PW F3 motors

My quick review of service documents do not mention it, but they do state that the starting voltage of each motor should be within one volt of each other.

Personally, I've always replaced them in pairs because I've always acquired them in pairs.

There are about four variations of the horizontal motors.  They are matched in a unit in as much as the same variation.  The motors can be replaced individually as long as they are the same variation.

Lionel part # 2343-100. As long as its that variation replacing just one would be ok then? Rob

Why does it need to be replaced? These are very rebuildable motors. Sometimes a good thorough cleaning, and a fresh set of brushes ( the good ones) and these motors run like new...all the gears are available from most of the parts guys.......Pat

Johnsgg1 posted:

There are about four variations of the horizontal motors.  They are matched in a unit in as much as the same variation.  The motors can be replaced individually as long as they are the same variation.

Interesting.  Can you elaborate on the characteristics of the variations ?

The ones I know of are the two different brush plate styles - early 2333 and later for both 2333 and 2343, etc.

 

 

Then, there was the 2353 style which had plastic gears in the vertical gear column as opposed to the metal gears of the 2333 and 2343. This change was made to reduce noise, an attempt which was only slightly successful.

I haven't heard about any other variations. I'd like to hear more about any others. 

As John said, I haven't seen any engines that had motors of different types mixed in the same engine as originally produced in the factory. But, I'm sure some were repaired back in the day with little consideration of motor types - just so long as the engine ran. 

Jim

The windings are broken in numerous places and the gears are sparking, plus the bearings are shot. A new armature,gears,bearings would fix it but dont have the proper tools to pull the gears. Anyone here that can do a rebuild? thanks Rob

Pat..I didnt realize there were "good" & bad brushes. Whats the difference and how do you tell them apart? Also can anyone recommend a repairman for the repair job or would it be better just to get a replacement. There one on the bay thats E+ for $40. Received this set#2161W for xmas in '51. Hard to say how many hours it has on it. Its just wore out i quess. thanks Rob

With that many problems with the motor, I would just replace it (them).  You don’t need any special tools (except for the bearings) to replace the parts but, all of those parts may add up to more than the cost of the motor.

Estimated cost to rebuild motor $140! Plus ship/handling. Replace it with another L/N motor $44 or 2 motors $66. Gonna be frugal and save $100. Gonna take a chance and see if only one will work with the one I have.  Im  gonna guess that these motors were held to some kind of close tolerance in '52.  Be hard to believe that a line worker in a lionel factory would sort thru a bin of thousands of motors, and test each one to find 2 with the exact starting voltage.  Just a guess.  Mite bite me in the arse.  Will post the results.  Thanks fellers for all the advice.   Happy thanksgiving to each & all.   Rob

Rob, sorry I missed your reply the other day....some of the replacement brushes are so soft, they wear out so fast, you wind up changing brushes a lot quicker. A good parts guy can tell you better on that .....I wouldn’t beat yourself up too hard trying to make a perfect matched pair, as long as they’re reasonably close, she’s gonna take off just fine....sounds like you found a descent deal. That might be the best route to go as far as cost is concerned. While you have the motors out, remove the truck, remove the brass retaining plate, and clean and lubricate the worm shaft, inspect the bearing boxes looking for any galling on the bb inside the box,  and inspect the spur gear down there....pay very close attention to the bearing box on the worm shaft if you decide to remove it. Those bronze boxes with a bb inside them are offset ......it’s crucial they go back just the way you see them in there before or if you take them out. ...........Pat