Re: Layout design help

Ron,

I took a stab at it.  An O72 and O63 folded dogbone will not fit in the space.  The O72 outer loop takes the full 13 feet when you allow for clearances.  I first moved the O72 track to be around the layout (or walls as you didn't provide any info on the room).  The O63 does fit, but since the O72 goes around the layout, I move the O63 to parallel it.  I then built the inside track to match the original plan as best I could.

An advantage of this design is that you can run three trains at once, two on the mainlines and one working the inside.

I used Ros switches through out as Gargraves doses not make an O63 switch.  The out loop and upper yard is all O72 curves and switches; everything else is O63/O64.

The rise is 7" or about 5%.  A bit steep, but you can lower it to 6" which will make it about 4%.

Any idea where the tunnel goes in the upper right-hand corner of the plan?

Jan

Hello Jan,

This is AWESOME. I appreciate your help very much. One revision request - can you please see my notes above?

I still need two main lines but...

Basically, I would like to do a "simplified" version of the CTT layout - no outer loop (upper loop) & spurs needed. I DO like the inner-most curve (connecting one side of the layout to the outer) & still need logical spurs (separate from each other), one for a grain elevator & the other for the gantry crane. The latter crane isn't total appropriate for a midwest scene but I love it! I also still want the Ross #175 cross-over switch set probably in the middle table (between the loops).

Maybe, a lift-section bridge & ideally the operator would sit close to the action in the center. Can you help with that?

Wow, very cool - this is a great start! THANKS!

I really want to run at least my "big" trains like the mighty "Little Joe" on the outer loop......

I've made several versions as I didn't completely understand your comments.

Version 2

Version 3

Version 4

I added a couple of sidings as examples of what you can do.

Jan

Thank you Jan! AWESOME. Yes, the above ideas are what I am thinking of. Please let me think more about where I want to put the sidings. The sidings are really the only variable. EVERYTHING else looks wonderful. WOW.

Should I reply here after I work on the layout revisions (for the spurs)?

Warm regards,

Ron W.

Keep this thread going. 

I find that readers enjoy these threads and will make comments and make valuable additions to the design.  The design  process helps others will learn and improve their layouts.

Jan

Ron,

Here's another variation that adds an additional reverse loop'  The issue with this variation is that the gap left for the entryway is now only 9" (and that is being generous).  By reducing the curves in these loops to O54 will increase the opening to a tight 18". which I would consider the absolute minimum.  The other option is to find an extra foot of space for the layout.

Jan

In the last image you could swap the lift out from left to right side and have access to the center.

I didn't see that option.  Good catch!  The opening would be at least 18" and the passage would be short.

Jan

For viewing purposes move the crossover to the left side on the longer run.

I would remove the crossover and put two offsetting switches, one on each end so you can get in and out of the yard on onto the other loop.  So traveling counter clockwise to move from the outer loop to the inner loop before the yard.  Then you back out of the yard and still travel counter clock wise there is a quick way to get to the outer loop.  This helps as if you have a clockwise passenger train parked at the station you can get the freight into the yard.

Thank you again everyone for your help. OK, a few (maybe dumb) questions, I am still learning.

How would I know the "actual" sizes of the bench work for each section of the layout? I like the idea of swapping the lift out section to the right side. Can you please do that?

For my left side (where the lift section was originally) could I add a grade/bridge? I am thinking this is the side that will face the wall.

A little sentimental thing, I will incorporate my Dad's/our family original floor layout from the 1950s (and my first one) in this layout.

Finding this train "board" with a basic layout and my Dad's trusty 2328 Lionel Burlington GP-7 engine & cars got me started on trains in my youth.

I also will use most of the original layout (wood) that my grandfather & I used for my childhood 4' x 8' train table in this build. Sadly, both of these men are now gone but nice memories will be there with us.

This is me (my personal historian/author website, not train-related, but at least you know who I am - LOL.)

www.RonWerneth.com

Thanks so much & Happy Holidays,

Ron W.

Any chance you have the space to do O-80 outer and O-72 inner?  Trust me, you'll be happier knowing your big train can go anywhere on your layout.  

Have Fun!

Ron

Ron,

There are a few questions that need to be answered.

