Question about MTH remote with TIU

Mike, I have a Z500 brick powering my TIU. My Z4000 runs through that. I do not have any Proto Three engines but I have numerous Proto twos that run with the handheld. Also through the TIU I can run conventional engines as well. I have never heard of using a wall wart to power a TIU. I just got an extra Z500 from Trainworld.................Paul

To run a DCS loco, simply plug the Z500 into the FIXED 1 port, up the voltage to about 18, and it will work.  To run conventional, NOT using the remote, simply place loco on tracks and control speed from transformer.  To run conventional using the remote, use VARIABLE 1 or 2, but, you must then provide power for the TIU's internal circuitry by using a 12-18 volt wall wart with at least 500 milliamp (1/2 amp) capacity plugged into the AUX port.  If you use a VARIABLE, when you want to run DCS, using the remote scroll the voltage up to 18 and apply full power from the Z500.

And be sure to teach newbaby about the E-stop button.

You can also use the single supply and just parallel the FIXED #1 input and the VARIABLE #1 input to have variable voltage without a second transformer.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

You can also use the single supply and just parallel the FIXED #1 input and the VARIABLE #1 input to have variable voltage without a second transformer.

Yep, I believe that's the only way with what you have. 

You didn't mention a controller that  goes along  with the brick.

You don't want the controller in this picture anyway.

That transformer will not be very effective at running trains and TIU unless very small layout and single train.  It is only 50Watts.  It would be ideal for powering TIU via Aux power port, but then use a larger transformer like Z-1000 brick or Lionel Power House 180W to power a TIU input.  You could even let the brick power 2 inputs with jumper wire between the 2 inputs chosen.   G

The following from The DCS Companion 3rd Edition, page 95, may provide a bit of "illumination" regarding this issue:

1. External TIU Power 

Providing Power to the TIU 

Like any other electronic component, the TIU requires a power source. MTH designed the TIU so that it can be powered in two different ways. 

One way is to use the track power that is present at the inputs to TIU Fixed Channel #1. This power source is available whenever the O gauge operator is running trains on tracks connected to Fixed Channel #1. 

Another way to power the TIU is to use a separate power supply that is plugged into the TIU's Aux. Power port. In this case, the TIU would have power all the time. Any power supply that provides between 12 and 22 volts AC or DC at 1.5 amps or greater, equipped with a compatible barrel plug, may be used. 

If the TIU is a Rev. L (or later) that has a USB port, the TIU may alternately be powered via the USB port. However, this should only be done when using the TIU solely to update TIU or DCS Remote software. In order to perform DCS engine sound file transfers, DCS Remote backup or recovery, DCS engine operation, or activation of switch tracks or accessories connected to a TIU's AIUs, power must come from either the Aux. Power port or Fixed Channel #1 Input. 

When the TIU is powered through Fixed Channel #1 Input, every time the power to the tracks controlled by Fixed Channel #1 is interrupted for any reason, the TIU turns itself off. However, when the TIU is powered through the Aux. Power port, the TIU remains turned on regardless of the state of power applied to the tracks controlled by Fixed Channel #1. 

This and a whole lot more is all in “The DCS Companion 3rd Edition", available for purchase  from many fine OGR advertisers and forum sponsors, or as an eBook or a printed book at OGR’s web store!

Wyatt's Dad,

   I always recommend using the Aux port and powering with a 18/24 RS power supply, works perfectly and opens up the #1 Channel for running more trains, along with providing great full E-Stop control.

PCRR/Dave

John, I agree about the controller when powering a variable, but don't think it makes any difference on a fixed.

Dave,

 I don't understand how aux power frees up fixed one. Can't you still run trains on that channel without aux power?

John H posted:

Dave,

 I don't understand how aux power frees up fixed one. Can't you still run trains on that channel without aux power?

Sure you can. 

  We sometimes get confused when we refer to different tiu channels as track 1 ,track 2 etc.

Thank you everyone, so much for the help!

from what it sounds like, I can use my z500 wall wart. The z500 that I have came with a set from the other remote found in ready to run sets, so I don't own a transformer type controller. I had watched a YouTube video where the guy had a z4000 hooked up to his TIU so he could run conventional but he had it on full power so I don't  understand what the difference was between leaving a z4000 on full power and just using a wall wart? So for the future can I get away with a z1000 wall wart without the controller if I want to run anothe train and also run a conventional train? 

But seriously thank you all so much for the info. I probably wouldn't have gotten this interested in this hobby without you all. 

Thanks again, 

Mike

Using the Aux. Power port isn't about "freeing up Fixed #1", rather, it's about ensuring that each channel is independently operational.

