB type tethers? Should those be attached before applying power to run the loco upside down?

THX!

Alex

Well, I've run many Lionel wired models in the same fashion without any issues.  I'm sure there are exceptions to every rule.  If the locomotive had the TMCC module and the tender has the railSounds module as is common, the tender is "read only", and doesn't send anything back to the locomotive.

I'm virtually certain you won't damage anything by running it without the tender, I suppose it's possible it won't run correctly.  If it would damage it without the tender connected, that would be a bummer when the tether comes loose, right?

Alex, Why not remove the shell and rotate the motor flywheel by hand as you do your measurements?  Much better at finding the high or low spot, especially while using a dial indicator.  G

Not really a good practice to run highly detailed steam locomotive models up-side-down. Why? Because some of the valve gear components MAY not be designed to perform properly when up-side-down (gravity, you know).

When I have to run one of mine, I prop it up on wood blocks (I'm not about to spend the money for those powered roller stands), and just use small clip end jumpers to the pick-up rollers & rails.

I personally use the roller Jax blocks, they were a great investment and makes it easy to run stuff on the bench for maintenance.  I've never run into issues running them upside down, assuming you properly support them and don't interfere with the moving parts.   I agree it's easier to run them right side up, that's my normal method.

Yep - the valve gear of my Lionel Mikado disengaged when I ran it upside down.  Fortunately I was able to coax it back in, but it wasn't easy.

Although this doesn't apply to the locomotive in question here, don't forget that mechanical e-units don't like operating upside down. 

Well, they just don't cycle, but if you have it running in the direction you want...

FWIW, I put my Lionel Mikado on my cradle and ran it, nothing came apart.  What disengaged on yours?

In technical terms, one of the little pinny things that goes in the body holey thing.

(The valve stem, I think.  It fell out of the valve chest, since of course it's not attached to anything in there). 

Must be technical terms, I don't understand.

I never had a problem running a steam engine upside down in a foam craddle using aligator clips to a roller and to the frame.

But that not saying something could not  go wrong s on certain engines,

A heads up.

On MTH Pacific locomotives. the driver linkage will get bound up  and break if you run upside down.   This is on Premier locomotives.  I have not run into any others that this is an issue. 

If you were planning on attaching the indicator to the body, why not just do it on the track and run it slowly while observing the runout.  No idea what you have to clamp the dial but it would seem that the loco's weight should be on the questionable wheels when testing.  May have to remove the shell to get a position to clamp the dial.  

Or, if in doubt, just replace it.  May be easier than the test.

Good information, I think I'll stick to running them on my test blocks.

One reason I run them upside down is to clean the wheels, it makes it go much faster if you can just have the wheel spinning and hold the rag with alcohol against it as it turns.   I guess I can still run diesels that way...

John, I do the same.  The Pacific will get in your wallet if done. 

I have the Premier PRR K-4, I'll have to take a close look and see if there's any problem with it upside down.  I don't recall running it that way yet...

John, had problems with two P-47 locomotives.  I also have the K-4 and without looking at it, I  would guess the same valve gear is used. 

I figured the K-4 would be similar, I'll have to look at it and figure out why that happens.  You'd think that bouncing around on a layout that something like that could happen right side up.   I hope that's not the case.

I think it happens when there is too much slop at the joints of the valve gear that allows it drop past 180 degrees at the "knee". If the linkage was tight it should not be able to straighten to 180 degrees. That said I have successfully run a couple of 3rd Rail and MTH engines upside-down with no problem but can see how it could be on some engines. Safest way to check the drive train would be to remove the shell so you run it right side up.

Pete

guess people should think twice before putting bullfrog snot on their engines.

Very good point!

That stuff is not a good idea.  Replace a tire with a tire.

just to be clear I have not put power or bullfrog snot on any of my engines.  I have had them upside down to work on them and moved the steam gear set to lube the moving parts. 

hope my comments would help me and others understand.