1. What is the room size and where the layout will be located?  What portion will be against a wall; what portion can be reached from the outside?
2. Are there any obstructions like doors, windows, stairs, furnace, etc. that will need access?
3. Most people are limited to a reach of 36" without have to resort to climbing onto the layout or using access hatches.
4. Table height especially with children and operating accessories will be involved.
5. ...

I made some of the proposed modifications.  I moved the double crossover to the left side which will give you a 20" opening.  If the edge of the layout is up against a wall, it is a 4' reach to the switch from the viewing area.  Switches can be troublesome.

I also added a crossover as suggested by Edmund.  It would allow a train to quickly enter or leave the yard.  Another could be placed somewhere else on the loops.  If that area is where the liftout would go, crossovers at the top and bottom would work.

The ideal location for the grade on the outer loop would be on the left side.  The double crossover would have to be moved or replaced with single crossovers as above.  We could achieve 3.5" at the midpoint with a 3% grade.

Jan

P.S.  We can also flip the layout about either axis.

Hello Jan,

I appreciate your reply. I will be working with an essentially "empty" former basement room with no major obstructions (at all). Very open space.

Please let me "think more" what I want this layout to be & will get back to you. I do have a 10-year old daughter that will probably be helping me as well.

Happy Holidays!

Ron W.

Hello Jan,

I am back. Dumb question, how would I know the "size" of each "area" (i.e. table dimensions) that the track goes around?

I am trying to understand the actual space I will have to better understand what scenery/buildings/etc. I could use.

Thanks again!

Ron W.

A full circle of O-72 will need 6' x 6'.  72 inches is 6 feet.  See the relationship?

O-63, just over 5',  O-54, 4.5' and so on.

You should really try SCARM or one of the other layout planning software systems.  The more you play with it the easier it gets.  SCARM even has You Tube tutorials.

You will find yourself trying various options to maximize your layout space.

Have Fun!

Ron

Thank you Ron. However, I understand the overall "circle" size of an 0-72 but trying to "visualize" the actual "size" of each table along with the "empty" space between the two larger tables. Make sense?

I don't expect to have the actual space ready until early summer (being remodeled soon) so this is a first start....

Regards,

Ron W.

Ron,

I don't think I posted this variation which I think might meet your needs and maximize usable open space for scenery or standing room.

Jan

Here's and update version.

You have a 5 ft x 8 ft oval in the lower half and a 4 ft circle plus some to the side in the upper half.  All areas are reachable from the sides and/or the lower open space.

I show a lift out double track bridge at the bottom for access to the interior.  Notice that I moved the crossovers to the sides.

Jan

.

MRFan posted:

Thank you Ron. However, I understand the overall "circle" size of an 0-72 but trying to "visualize" the actual "size" of each table along with the "empty" space between the two larger tables. Make sense?

I don't expect to have the actual space ready until early summer (being remodeled soon) so this is a first start....

Regards,

Ron W.

 

 

Hi Ron,

Maybe this will help - 4 circles of O72 on top of the CTT plan that is 12' x 13'. You can see that another 4' in length would provide the people space to walk between the circles in the center - so an area of 12' x 17' would place 4' between the ends - 

Ron,

Two other shapes are possible - one would be a long rounded end table - 6'-8' wide by 12'-18' long floating in the room(area) as a walk-around.(like a billiards table)

Another is to have a dog-bone or big table with a narrow table along the wall and then a big table at the other end. (can be though a corner or bend)

How you want to use the space and have the trains interact with the people and the space help determine the shape. 

Mechanicals, stairs and such obstacles always make the planning interesting.

These last few designs are not good for the yard.     If you are switching - classifying or making up a train in the yard, there is not  yard lead, you have to work off the inner main.     Adding a yard lead as long as the longest siding would make it possible ot work the yard and keep both mains open.

Thank you everyone for your help. I (think) it would be prudent for me to remeasure & carefully think about this space. Right now it is our laundry room! My current train room is smaller but has finished walls/floor & good lightning. It will become a guest bedroom & I will remodel the larger laundry room into my train room.

My focus will be a very detailed layout with easy operations & continuous movement VS point to point or switching. It will be a midwest theme (1960s).

Thanks!

Ron W.