Hi Barry, does that make sense what I was asking? About just buying a z1000 wall wart in the future and that should give me the capability to run another train and then still being able to run a conventional train just using the remote and TIU?

I suggest that you learn more about DCS before you ask broad questions that require detail answers.

I think this is how I am learning By asking certain questions. I'll figure it out thanks.

Mike, let me explain.  The TIU has 4 circuits for powering tracks, 2 fixed, two variable.  They take the power coming in, apply a DCS signal, and send the power & signal out to the locos.  The variables have the added ability to vary the voltage of their outputs.  But, the TIU also needs power for its internal circuitry.  There are 2 possible sources: the TIU is internally wired so that it gets its internal power from fixed 1, but if you put a plug into AUX from another source, the TIU automatically switches over to get its power there.  Using AUX, the TIU remains on and operational regardless of whether power is being applied to fixed 1.  The power being fed into AUX only runs the TIU's internal circuits; it does not reach trains

There are many advantages of using the AUX port.  For example, if you're not using AUX and are using separate power sources for the 4 TIU channels, and the breaker opens on the source for fixed 1, the TIU will go dead and you'll lose control of the trains running on the other 3 channels.

If you are going to run 1 train at a time, the Z500 should be adequate.  After all, that's what MTH provides in its ready-to-runs sets, including those with 2-motored Imperial diesels (I bought one for a pair of my grandchildren.)  A string of lighted cars might push it past its limit.

As far as I am concerned, I have no problem with you asking detailed questions.  I know of no other way to learn.

I recommend getting a wall wart for AUX in any event. This leaves the Z500 brick available for other uses, like powering a single TIU channel.   Before spending the money for a Z1000, I'd consider other options also, such as a Lionel 180-watt Powerhouse which sells in roughly the same dollar ballpark.  That will run quite a few locos.

Thank you so much RJR.

this clears it up for me completely. I appreciate you taking your time to explain this to me. Everyone is new to something at some point and it definitely helps having someone to ask questions, and to feel comfortable asking questions. To me there aren't any dumb questions. 

i guess if I was Pimping books on here, I wouldn't want to give too much info either. ;D 

Wyatt Dad,

   I have been talking with Barry for many many years and he has helped more people than you can possibly imagine, your comment about pimping books was more than foolish, what Barry is advising is that you need to educate yourself more on the DCS, then come back when you can understand the engineering answers, to your questions a might better.  In your case I would recommend the OGR Video Guide to DCS, it gives you a visual education on starting out with DCS.  If anybody is pimping Barry's Book it's me, and I have never met Barry person to person, even after all these years.  What you did was just alienate one of the most knowledgable engineering sources on the OGR.  Barry has never limited his knowledge to anyone on the OGR, he does however expect everyone to educate them selves a little, before asking a lot of questions.  

PCRR/Dave 

What Dave said.

Oh come on, it's a little funny? Haha 

Wyatts dad posted:

Oh come on, it's a little funny? Haha 

Nope! Sorry,,,,,,NOT funny.

Wyatts dad posted:

Oh come on, it's a little funny? Haha 

They have no sense of humor Mike.   I don't know why people feel the need to abuse someone for asking a question...

Lol evidently not!

You should be able to ask any DCS question you want...Don't forget, Barry would not have a book  if it weren't for questions.  Yes he's done an amazing job on it but...      looks like RJR has you fixed up. Great.

Gentlemen,

   If Wyatt's Dad meant this insult in jest, and was just messing around so be it, however it's very hard to tell with just the written word most times.  Yes and we do and can ask most any question we like here on the OGR, however you must know the basics of DCS to understand the answers being given, and Barry made that clear in his post.  I do a lot of kidding here on the OGR, but I try very hard to make sure it is not perceived to be an attack on another individual, especially on part of that persons profession. There are lot of people now in our country that hate other people, just because they are making a good living.  Maybe I missed the humor in his post because I have received similar insults down thru the years myself.  As far a I am concerned you can not pimp good Engineering, especially good technical writing, it's a God given talent, and personally I hope Barry makes a fortune with his technical writing talents.

PCRR/Dave  

Dave,

  You have to remember that talking behind this screen is like bleachers: it makes people say things that they would never say face to face.

Dave & John H.,

For the record, I never saw the "pimp" comment. It must have been deleted at some point. Regardless, while I very much appreciate the support. let's just let it go.

Thanks very much!

It really was meant as joke and I am very sorry if I offended Barry or anyone else. my sense of humor can get carried away sometimes.. Just ask my wife!

again, sorry all!