Anyone have this set that can provide any info on it? i.e. Does it run well? How's the crew talk / sounds? How's the cruise control? Does it smoke well?
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I have the set. It's a very detailed set. The hopper cars are fully diecast and are great. Lots of details on the gp30. For tmcc and railsounds 5 it's very nicely done. When I saw the new prr gp30 legacy in the catalog last year, I was not even interested. I am totally happy with the tmcc version. I never used the smoke so I can't comment on that. I got the 4 extra hoppers when the set came out and the engine does struggle to pull all 8 hoppers. I also got the dummy unit as well. It makes a beautiful train. Sounds are good. One of my favorite sets. Odyssey is good. No stutter.
@Joe Fermani posted:I have the set. It's a very detailed set. The hopper cars are fully diecast and are great. Lots of details on the gp30. For tmcc and railsounds 5 it's very nicely done. When I saw the new prr gp30 legacy in the catalog last year, I was not even interested. I am totally happy with the tmcc version. I never used the smoke so I can't comment on that. I got the 4 extra hoppers when the set came out and the engine does struggle to pull all 8 hoppers. I also got the dummy unit as well. It makes a beautiful train. Sounds are good. One of my favorite sets. Odyssey is good. No stutter.
Thanks @Joe Fermani appreciate the detailed response.
You mentioned the engine has trouble with the 8 hoppers, is that because they are diecast and heavy? Have you tried to pull other frieght and does it struggle with that at all?
Joe, do you have grades on your layout? I'm a little surprised that eight cars would be a challenge on level track, even the heavier diecast cars.
My layout does not have any grades. With all 8 hoppers, the wheels can spin when starting. You have to start slow to get it moving. It's just due to the weight of all 8 cars. I have not replaced the traction tires so it could be the tires are dried out. When I only have the original 4 cars, the wheels do not slip.
Except for empty flat cars, etc., I'm not really a fan of die-cast freight cars. Based on lionelsupport.com, the GP30 set loco has the same drivetrain as every other Legacy 4-axle diesel. So I'm suprised that pulling power wouldn't be better. I do love the idea that Lionel has started to package some high-end sets with a prototypically plausible consist.
When I added a second motor to my Lionel Phantom engine, it had no problem pulling a dozen diecast hoppers around Harry's layout, including the 2+% grades. Since it has no traction tires and I was running on Atlas track it also didn't have any magnitraction.
Something is seriously wrong if a diesel with two sets of traction tires and all wheels powered can't pull 8 diecast cars on level track!
One locomotive and 54 tank cars including 2.5% grade, doesn't miss a beat.
@gunrunnerjohn posted:One locomotive and 54 tank cars including 2.5% grade, doesn't miss a beat.
That is impressive!
I agree, I never thought there'd be an issue with pulling power of the engine in the set, I figured the complaint would be about the TMCC odyssey.
Everyone, thanks for the help on this set!
Art, you raise an interesting question about what's really under the hood of that loco.
https://www.lionelsupport.com/...CC-GP30-2204-6-28869
The set was apparently catalogued in 2006. The photo on lionelsupport shows a Liondrive-like setup with a plastic reluctor ring driving the tach sensor. the feature list states TMCC with Odyssey, rather than Legacy. I guess this was among the last diesels made before the transition to full Legacy.
Not too long before this, Lionel was selling GP30s with only ONE powered axle (probably a desperate attempt to reduce lash in the drivetrain, to tame the infamous Odyssey Lurch!) With half of the loco's weight resting on unpowered axles, that would explain a lack of pulling power.
So what's under the hood of this train? Does it match the link above from Lionel support? Or is it a mid-2000s one-axle wonder?
I don't have the set out at the moment. I will grab the engine and recheck what it has. The engine did pull all 8 cars but I do remember getting some wheel slip. If I remember correctly, only one axle is powered on each truck.
I've never seen the Liondrive twist-off trucks with only one axle driven, I'd be pretty surprised if this doesn't have all the wheels driven. I have a number of diesels equipped with Liondrive, both TMCC and Legacy, all have all wheels driven.
I confirmed, it's a single axle drive.
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If the new legacy models have all axles driven, I wonder if I can swap out the trucks for better pulling power.
@Joe Fermani posted:If the new legacy models have all axles driven, I wonder if I can swap out the trucks for better pulling power.
What I find interesting is that the Lionel website lists that the locomotive has both Traction Tires and Magne-Traction.
I'm somewhat amazed they went with single axle drive. I can only assume that the Magnetraction provisions caused them to make that bad decision. That's the first time I've seen a Liondrive truck with only one axle driven.
There was a big bru ha ha on this forum regarding that single axle drive when it came out.
@gunrunnerjohn posted:I'm somewhat amazed they went with single axle drive. I can only assume that the Magnetraction provisions caused them to make that bad decision. That's the first time I've seen a Liondrive truck with only one axle driven.
John I'm not sure the loco HAS Magne-Traction, I think that might be a typo in the features list.
When Lionel first developed Odyssey circa Y2K, either the PID parameters weren't dialed in, or the hardware couldn't sense and react fast enough. Some locos started out with a pronouced "lurch", and suffered from surgy operation in the first few speed steps.
Lionel went on a witch hunt, some of the blame was attributed to lash in the drivetrain. So they eliminated some gears from the power trucks, leaving only one powered axle. YES there were complaints! The real answer came with a better tach sensor design. Also, back-drivable gears whereby the two powered trucks can help each other, and the whole mass of the loco and train add predictable inertia and momentum.
@prrhorseshoecurve posted:There was a big bru ha ha on this forum regarding that single axle drive when it came out.
I think that was shortly before I joined here, but it's sure a stupid idea!
With only single axle drive with tires, would an undriven axle get magnetraction?
Had that set with the full set of hoppers and the dummy. No problem with pulling on a 3% grade.
An interesting twist in the GP30 choices in that catalog included another GP30 Chessie freight set. That had 4 axle gearing, while the rest has two axle gearing. Unfortunately, the different gearing meant they do not play nice in an MU. I upgraded the CSX and the Chessie from that catalog to Cruise M so I could use the nudge feature to get them to lash up.
The pic’s below is the CSX version, like the PRR. The other is the Chessie with additional gearing out of the same 2006 catalog. I have a thing for the TMCC GP30 models.
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@Mark V. Spadaro posted:With only single axle drive with tires, would an undriven axle get magnetraction?
Well, that's an interesting point, that would not be all that useful, would it? 
Truthfully, I never saw that setup, so I can't really say what it has.
@jstraw124 posted:Had that set with the full set of hoppers and the dummy. No problem with pulling on a 3% grade.
An interesting twist in the GP30 choices in that catalog included another GP30 Chessie freight set. That had 4 axle gearing, while the rest has two axle gearing. Unfortunately, the different gearing meant they do not play nice in an MU. I upgraded the CSX and the Chessie from that catalog to Cruise M so I could use the nudge feature to get them to lash up.
The pic’s below is the CSX version, like the PRR. The other is the Chessie with additional gearing out of the same 2006 catalog. I have a thing for the TMCC GP30 models.
I still can't imagine what drove Lionel to create some substandard engines for no apparent reason. I can't have saved enough cost to omit a couple of gears in the trucks!
I also don't understand why they'd have different gear ratios, the 2-wheel drive models appear to have the same size gears, just no drive to the second wheelset.
